Womens toilet with cubicles in the workplace

[Foodylicious]

What should the position be here from the employer/organisation perspective, regarding a transwomen intermittently using these, as opposed to the single enclosed toilet (think typical disabled facility available in a supermarket/cafe) they use most of thw time, that is on the same floor/in close proximity.
Edited to add: This is UK, England.

@NumbersGuy I don’t want men in women’s single sex spaces.

the law says they aren’t allowed

why shouldn’t men be expected to obey the law?

Great thanks for that, you take any risks you want - surprised you’re so blasé about your granddaughters safety though, have you seen any data around sexual assaults in mixed sex spaces?

Also quite arrogant to think you can speak for all women too.
I don’t want men sharing my toilets thanks (and I know it’s not all men, I have a DH, brothers etc who are “good men”)

My friend who had a man exposing himself to her in the ladies was one of the first people I know to get the problem around this - when it happened to her the man was dealt with by staff, police called etc. These days he could have uttered the magic words “I’m a lady” and it’s my friend would have been accused of a hate crime!

Those four people were incredibly brave. When you see how women who complain are treated I’m amazed four people were able to lodge formal complaints at all. They must be very strong people and not afraid of the backlash and collateral damage. I can only hope I would be that courageous.

Try support all men being able to access mens services.

The unwillingness of men and TRA allies to champion these trans iding men being safe in mens services is proof of the lipservice given when real change is needed.

Yes, I always remember how quick and efficient the response was when a man assaulted a colleague in the loos way back in the 20th century. Because he was in a place he had no right to enter.

Nowadays he could have claimed 'womanhood' to enable him to keep pursuing his hobby.

Agreed! Courageous, and I imagine, persistent. I have no doubt they were at the very least discouraged from going through the whole process.

Why is the trans identifying individual using the disabled toilet? Are they disabled?

Who the fuck washes menstrual blood from their hands at a set of shared sinks?
I have NEVER seen this and frankly that's unhygienic as fuck and I would not be pleased if I saw that. I use a menstrual cup and if it gets messy, I use toilet paper to wipe off my hands as much as possible so it's barely visible before I go out to wash my hands. Like a normal person.

It's genuinely funny as hell that this is brought up as a talking point as though it's commonplace for women to be rinsing bloody hands and their blood-soaked clothes in shared sinks in a toilet.

Ironically, I wonder how much transphobia would be revealed if non-trans male TRAs were forced to explain this unwillingness, as in, "I don't want those weirdos in my spaces!"

Guess you don’t flood

I have had to wash my knickers and trousers and dry them under the hand dryer before - because the meeting went on for 2 hrs before a break

When I was perimenopausal I regularly had flooding so bad I had to drive sitting on a plastic bag.

youre damn right I rinsed my clothes in the sink.

I had spare clothes in the boot of my car but you’re damn right I needed to wipe myself off (cheeky wipes - wet them under the tap) and rinse out my clothes and the used wipe in the sink.

and no. Being peri I couldn’t predict when my period was going to start.

Hospitals? who had a written policy which staff were obliged to follow the rule that males who opt to use female spaces should be documented as being female.

Woman objected to woman in woman only space.....

Or that hospitals management were unable to make it clear that ignoring a specific request for sex based care is assault. Fife ED managers wanted their long time staff member jailed for asking for privacy a member of the public objecting to the male doctor would not have had a chance...

Ah, you too are doing it, using the sociopathic argument of, "Let's dismiss those few women as non-persons unworthy of being respected and cared for." Why do you do that?

Men who identify as women know they are men. Why don’t they just use the men’s? They are no more at risk in the men’s toilets than other men. Why would you want to go somewhere you are not welcome? Women self exclude so won’t they if that want emulate women?

The lack of formal complaints from hospitalised women doesn't really serve as justification to remove single sex wards.
Do you have data on the number of complaints made by transwomen who have been assaulted by men on male wards, so we can get an all round picture of the risk?

I have news for you. People wash SHIT off their hands in those sinks.

and I have washed blood out of my shorts and dried them with the drier because I flooded all over them.

Well said.
I also abhor the word hysteria.

So speaks a man who cannot understand women’s fear.

Thanks for showing us clearly you really don’t understand the power dynamics faced by women who fear the repercussions of signalling their lack of consent for male people being in female single sex provisions.

Your post is a great demonstration of the emotional manipulation tactics that have been used for anyone who is unfamiliar with it. Women shamed if they do complain, called names, suspended from their jobs, women shamed if they don’t.

And which sex has created this issue? Men.

Which sex did the investigation after creating the environment that suppressed women’s negative voices? Men.

Thank you for illustrating it so well though.

That's nice for you. It has nothing to do with what the OP asked though, or the actual law.

Dude. You understand that we KNOW about more than four complaints right? In Darlington alone 25 women complained. Really they should have picked a bigger number for their lie given it’s so easily disproved.

Slow hand clap for you.

I use toilet paper to wipe off my hands as much as possible so it's barely visible before I go out to wash my hands. Like a normal person.

You do wash your blood stained hands in the sink like any normal woman has had to do at some stage in her life.

No boy or man will ever have the same issue.

Now if you find that funny have a hard look at yourself as you are unhygienic as fuck too.

And yes girls and women whos collection method fails end up with blood on clothing.

I have asked this before - I do understand what is said re no biological men using female toilets.
However I do wonder how biological women identifying as men manage in the female toilet - especially if they’ve had any surgery- as I know some people do get challenged re their right in a specified sex toilet. Is it an issue?
I was interested in the dangers of gender neutral toilets - I tended to go down many, many stairs (though lift back up!) to access these in one place I worked, as they were the only toilets I could use that were consistently clean and usable - sad but true - tbh I preferred the full cubicle in general and wondered why they weren’t in all toilets - but hadn’t realised it had these issues.

To be fair, in a work environment, where it’s a known group of colleagues, with a boss who’d sack anyone who made trouble, one may feel it’s not such an issue there.
not that I would want men in the ladies loos at work for various reasons but it’s probably the one place I’d not feel unsafe with that situation. But we do need a hard clear line so best to have everything separate.

Fuck. I thought I was alone in having to drive sitting on a plastic bag due to menstrual flooding!

I genuinely don’t think some people understand what menstrual flooding really means. I remember a woman on an AIBU thread shaming women for post after post. Turns out her ‘heavy’ period was the equivalent of a light flow. It never stopped her shaming others discussing their flooding though. She too told us it was icky to read it all.

And yet, just reading others have similar experiences is comforting to know someone understands.

I think thick, goady men are best ignored.