Girlguiding - Supreme Court Decision email

[ProfMummBRaaarrrTheEverLeaking]

Have just had an email from them...

As the parent of a young member in Girlguiding, following April’s Supreme Court decision relating to sex and gender, we wanted to give you an update. Many organisations across the country have been facing complex decisions about what it means for girls and women and for the wider communities affected, including us.

Girlguiding’s governing charity documents set out that the membership and people who benefit from our organisation are girls and women. In April, the Supreme Court ruled that girls and women are defined in the Equality Act 2010 by their biological sex at birth.

Following detailed considerations, expert legal advice and input from senior members, young members and our Council, Girlguiding’s Board of Trustees has made the difficult decision that Girlguiding must change Girlguiding must change, following the Supreme Court’s ruling.

From today, 2 December, it is with a heavy heart that we are announcing trans girls and young women will no longer be able to join Girlguiding. This is a decision we would have preferred not to make, and we know that this may be upsetting for members of our community.

There will be no immediate changes for current young members but more information will be shared next week.

Most adult roles, including unit helpers, district helpers and administrative support, are already open to all, so we are confident that no volunteers will have to leave the organisation.

Girlguiding believes strongly in our value of inclusion, and we will continue to support young people and adults in marginalised groups. Over the next few months, we'll explore opportunities to champion this value and actively support young people who need us.

You can find our full statement and updated policy on our website.

We are proud to be the UK’s largest youth organisation dedicated to girls and is focused on creating an equal world for girls and young women. For over 100 years, we have been a welcoming space for all girls to have new experiences, support their communities, build friendships and grow their confidence.

While Girlguiding may feel a little different going forward, these core aims and principles will always be the same. We remain committed to treating everyone with dignity and respect, particularly those from marginalised groups that have felt the biggest impact of this decision.

If you have any immediate questions, we have our special support team in place, to give volunteers, parents and carers the best support we can. We are asking Girlguiding HQ, trading and country/region staff to refer any volunteer or parent who has questions about this announcement.

If anybody here needs a palate cleanser from the ageism, sexism and homophobia tonight, I wholly recommend the Instagram account, lil.lesbian.nan 😎

@OneLoftyPombear Guess you should've stayed away from the 'and then they came after the Lesbians' false teaming schtick then.

Oh, our lovely ploppers,

They came with such aplomb.

Then left.

Who'd have thunk.

Another male centred email from a male about the Girls Guide 😤

Good Evening,

We realise this will be upsetting for many of our members and volunteers, as it has been for us,
but we believe it is a necessary change to preserve our legacy as the largest youth organisation dedicated entirely to girls

Girlguiding still believes strongly in inclusion and we will continue to support young people and adults in marginalised groups.

Over the next few months, we will explore potential ways to champion this value while remaining within in the law.

We recognise that the trans community needs our solidarity now more than ever

We are establishing a taskforce to work with members to consider how our offer could evolve under this new policy.

Within that taskforce, we will explore new inclusive offers that continue to operate in the interest of women and girls inside the law.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts with us. We appreciate your perspective and your support during this time.

Our priority now is to ensure we continue to deliver our mission with care and respect for everyone in our community.
Kind regards,
Daniel
Girlguiding
17-19 Buckingham Palace Road
London
SW1W

Translation: "You are talking about your sexual assaults the wrong way, where 'the wrong way' is defined as 'stating the reality that only men and boys can leave women and girls pregnant and asserting that this matters'."

The phrase "one thing I wouldn't have had to worry about" indicates that there are other things that a sexual assault victim has to worry about, regardless of the sex of the perpetrator. But there are material differences for the female victim of a male rapist, and these matter, and the fear of those material differences will very likely affect how the female victim of a male sexual assault perpetrator feels during the SA, even if he chooses to stop short of rape.

