Potential WI Schism

[Igneococcus]

I know there is WI thread but a cannae find it right now:
https://www.thetimes.com/article/c73091fd-d02e-4951-8866-3add883013cf?shareToken=8cfa38d472492bacc9f602cc068c4536

Really? Every time a meet a woman I comment on her being a woman and expect her to comment on my womanliness too. How on earth will we be secure and happy knowing we are women if it is never mentioned?

Oh no, hang on that doesn't happen and the only reason anyone would ever tell a TiM they are a woman is because they know they are actually a man.

I’d far rather attend a meeting with ‘cis men’ present while discussing vulcal cancers than a transwoman. I mean I’d rather it was just women, but if men were going to be present I know which I’d prefer to be there.

https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/21276923.suffolk-retiree-becomes-first-trans-woman-appear-cover-wi-magazine/
Published: 1st July 2021

After seeing Loraine, who she describes as her "rock", as president of the Elmsett and Aldham WI, which closed in 2019, Ms Wenham said she was inspired to seek out her own "vibrant" chapter.

I think this passed me by back them - but I've bolded the important bit. Do branches close frequently?

Oh god, if I see this smug cheeky peeking face one more bloody time... 😡

A pertinent post on that thread from @nilsmousehammer · 05/06/2023 11:12

"Its the story too of many lesbians groups and specific women's health/chronic illness support groups. They have been forced to disband publicly and go under ground to avoid hostile takeover and invasion from entitled men. There's nothing progressive or 'kind' about it. It's targeted destruction.
I saw a twitter thread a few weeks back where a group had disbanded to end being harassed by men insisting on attending and instead begun to meet as friends at one of their houses. The men turned up on the drive, demanded admission, and called the police to have their 'rights' enforced when the women said no. Thankfully the police told them they had no right at all to enter a private home uninvited.
Women are being driven underground. The 'womens services' and groups left are increasingly male centred and largely about women willing to revolve around men and the service and head patting of men.
Fuck that. Women don't go to clubs and groups to nurse male egos".

Women are still having to fight that destructive male entitlement that sees women and women's organisations as theirs for the taking.
Yes the SC judgment is starting to erode that and judging by the comments under articles in The Times / Telegraph etc, men are now fully on board with challenging this.
But OMG, apart from the hilarity caused by Mr Moo's bingo card posts, it's enraging that these toxic men are still able to persuade the hard of thinking that it's their right to target and trash anything related to women and girls.

“Us” 😽🤭

That photo makes me laugh. I’m not sure if the image was supposed to be some idea from a Mills and Boon or more like a peeping Tom. I guess only the photographer knows!

Re do branches close frequently. It’s not uncommon, overall membership has been falling. Generally it’s through members being unwilling to be on the committee / serve as officers which mean they have to close. Even long standing groups can struggle to get new members and rely on a small number of members to do all the wotk to keep it going . One local to me was really wholly reliant on one person. And she finally had had enough and had other things to do, so it folded. Many groups have an aging membership which doesn’t help - and if the average age increases it gets harder to attract younger member.

Agreed. I'm always deeply suspicious of the true sex of posters who don't believe that the large majority of trans women present as very obviously male to the large majority of women.

Stealth/passing is virtually 100% a myth. For nearly all trans women going out in public means their 'secret' is repeatedly being revealed. Women have eyes, ears and brains.

'Genital inspections' are like pillow fights, men may find the idea arousing, but women think they're silly and pointless. Not remotely necessary. Won't ever happen.

Women can instead readily see the:

• male height, stance & gait
• broad shoulders & narrow hips
• very large ears, hands & feet
• thick neck & adam's apple
• jutting forehead, nose & chin
• bristle/shadow & male pattern baldness

If there is still any uncertainty, then a polite verbal challenge will be met by a trans woman's male aggression & anger, in a deep masculine voice. How dare a mere woman speak to me like this?

Angie Leach has just been on Shelagh Fogarty’s show, just after 14.00. Seemed to be a bit of damage limitation following the article in The Times, as she made a comment about how unfortunate it was that the transcript of her private Zoom meeting had been leaked. Yeah, what a pity the shameful attempts of the WI to circumvent the law are being publicised. Good hour, worth a listen on catch-up although the first caller after Angie was a bit eye-rolling.

