Page 9 | Open Letter to Dr Hilary Cass

Sexnotgendah · 2025-12-03T21:43:49+00:00

Cass did great work but this puberty blocker trial is a huge mistake [[https://genspect.org/an-open-letter-from-genspect-to-dr-hilary-cass/ https://genspect.org/an-open-letter-from-genspect-to-dr-hilary-cass/]]

Seethlaw · 04/12/2025 18:47

JamieCannister · 04/12/2025 18:21

Earlier you said "I can't even get proper help for much more common and debilitating MH issues, so I'm not going to wait until some miracle happens and I stumble upon a therapist who just happens to know how to go about dealing with that. It's simply not going to happen - so I go the way of lessening the discomfort with transition."

Now you are saying "My dysphoria has always been there, and nothing has ever created so much as a dent in it"

Which one is it? Is transition lessening your discomfort (whilst not actually being a solution) as you first said, or has your transition failed to reduce your discomfort at all as you have just said?

It seems to me that if all transition has done has lessened your discomfort, then that can only be a good option if the physical negative side effects are very small. (I believe that the negative side effects are massive)

If the latter is true and transition has done no good, then if transition cost money or gave even the most trivial of negative side effects then it was definitely not a good idea.

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Which one is it? Is transition lessening your discomfort (whilst not actually being a solution) as you first said, or has your transition failed to reduce your discomfort at all as you have just said?

Ah, my bad, sorry. I shouldn't have said "dysphoria", that's not right. What I meant is that my feeling of being a boy/man was always there, and nothing I or anyone else has done has ever modified it (I did manage to entirely ignore it under extreme mental duress, but that's another story.) It's just there, like my nose on my face or my liver in my belly. Transitioning didn't have any effect on it that I noticed.

It seems to me that if all transition has done has lessened your discomfort, then that can only be a good option if the physical negative side effects are very small. (I believe that the negative side effects are massive)

Heh. I weighed the pros and cons, and still went for it and have had no cause to regret it so far. But I wouldn't go for a phalloplasty, for example, even if I had the means for it, because the cons are way too high for me, and the pros nowhere appealing enough. Also, I think these are decisions that can only be taken by well-informed adults, and it breaks my heart that so many young girls are pushed to take those steps. That's beyond wrong.

Medical transition definitely did me good. It lessened the gap between my mental and physical images, thus reducing my psychological tension on this matter, and helped with my social transition, which was essential to me.

BundleBoogie · 04/12/2025 18:55

Seethlaw · 04/12/2025 18:47

Which one is it? Is transition lessening your discomfort (whilst not actually being a solution) as you first said, or has your transition failed to reduce your discomfort at all as you have just said?

Ah, my bad, sorry. I shouldn't have said "dysphoria", that's not right. What I meant is that my feeling of being a boy/man was always there, and nothing I or anyone else has done has ever modified it (I did manage to entirely ignore it under extreme mental duress, but that's another story.) It's just there, like my nose on my face or my liver in my belly. Transitioning didn't have any effect on it that I noticed.

It seems to me that if all transition has done has lessened your discomfort, then that can only be a good option if the physical negative side effects are very small. (I believe that the negative side effects are massive)

Heh. I weighed the pros and cons, and still went for it and have had no cause to regret it so far. But I wouldn't go for a phalloplasty, for example, even if I had the means for it, because the cons are way too high for me, and the pros nowhere appealing enough. Also, I think these are decisions that can only be taken by well-informed adults, and it breaks my heart that so many young girls are pushed to take those steps. That's beyond wrong.

Medical transition definitely did me good. It lessened the gap between my mental and physical images, thus reducing my psychological tension on this matter, and helped with my social transition, which was essential to me.

Show quote history

Thank you for your thoughtful posts - you are always interesting to read.

If I could say one thing to you though, please prioritise the health of your body. Having been through a female related bout of debilitating ill health and significant pain for two years (I’m feeling much better now thanks to medication and tai chi) , I can’t emphasise how important it is to protect your body. You may be young enough to feel physically well now but knowing what I know about the effects of natural hormones on our bodies, I dread to think of the effects of unnatural hormones long term.

I understand that you want to balance the comfort of your mind but just think about what your body needs too. It’s hard to remain in good spirits if every move is agony and you can’t even eat or lie down without pain.

ProfessorBettyBooper · 04/12/2025 19:08

Seethlaw · 04/12/2025 18:18

Thank you :) !

I don't really know what to say, other than "I agree with all this." Including and especially the "damaging social movement" bit. I had personal experience with these types back when I transitioned and dipped a toe into the trans community (if you can call it that, really), and I was appalled at how profoundly nasty they could be with anyone who didn't fawn to them. And more than a bit afraid at how easily they resorted to verbal and emotional violence. I'm not at all surprised that this violence turned physical as well. They really act like the worst of men, through and through.

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Hi Seethlaw

Just to say that I really appreciate your posts and your insight. I honestly think that if the trans issue was dealt with in the way you do, we wouldn't have difficulties.

