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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Why the NHS puberty blocker trial is appalling

1000 replies

Soontobe60 · 16/11/2025 14:43

Stella O’Malley from Genspect telling it like it is - that a state endorsed trial of puberty blockers for gender dysphoric children should NOT go ahead.
the NHS are not walking into this nightmare blindly - there are enough experts out there telling them what will happen happen to these children if they’re given these life changing drugs.
https://x.com/genspect/status/1989896741358113127?s=61&t=gKvvk-rWmOlYFGMZN8QVvQ

Genspect (@genspect) on X

In a conversation about the Next Generation, podcast host Elliot Bewick @elliotbewick talks with @stellaomalley3 : “This won't be puberty because their reproductive system won't be awakened, it will be a chemical insurgents into their body…and so they...

https://x.com/genspect/status/1989896741358113127?s=61&t=gKvvk-rWmOlYFGMZN8QVvQ

OP posts:
Thread gallery
82
RedToothBrush · 23/11/2025 08:43

ArabellaSaurus · 23/11/2025 08:32

I can knock up a few extra questionnaires for them before breakfast.

'Lupron is the best' - on a scale of 1 to 10 how much do you agree?
'I love my glitter family'
'I am living my best life being true to myself and honouring my deepest innermost gendered soul'
'I solemnly swear never to detransition'

They may as well add in the 'Barbie to GI Joe' scale for good measure.

Do you prefer the pink aisle of toys or the blue aisle?

Signalbox · 23/11/2025 08:47

ArabellaSaurus · 23/11/2025 08:11

They seek consent from the parents/guardian and 'assent' from the child, fwiw.

So presumably both parents will need to independently consent and both be screened for homophobic attitudes. The likes of Susie Green’s family would not be considered.

LikeAHandleInTheWind · 23/11/2025 09:02

There is no need for consent from both parents and nothing in the protocol about what happens if 1 parent disagrees with study participation. Not sure what the legal situation is with that scenario? It's treatment of a mental health condition with an 80% spontaneous remission rate, so I would hope the courts would block participation if a parent/legal guardian disagreed - but nothing in the protocol about discussing with both parents!

PrettyDamnCosmic · 23/11/2025 09:04

LikeAHandleInTheWind · 23/11/2025 09:02

There is no need for consent from both parents and nothing in the protocol about what happens if 1 parent disagrees with study participation. Not sure what the legal situation is with that scenario? It's treatment of a mental health condition with an 80% spontaneous remission rate, so I would hope the courts would block participation if a parent/legal guardian disagreed - but nothing in the protocol about discussing with both parents!

Just as any other scenario where one parent disagrees with a particular form of medical treatment it will be a matter for the courts to decide the child's best interests.

LikeAHandleInTheWind · 23/11/2025 09:04

Most of the family assessment happens in the gender clinic referring the child to the study, there are no study measures capturing parental attitudes. Even their very basic questionnaire for parents has a 'prefer not to say' option for 'sex assigned at birth' do they will have a problem with data quality - won't be able to tell if a parent is trans and pushing the child onto blockers.

The child 'may' be seen without parents present - nothing said about the possibility of parents transing their child, which is a well known phenomenon.

LikeAHandleInTheWind · 23/11/2025 09:06

PrettyDamnCosmic · 23/11/2025 09:04

Just as any other scenario where one parent disagrees with a particular form of medical treatment it will be a matter for the courts to decide the child's best interests.

But if the parents are separated the non-consenting parent may not know about study participation and the trial team are making no effort to inform them!

For a life altering drug treating a mental health condition that's pretty appalling

ArabellaSaurus · 23/11/2025 09:49

LikeAHandleInTheWind · 23/11/2025 09:06

But if the parents are separated the non-consenting parent may not know about study participation and the trial team are making no effort to inform them!

For a life altering drug treating a mental health condition that's pretty appalling

The entire enterprise is appalling. Makes a mockery of the NHS. For ten million pounds, you'd expect more.