These blokes always know to pose to conceal their Adam’s apple as much as possible, and their shovel like hands with pink painted nails. The 6ft bloke looking at make up next to me last week in Superdrug: his huge hands with painted nails were basically a siren.

A young teenage boy, presumably his son, followed him around the shop about 3 feet behind, the whole time. He was looking at the floor, and just scuttling along when his dad moved on. Poor bugger. At least dad had gone for the blue stocking look, not the 1950s ‘can you take a letter’ secretary attire.

And the amount of the annual sub a local group gets to keep , with the price rises to hire halls, means many low numbered groups just can't afford to continue.

Not such an issue in cities, but a big problem for rural groups

At least 'Nearer to Nature' is there as well. Nature is definitely about sex not gender.

I assume the unintentionally comic scolder is very very young, taking advantage of the school holidays.

As I have said before, back when I was in the ICA we had members with controlling and suspicious husbands who would only 'let' them go out to attend an all-female meeting. Without that, they'd never have been able to make the networks and ultimately gain the knowledge and freedom to make a better life for themselves and their children. Which is why some men are determined to infiltrate.

Some men set up a men's knitting group in our town last year, and someone from our craft group pointed out that they could have joined us, since although we are all female it's a community group not a women's group. But someone else pointed out that that would have completely changed the group dynamic. So I'm glad it didn't happen.

And we're all sane, so no-one in 50 years' experience of various groups, has ever mentioned genitals.

I'm sure you'd change your mind if you saw it cheekily peeking out from behind a pillar in your local gym's women's changing room

Such a hilarious photo. Maybe the photographer was a TERF doing a subversive mission.

"No need for a scarf to hide your Adam's Apple, let's do this pose common commonly used by playful but shy middle aged ladies! es that's it, just your head peeking round the tree! Don't worry, it's giving cockette coquette rather than sinister!"

Yes, I think I mentioned in my first post that I had been told that the second most common reason for closing is hall issues, and that for my own group the membership fees we keep don’t even cover our hall hire costs. We have to fundraise (yes by selling homemade jams , cakes and crafts…..) to cover our other costs, particularly for speakers. Hall costs have risen - I know many community groups have been struggling because of this, many only survive because churches offer them ‘community rates’ rather than the commercial rates they charge some others. But the churches have their own issues and costs to cover. Heating supplements are very common - we now have a winter rate and a summer rate for hall hire.

At least dad had gone for the blue stocking look, not the 1950s ‘can you take a letter’ secretary attire.

I may regret asking this, but what are the "blue stocking" and "1950s secretary" attires?

Is that what happens at WI meetings, they sit around talking about their genitals? I mean how many meetings before everyone is bored to death.

Sometimes, yes. It's otherwise known as "women's health". Examples can include:

• Love your vulva.
• Cervical cancer awareness.
• Menopause management skills.
• Ovarian cancer awareness.
• Pelvic floor and stress incontinence sessions.

I thought genitals were defined as external sex organs? Some of your examples aren't genitals.

What does the central WI actually do, i.e. what are the local branches and members getting in exchange for the part of their subs that goes to HQ? ( I'm not a WI member so don't know how this works.)

So a man's gonads (balls) are part of his genitals but a woman's gonads (ovaries) aren't? Make it make sense.

And it doesn't matter whether we use the American Heritage Dictionary's definition of genitals, or the narrower Cambridge Dictionary definition, because "women's health" covers external genitals as well as internal reproductive organs and breasts, and hence women's external genitals can be a legitimate meeting topic.

What's your point? We've had breast heath talks because some members have passed away from breast cancer.

You may well ask. The salary of that handmaiden ceo perhaps? I'd be happy for ALL my subs to go to my local group, they are fantastic and organise some great activities.

I was pissed off at how much went to the central WI even before the trans stuff. Safe to say I'm raging now!

My point was my surprise that WI meetings were about sitting round talking about your genitals. Then I was given a list of examples of talks about genitals which included non genital topics.

I mean if we are going to discuss the WI we do need some accurate information for those if us who've never been members.

As I said up thread

The "love your vulva" thing was actually one of the five choices offered for members to pick one cause to support for the next year. It focussed on self checking for cancer and raising awareness of vulval cancers.