The victim of a female perpetrator can disclose in her own time, get counselling in her own time. No one is claiming that she won't need those things, but I am arguing that she can take as much time as she wants to access support. Arguably, she may feel a heightened sense of betrayal at being attacked by another woman or girl and will need tailored support for that. Not explicitly mentioning this isn't pretending that it isn't the case, it's leaving off-topic material out of a forum post that is about the impact of men and boys in female spaces on the women and girls. And she still has all the time she wants to access support. Autistic people often take a long time to process things, so if she's autistic, she might need a lot of time.

The female victim of a rapist (who, by law, are all male) must immediately get emergency contraception. She must anxiously await her period. If her period is late, she must take a pregnancy test. If she is pregnant, she must decide whether to continue the pregnancy and arrange abortion or midwifery care. All of this is time-pressured. And, as I said, if she's autistic, she's struggling to process this quickly enough and she's at greatly-elevated risk of rape and SA in the first place.

Additionally, if the victim is of Girl Guide age, she may not be aware of abortion as an option. I wasn't taught about abortion at school and my parents didn't mention it. So I'm having my cunt groped by a boy and I'm terrified that he's going to escalate to rape and I'm going to be stuck with a baby that I don't want with no way to avert that. Try to get inside my mind and actually to feel how scared I was. Imagine that your sexual assault is over and you feel relieved that he didn't go further. Imagine how much that fucks with your head.

Now imagine that she's at Guide camp on day two of a week-long camp, in a farmer's field in the middle of nowhere, if my Guide camps were anything to go by, with no way to get to a pharmacy for emergency contraception and too afraid and ashamed to ask a leader for help.

Having Guides be 100% female eliminates the possibility of rape and completely erases that fear. It's the most obvious safeguarding measure to protect women and girls, especially the autistic and otherwise disabled ones.

Daniel?

Why is a man working for GG?

But how many of those lesbian couples were originally a male/female couple where one has transitioned and the other has stayed and become a lesbian?

the other has stayed and become a lesbian?

She hasn't. A woman fucking a man isn't a lesbian, unless he's her beard.

They have had male employees for a very long time delivering operationally. That's not an issue here. The decision making all happens by women, the leadership roles are only for women, and the membership is only for girls.

The important point in that email is that the organisation are looking for ways to "evolve" their offering to serve males and are only listening to the violent mob protesting against the organisation's single sex status. That is what needs pushback from the majority of members who support this change to revert to being single sex but were bullied into silence. And are continuing to be intimidated into silence by emails like that.

Yes, this. Thank you x

Yes, all those sad, sad men who can only possibly be happy in women's toilets, changing rooms, breastfeeding groups, menopause groups, prisons, rape crisis centres, homeless hostels, hospital wards, girl guide groups and the women's institute. Let's just think about those sad men's feelings because that's what's important here.😢

I was referred to dermatology because I suddenly started growing thick, bristly facial hair (after the first time I'd been told at 24 that it was because I was getting older).

I was seen by a registrar two years later who gave me a piece of paper with his sister's beauty salon details on it because she'd be able to thread my face and there wasn't anything that could be done for it on the NHS. Oh, and if I suddenly had excruciating abdominal pain, I should go to A&E.

Apart from being referred because of a 'problem with my skin' instead of the hormonal disruption of having ovarian cysts and associated endocrine issues (so endocrinology or gynaecology would have been more appropriate), it doesn't feel particularly gender affirming to be growing a full beard when you aren't supposed to have one, does it? But there was no treatment, apparently. Nothing at all.

Mind you, I was referred in 2022 to gynae for further hormonal problems where I need medication that the GP can't or won't prescribe - first attempt at referral was in 2014 and that got bounced back on the grounds that I was too young to have hormonal problems. I've just had my first appointment confirmed from that referral. For May 2026. No delay or issues accessing hormonal treatments for biological women, you say?

Imagine that your sexual assault is over and you feel relieved that he didn't go further. Imagine how much that fucks with your head.

Not to mention feeling grateful to your assailant for graciously "only" groping your cunt and choosing not to put you at risk of forced pregnancy. As I said, it really fucks with your head.

