"Darlington Nurses" vs County Durham and Darlington NHS Trust Tribunal Thread 8

[ThreeWordHarpy]

Thread 1, 7-Oct to 23-Oct; pre-hearing discussion, KD (day 1 of evidence) and BH (day 2).
Thread 2, 23-Oct to 28-Oct; BH (day 2), CH, JP, MG (day 3&4), TH, SS, ST, LL (day 4), JS, AT (day 5)
Thread 3, 28-Oct to 29-Oct; AT (day 5&6), TA (day 6&7)
Thread 4, 29-Oct to 31-Oct; TA, AM (day 7) JB (day 8)
Thread 5, 31-Oct to 04-Nov; JB (day 8), SW, CG, JR (day 9)
Thread 6, 04-Nov to 05-Nov; RH (day 10), SW (day 11)
Thread 7, 05-Nov to 11-Nov; SW (day 11), closing submissions

Five nurses working at Darlington Memorial Hospital have filed a legal case suing their employer, an NHS trust, for sexual harassment and sex discrimination. The nurses object to sharing the women’s changing facilities with a male colleague, Rose, who identifies as female. The hearing started on October 20th, with evidence now complete. Submissions are being made on November 11th. To view the hearing online requests for access had to be made by October 17th. The hearing is being live tweeted by Tribunal Tweets who have background to this case on their substack. An alternative to X is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

The Judge made clear at the start of the public hearing on Day 1 that only TT or press have permission to tweet. If online observers see/hear something in the court that isn’t reported by TT, we don’t mention it until the next time there’s a break. This is a very cautious approach to avoid any accusations of “live reporting” on MN. Commentary on the content of TT tweets is fine as soon as they’re posted on X.

Key people:
C/Ns - Claimants, the Darlington nurses
R/T/Trust - Respondent, County Durham and Darlington NHS Foundation Trust
J/EJ – Judge/Employment Judge Seamus Sweeney
NF - Niazi Fetto KC, barrister for claimants
SC - Simon Cheetham, KC, barrister for respondents
RH - Rose Henderson, trans identifying nurse
CG – Clare Gregory, NHS ward manager
SW - Sue Williams, NHS Trust HR
KD – Karen Danson, first claimant to give evidence.
BH – Bethany Hutchison, claimant
AH – Alistair Hutchison, husband of Bethany
CH – Carly Hoy, claimant
JP – Jane Peveller, claimant
MG – Mary Anne (aka Annice) Grundy, claimant
TH – Tracy Hooper, claimant
SS – Siobhan Sinclair, witness for the claimants, retired from Trust
ST – Sharron Trevarrow, witness for the claimants, retired from Trust, former housekeeper and wellbeing officer
LL – Lisa Lockey, claimant
JP – Professor Jo Phoenix, expert witness
JS – Jane Shields, witness for the claimants
AT - Andrew Thacker, NHS trust Head of HR
TA – Tracy Atkinson, NHS trust HR.
AM – Andrew Moore, NHS Head of Workforce Experience
JB – Jillian Bailey, NHS Workforce Experience Manager
AT – Anna Telfer, NHS Deputy Director of Nursing
SW – Sandra Watson, Matron for General and Elective Surgery
JR – Jodie Robinson, manager of Rose

Thank you so much to those doing the sterling job of reporting, it’s great for those of us who aren’t able to listen. Can anyone tell a dabbler like me when we’re likely to get the first outcome of any of these tribunals?

I think Peggie should report by the end of November and Kelly by Christmas, but the real answer is how long is a piece of string?.

how long is a piece of string?

Twice as long as half.

Exactly that.

Lawyers make closing submissions in nurses' hearing - Christian Concern

Ooh interesting, it looks like the respondent's lawyer has been reading knottyauty's audit, saying 'well every other NHS trust was doing it so it must be OK'!

Surely regardless of who wrote the policy the higher ups at the trust were still responsible for it. They can't plead ignorance, well they could but that's at best mitigation. Imo though that makes it worse because they should have known. It's like Upton claiming that Peggie endangered patients before realising he'd hang himself with his own petard. It's act and/or omission.

I disagree. That was a fact and his case hinges on the acknowledgment of said fact so a good answer.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4wnkvy9jo

Haven't read the whole thread so don't know if this has been linked yet. BBC manages a whole report without giving Rose Henderson any pronouns at all and also make it clear he's a biological male.

Ooh, just caught a micro-item on BBC1 news on Darlington nurses - will miracles never cease !!!
18.20 ish

Silly point, but it's hoist by your own petard. A petard is a small bomb, so it means you blow yourself into the air with your own explosive weapon. Not something you can hang yourself with.

I read entirely too many Sharpe books and other books set during wars.

Lordy me, R4 sent Dominic Hughes (sp) to court today! 6 o’clock news are covering it (circa 18:24).

They even interviewed 3 of the nurses.

NHS England recognises the need for new guidance, but is still working on it!
Rose not available for comment.

I didn’t catch it on PM, though.

@Madcats - where's the 'I nearly dropped down from the shock' emoji? Are the mgt changes at the Beeb taking effect already?

They covered it really well and impartially on 1pm news today with the male reporter using facial expressions that showed a bit of shock that this could happen. It is the tide turning!!

The Maxine effect!!

It’s been a good day at the fundraiser, with one of us, not me, donating £500.00. I donated in line with my very small income.

The are #SadTimes for Lisa Nandy.

Currently at #6 on Most Read on the BBC News website...

Quite a jump since I made my own modest contribution a couple of hours ago.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cly4wnkvy9jo

Couldn't bring themselves to use an accurate picture of Rose though, it's so blurry.

On the question of reaching the target - it seems unlikely but maybe Christian Concern can tap into some of that money that mumsnetters were supposed to be getting from the far right. I've never seen any of that. However I hope the nurses are seeing the messages of support.

The sensible thing to have done would have been for the magnificent seven to have started a fundraiser themselves with a more modest initial target and a stretch target. If it doesnt meet its target then I imagine the nurses can start their own.

I’m a bit concerned about NFs answer to the J’s questions about nurses not being allowed solicitor as representative. Policy is, of course, that it should be a union rep or colleague as they are bound by contracts to organisation and need to abide by specific policies etc HOWEVER, the unions are captured to such an extent that they actively undermine GC staff in crisis rather than support so I wish NF had used the opportunity to embed that more into the frame of NHS high hejions following process.

The BBC article is currently in its top ten most read. Good to see it finally getting some coverage

Hope this isn't another face crime...

I was going to crack my knuckles and comment to the sisters on here who are worrying.

but the Christian centre commentary nails it.

i am a canal boater, so i would just like to share my own analogy of the trans ship.

Boats and ships do not have a reverse gear. Even if you cut the power, this will not stop the forward trajectory, nor will it immediately slow it down.

It will require a serious amount of reverse thrust to take the boat first, to a standstill, and then to gain reverse momentum.

the bigger the boat the stronger the momentum.

it just feels to me, as a helmsman that we have gotten hold of the helm, cut the power, slammed the throttle in to reverse and have just about hit standstill, a moment or two before the boat starts reversing.

There is an exciting exhilarating feeling when a boat is about to go in to reverse, you can just feel it.

a boat in reverse is much harder to steer, but my friends, i am confident we are at that point.

I hope this does not sound barking.