Cailin66 · 23/11/2025 09:52

Not sure if this article from July was put up here or not

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/healthcare/article/health-transgender-children-study-mt0vkbs2j

Cailin66 · 23/11/2025 10:09

Why in this NHS document is the word child or children suppressed. 8 year olds are children, not young people

https://www.kcl.ac.uk/ioppn/assets/pathways/horizon/pathways-horizon-intensive-easy-read.pdf

Young person would those aged 13-25…

Is it normal to pay children to fill out research questionnaires , they are paying £20 for each one completed.

https://www.kcl.ac.uk/ioppn/assets/pathways/horizon/pathways-horizon-intensive-easy-read.pdf

PeachOctopus · 23/11/2025 10:21

So the study is only for 2 years? What happens when it is completed, a child of 11-13 says ‘yes I found it helpful and I want to continue’ what will the outcome be. Will the doctor’s running the study be pro-trans?

Wes Streeting’s leadership challenge-does it come into this- is he appeasing the Left wing pro-trans arm of his Party by allowing this?

nicepotoftea · 23/11/2025 10:27

PeachOctopus · 23/11/2025 10:21

So the study is only for 2 years? What happens when it is completed, a child of 11-13 says ‘yes I found it helpful and I want to continue’ what will the outcome be. Will the doctor’s running the study be pro-trans?

Wes Streeting’s leadership challenge-does it come into this- is he appeasing the Left wing pro-trans arm of his Party by allowing this?

I think the implication is that they might be allowed to continue, but I don't understand how that wouldn't interfere with the study data.

I think there was a quote somewhere saying that they weren't trying to find a 'one size fits all' solution, but if they are just offering different kinds of treatment to different people, how are they going to get useful data?

TheWeightOfTheWorld · 23/11/2025 10:41

How many children are to be enrolled on the trial in total? How much sensible counselling/therapy/non-clinical support would £10,000,000 buy in terms of hours? How many children could be supported for that kind of money?

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 10:44

Wrt Hannah Barnes being refused attendance at the press briefing for this, so was Sonia Sodha:

Sonia Sodha

@soniasodha
Nov 22
I was also turned down from attending the puberty blocker trial briefing, and I have similar questions to Hannah. Seems very counter productive to exclude journalists who are writing about this from an informed perspective

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 10:45

Also came across this tweet:

Levi Pay@soppystern
23h
I’ve looked but I can’t find any evidence that swallowing broken glass is an effective treatment for depression in children. We clearly need more evidence, starting with a clinical trial.

Why the NHS puberty blocker trial is appalling
plantcomplex · 23/11/2025 10:53

LikeAHandleInTheWind · 23/11/2025 09:02

There is no need for consent from both parents and nothing in the protocol about what happens if 1 parent disagrees with study participation. Not sure what the legal situation is with that scenario? It's treatment of a mental health condition with an 80% spontaneous remission rate, so I would hope the courts would block participation if a parent/legal guardian disagreed - but nothing in the protocol about discussing with both parents!

You have to obtain a court order to change a child's name without the consent of everyone with parental responsibility.

But experimental sterilisation of a child in response to psychological distress, oh that doesn't need the same safeguards as something as serious as changing their name...

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 10:56

Kiera has an op ed at the end of yesterday’s Telegraph article. Copying here:

A conveyor belt to lifelong harm
By Keira Bell
In 2020 I became a claimant in a Judicial Review against The Tavistock’s Gender Identity Development Service (GIDS) to challenge the idea that under-18s could provide informed consent for puberty blockers. The High Court ruled that it was highly unlikely for a child aged 13 or under to provide informed consent, it was doubtful that 14 and 15-year-olds could, and that those over 16 should be referred to the courts if there is any doubt about their capacity to consent.
Despite this ruling being overturned in the Court of Appeal on a point of law, this process exposed the insanity that was taking place not only at The Tavistock but across the Western world.

Now, the nation is about to commence hundreds of under-16s on a puberty blocker trial. They claim this is to gain the evidence to inform clinical practice. However, I and many others believe this to be a deeply unethical, disgusting experiment on the children of this nation.

A “trial” of puberty blockers has already been conducted. In 2011, GIDS and University College London Hospitals (UCLH) studied 44 children between 12 and 15 over three years – the “early intervention study”. They kept the findings in the dark until the 2020 court proceedings forced them to reveal this information.

What was revealed was that – at best – the blockers did nothing to improve children’s mental health.

For some, it worsened. I am a testament to this. It sent me into a menopause-like state: hot flushes, brain fog, worsened depression, anxiety and my bone density drastically decreased. It did not provide a “pause” to think and reflect like these doctors claim.