These men and boys know that they cause those confused mixed-up feelings by stopping short of rape, it's part of the powertrip for them. My assailants laughed about it. No woman or girl has that power over other women and girls to induce that fear of pregnancy, nor can she induce those confused mixed-up feelings in her victim by stopping short of rape.

Policing how I and other victims of sexual assault talk about our own experiences is utter misogyny. Scolding women and girls when we recognise and talk about the structural power that men and boys have over us because of their and our biology is also utter misogyny.

Keeping Guides single-sex takes away any and all possibility of any girl being subjected to the fear of forced pregnancy whilst she's at a Guiding event. It creates a space where men have no power over women.

I read it as a a joke tbh, legal humour (& criticism too) tends to be quite restrained.

sending huge hugs, and wonder what wanktwatter medical school your doctors went to when 10 minutes with their feet up and a copy of Best would have given them a better starting point for diagnosis.....and wth you were 24 not 64!!! how in gods green earth did they square the evidence in front of their eyes with getting "older".

going to stop before i go on an epic rant because its way off topic but sending love, heat pads and chocolate

The good news is that trans identifying females (transboys and non binary) have always been and will always be welcomed as members.
Unfortunately all of the news articles have suggested that trans people are banned not that Guiding is returning to a girls only space as boys will no longer be able to join.

Duchess: "Biological sex is not as simple as you’d like it to be. 1.7% of the population is intersex - as common as twins. "
We interupt the work of the Moomin family to observe that the figure of 1.7%, invented ('disputed' in academia speak) by Anne Fausto-Sterling is about 100 times too high. Also 'intersex' is an out of date term for Disorders of Sexual Development (DSDs), those affected are either male or female, not a mystical in-between, & the representatives of those affected have objected to being used as a political football by the gender faction.

Honestly, the fact that someone cannot rationally work out, just by using their own brain, that there cannot possibly be as many people who are 'intersex' (their definition not mine) as there are twins is baffling.

It's actually quite frightening.

It wasn’t just a joke. Did you watch the hearing online?

This was from reading the judgement

There’s stuff on trans Reddit about email & letter campaigns & in-person protests.

It sounds as if the only thing that will satisfy them is if Guiding goes officially mixed-sex, because that’s the only way boys who identify as girls can be admitted.

One more thing girls won’t get to have any longer. But none of them give a fuck about that.

Its called safeguarding, it protects the safety of children.

Even the scouts that are currently doing a bang up job of trying to capitalise on this by putting forward a seemingly massive campaign to snag the trans girls (boys) will still have to put them in separate tents/dorms to the girls due to safeguarding.

Its not really that hard to understand.

Oh and in the same vein as "stop using CIS its offensive".
Intersex people would like you to stop lumping them together with the Trans lobby.

Entitled male twats

This thread has "evolved" a bit hasn't it? It would seem that a murmuration of Redditors has turned up, telling people what lesbians are. I may be totally wrong, but as a bloke in his sixties, I can look back forty years to the time where I was working at a great company in London. The guys and the girls socialised regularly and I used to go our for coffee with this young woman, similar age to me. So, one day I plucked up the courage and asked her out, only to find out that she preferred women to men. Not a problem, we still went out for coffee together. As Ricky Gervais might say, what happened to all the old fashioned lesbians, the ones who like women?
In my humble opinion, a lesbian doesn't have sex with any male bodied person, irrespective of how they identify, because if they do, then they are either bisexual or heterosexual. It is all down to biology isn't it.

I’m a leader in Scouting and a lot of our girls are nervous about moving up from the younger sections because the older groups are so boy heavy. Both my son and daughter are members and I’m happy we chose Scouting for my daughter but I can definitely see why some girls want a single sex group such as Guiding. I’m surprised though that the comments on posts by Guiding groups are so against this decision (and they do seem to be from members although who can ever know). I don’t know if it’s just that the members who are happy with it can’t say so openly (plausible) or if a lot of Guiding members would actually be happy with a mixed sex group? If they genuinely would like a mixed sex group then setting it up that way openly at least allows for proper safeguarding.