Sorry, that might not be the right way of putting it, but just wanted you to know that I read your posts with interest and am glad to see you back here.

alwayseatingnevermoving · 04/12/2025 19:20

JamieCannister · 04/12/2025 18:15

Adults have a right to do what they want to their body, subject to the restrictions that society places on them either to protect the (potentially vulnerable) adult themselves or to protect society from the consequences.

I believe that in the case of medical transition there is very good reason for society to restrict adult transition, for the benefit of the trans person AND wider society.

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That’s just false. See R v Brown.

JamieCannister · 04/12/2025 19:21

BonfireLady · 04/12/2025 18:35

Fair enough.

TBH now that I no longer believe that anyone has a gender identity, it's really hard to put myself in the shoes of someone who does hold this belief who also wants to do something permanent and harmful their body to match their belief.

It always strikes me as being akin to the extreme end of religious belief. Such as the Christians of Jonestown and Waco or the Muslim suicide bomber in Manchester.

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An identity is how you see yourself, and that is based on reality (many people identify by reference to their job which is fundamental to how they see themselves and their place in the world) or aspiration.

Gender is sex based stereotypes.

Transgender people, as far as I can see, aspire to sex-based stereotypes associated with the opposite sex.

JamieCannister · 04/12/2025 19:22

alwayseatingnevermoving · 04/12/2025 19:20

That’s just false. See R v Brown.

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Did you misread what I said or am I missing something?

Seethlaw · 04/12/2025 19:26

BundleBoogie · 04/12/2025 18:55

Thank you for your thoughtful posts - you are always interesting to read.

If I could say one thing to you though, please prioritise the health of your body. Having been through a female related bout of debilitating ill health and significant pain for two years (I’m feeling much better now thanks to medication and tai chi) , I can’t emphasise how important it is to protect your body. You may be young enough to feel physically well now but knowing what I know about the effects of natural hormones on our bodies, I dread to think of the effects of unnatural hormones long term.

I understand that you want to balance the comfort of your mind but just think about what your body needs too. It’s hard to remain in good spirits if every move is agony and you can’t even eat or lie down without pain.

Show quote history

Thank you for your concern, sincerely :) !

I'm not that young, by the way: I'm middle-aged, and I have quite a few health concerns already, though nothing painful luckily, and so far nothing due to the transition. Fingers crossed!

Seethlaw · 04/12/2025 19:35

ProfessorBettyBooper · 04/12/2025 19:08

Hi Seethlaw

Just to say that I really appreciate your posts and your insight. I honestly think that if the trans issue was dealt with in the way you do, we wouldn't have difficulties.

Sorry, that might not be the right way of putting it, but just wanted you to know that I read your posts with interest and am glad to see you back here.

Show quote history

Thank you!

I'm afraid I'm a minority among trans people. Or, well, I don't know about minority, strictly speaking, but certainly nowhere as loud as the extremists :/ But I'm seeing more and more alternate trans voices rising up here and there, so there's hope!

MarieDeGournay · 04/12/2025 19:43

JamieCannister · 04/12/2025 18:15

Adults have a right to do what they want to their body, subject to the restrictions that society places on them either to protect the (potentially vulnerable) adult themselves or to protect society from the consequences.

I believe that in the case of medical transition there is very good reason for society to restrict adult transition, for the benefit of the trans person AND wider society.

Show quote history

Another factor to consider is medical ethics - for instance the ethics of carrying out surgery that is not physically necessary, carries significant risks and ongoing side effects, and does not actually effect a transition from the birth sex of the patient.

We know that, but it would appear that at least some men who have put themselves through such surgery believe that they have changed sex and are now really women.

No surgeon in these islands would carry out an amputation on somebody who didn't want to have legs, even though the person argued that their mental health would be so much improved if their body looked like they wanted it to look.

And yet - it happens.

Not to mention the ethics around children and puberty blockers...

ProfessorBettyBooper · 04/12/2025 19:49

Seethlaw · 04/12/2025 19:35

Thank you!

I'm afraid I'm a minority among trans people. Or, well, I don't know about minority, strictly speaking, but certainly nowhere as loud as the extremists :/ But I'm seeing more and more alternate trans voices rising up here and there, so there's hope!

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Yes there is hope!

Please keep speaking up. And honestly, really interesting! Your anecdote about looking in the mirror, for example, really helped me understand where you're coming from.

All the best x

HildegardP · 04/12/2025 21:09

ByCraftyMaker · 04/12/2025 01:03

I think neutral talking therapy to help someone explore their feelings is a good thing. But if the goal of that therapy is to convince someone they’re not trans, that would be conversion therapy.

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"Transition" is conversion therapy. Take your head out of the sand & read Cass.

HildegardP · 04/12/2025 21:18

alwayseatingnevermoving · 04/12/2025 19:20

That’s just false. See R v Brown.

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Yup, that's the Q. There are people who've been fighting R v Brown since the first court judgment was handed down & both the T & the Q have been exceptionally useful to them - look at the crossover between eunuch/ nullo fetishists & WPATH in the development of WPATH's so-called Standards of Care 8. If you'd told a psychiatrist in a UK gender clinic 30 years ago that that was coming down the pike, few would have believed you.