In fact, I became more desperate to start cross-sex hormones (testosterone) and escape the compounded hell I was experiencing, which I did a year later. I also went ahead with a double-mastectomy at age 20. I am included in the statistic of 98 per cent of children who proceed further down the pathway once they are initiated on puberty blockers.

I suffered at the age of 16 and I can only imagine the level of physiological damage that these children – who are younger than I was – will experience if this trial goes ahead. It is rightly described as a conveyor belt that will undoubtedly lead to infertility and lack of sexual function, to name only a couple.

A child cannot fully understand these effects, let alone those that are unknown. Puberty is the antidote to gender dysphoria for 85 per cent of children, who reconcile with their sex when they are left alone. Many of these children have mental health comorbidities, are autistic and/or same-sex attracted. They deserve holistic treatment and to lead happy, fulfilling lives. Not to be made life-long medical patients, coupled with a life of confusion and disorientation.

Puberty does not happen in a vacuum. It is not some magical process isolated from the rest of the body. Neil Evans’s trial on sheep revealed that memory and cognition was impaired from puberty blockers and their cognition did not recover once ceased.

UCLH told me they were reversible when I signed the form. The ideologically captured NHS itself lied on its guidance and stated these drugs are reversible until the 2020 ruling forced them to reflect the facts – we don’t know.

Yes, puberty blockers are prescribed for precocious puberty – a developmental abnormality. They are also used to chemically castrate adult sex offenders. It is inexcusable to inject this substance into vulnerable children who are experiencing a complex psychological issue, when they are likely to recover without it.

The horrifying concept of providing puberty blockers to children was originally created and tailored for boys, where this process was to allow them to ‘pass’ as a woman later in life. This, of course ignoring all the negative, life-altering effects.

However, most patients diagnosed with gender dysphoria for the past 10-plus years have been female, where puberty blockers are unnecessary to “pass” as men. Not only is the prospect of a trial negatively life-altering, but it lacks any superficial benefits.

Why are we not utilising the evidence we already have? Did those of us who already had this treatment do it in vain?

Puberty is rough for everyone, but it is necessary.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/gift/8928696e3bd3fac5

NHS ‘betrayal’ as trans drugs to be given to children

Puberty blockers will be given to more than 200 young people, potentially as young as eight, who think they may be transgender

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/gift/8928696e3bd3fac5

plantcomplex · 23/11/2025 11:01

TheWeightOfTheWorld · 23/11/2025 10:41

How many children are to be enrolled on the trial in total? How much sensible counselling/therapy/non-clinical support would £10,000,000 buy in terms of hours? How many children could be supported for that kind of money?

The activists have used intimidation and violence to shut down the psychological treatment avenue by declaring it "conversion therapy".

Which is odd because I would have thought that sterilising a child who doesn't conform to sexist stereotypes is the very definition of conversion therapy.

Whereas supporting them to find peace with their own body and personality doesn't require them to change anything about themselves at all. (Unlike gay conversion therapy which did seek to make people change and shame themselves.)

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 11:09

plantcomplex · 23/11/2025 11:01

The activists have used intimidation and violence to shut down the psychological treatment avenue by declaring it "conversion therapy".

Which is odd because I would have thought that sterilising a child who doesn't conform to sexist stereotypes is the very definition of conversion therapy.

Whereas supporting them to find peace with their own body and personality doesn't require them to change anything about themselves at all. (Unlike gay conversion therapy which did seek to make people change and shame themselves.)

Ah, that’s because you are under the weird and frankly transphobic impression (sorry, sarcasm warning here) that the thing that a trans child needs is to accept their body the way it is, where TRAs are clear that what actually needs to happen is for the world to accept the trans child’s inner gender feelings. By asking the child to accept their body the way it is, you are actually requiring the child to change the way they feel about that body - to like it, instead of hate it - which the TRAs say is akin to telling a gay person to stop being attracted to the same sex.

TheWeightOfTheWorld · 23/11/2025 11:28

'The Safeguarding Alliance' (which I think might be a privately owned training company) have posted a useful summary mentioning legal definitions of 'child' and 'young person'; 'unconscious bias' in relation to a child's vulnerability and duty of care; potential pressure on children to feel more mature than they are; and that safeguarding needs unambiguous language.

https://www.thesafeguardingalliance.org.uk/a-young-person-is-a-child/

Calling a 'young person' 'a child' in terms of gender ideology is a bit like calling a 'transwoman' 'a man'. We need plain, unambiguous terms to see things as they are.

ProfessorDameFarriersGirl · 23/11/2025 11:28

I'm familiar enough with the issues but have found the fact that a trial of this nature could be approved, knowing what is known about PB's, quite appalling. There have been a few comments about a judicial review or some sort of legal challenge. Do we know any more? Any gardening needed because this would be at the top of my list!

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 11:34

ProfessorDameFarriersGirl · 23/11/2025 11:28

I'm familiar enough with the issues but have found the fact that a trial of this nature could be approved, knowing what is known about PB's, quite appalling. There have been a few comments about a judicial review or some sort of legal challenge. Do we know any more? Any gardening needed because this would be at the top of my list!

I’m with you. The only one I know about is Kiera’s with James Esses, which I don’t think is a JR to stop the whole thing, but rather to get them to disclose aspects of the study that are currently hidden.

If a more general JR was put forward, I imagine it might come from Tavistock whistleblowers, Transgender Trend, Genspect, Bayswater, or some combination of these. If anyone on the thread has any knowledge of any formal challenge being put forward - or even just being rumbled about - could you share?

TheWeightOfTheWorld · 23/11/2025 11:36

Cailin66 · 23/11/2025 10:09

Why in this NHS document is the word child or children suppressed. 8 year olds are children, not young people

https://www.kcl.ac.uk/ioppn/assets/pathways/horizon/pathways-horizon-intensive-easy-read.pdf

Young person would those aged 13-25…

Is it normal to pay children to fill out research questionnaires , they are paying £20 for each one completed.

Edited

I've just skimmed the document. Is it ethical, in effect, to be paying children (and their parents') money, however little, to participate in data gathering on the scheme? I can see that reimbursing travel expenses would be ethical but paying extra looks like enticement.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 23/11/2025 11:37

ProfessorDameFarriersGirl · 23/11/2025 11:28

I'm familiar enough with the issues but have found the fact that a trial of this nature could be approved, knowing what is known about PB's, quite appalling. There have been a few comments about a judicial review or some sort of legal challenge. Do we know any more? Any gardening needed because this would be at the top of my list!

James Esses & Keira Bell apparently have the funding in place to mount a Judicial Review against this monstrous experiment on children:

https://x.com/JamesEsses/status/1992502486184398990

James Esses (@JamesEsses) on X

To re-assure you all on our legal challenge to the puberty blockers trial. We have funding in place. Enough funding to take this all the way to the Supreme Court, if that’s what it takes. We will do everything we can to shut this monstrosity down.

https://x.com/JamesEsses/status/1992502486184398990

Shedmistress · 23/11/2025 11:38

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 11:34

I’m with you. The only one I know about is Kiera’s with James Esses, which I don’t think is a JR to stop the whole thing, but rather to get them to disclose aspects of the study that are currently hidden.

If a more general JR was put forward, I imagine it might come from Tavistock whistleblowers, Transgender Trend, Genspect, Bayswater, or some combination of these. If anyone on the thread has any knowledge of any formal challenge being put forward - or even just being rumbled about - could you share?

https://x.com/JamesEsses/status/1992148590018666845

From James' x:

The trial has been quietly approved and recruitment of hundreds of children is commencing. Keira Bell and I demand that this dangerous and unethical trial is halted immediately. If it isn’t, we will bring a Judicial Review.

James Esses (@JamesEsses) on X

🚨Breaking: Puberty Blockers Trial🚨 The trial has been quietly approved and recruitment of hundreds of children is commencing. Keira Bell and I demand that this dangerous and unethical trial is halted immediately. If it isn’t, we will bring a Judic...

https://x.com/JamesEsses/status/1992148590018666845

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 23/11/2025 11:39

MrsOvertonsWindow · 23/11/2025 11:37

James Esses & Keira Bell apparently have the funding in place to mount a Judicial Review against this monstrous experiment on children:

https://x.com/JamesEsses/status/1992502486184398990

Thank the ever loving fuck for that.

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