Another breastfeeding one

[MisssCackle]

Couldn’t see a thread on this.
In the latest of Breastfeeding batshittery..‘Breastfeeding and Lactation Support UK’ have today posted this.

I am so angered by it. The UK breastfeeding rates are amongst some of the lowest globally. We should be empowering women, not erasing them. Encouraging them to leave if they disagree?? They should be ashamed.

This is the conclusion I am coming too also. I just looked on Facebook and I am still in a great many women's groups including breastfeeding ones and I'm going to post to warn women. It's absolutely horrifying.

Can people who don’t consider themselves women just assume that post isn’t aimed at them? When I post on FB I may say, ‘Right ladies…’ or ‘hey Welsh friends…’ or ‘Local friends, can anyone…’. The people who aren’t ladies/welsh/local ignore that post. No drama.

Not for clout no, to support all new parents for antenatal education, to help improve the rates of birth trauma, to support new parents with infant feeding whether using human milk or artificial milk etc.

Wow, a blatant jab at trans people. Now we’re getting to the root cause of your issue.

I am worried if they are nurses they might get into trouble. The NMC is a nightmare. I didn’t post on mumsnet for years when I used to worry about my PIN.

That’s why I don’t think they are HCPs.

But it’s fascinating.

I do get where you're coming from and I do think it's super important to use properly inclusive language eg saying breastfeeding or chest feeding so people can feel represented/respected/ connected in that way. I think it's completely fine to say as a mama/ mother/ woman I feel xyz, but when you know there are other people in the room who do not see themselves as mamas/ women, why are you insisting on calling them that? That's the bit I think is where it becomes exclusionary and isolating for that other person.

From updates in this thread it sounds like there's been a bit of leaping to conclusions with references to mothers getting booted out of the group etc and information being left out in the OP as opposed to posters just being asked to amend their post when they're addressing everyone so it includes all the people in that group as a mixed group in a way that's respectful to everyone.

If you worked in a male dominated field as the only female staff member and every day your meetings were opened with "alright men" that would quickly make you feel unwelcome/disrespected/unseen irregardless of your views on gender identity that is someone else's experience when they're referred to as mother when that's not how they see themselves?

I have no idea what it's like to be a transman or non binary person because I'm not, but I don't think that using neutral language when I'm addressing them undermines my own identity in any way. Different when chest feeding is used INSTEAD of breastfeeding or parenthood INSTEAD of motherhood as opposed to them being used in tandem to make space for everyone? And as I said, most of the chat in my bf group (and I'm not aware of anyone who identifies as other than female being in it) start with hi everyone, or does anyone know... its really not an unusual thing in itself to do that?

Err please don’t use the term cis woman. Again, it excludes transwomen from womanhood as it reminds them that they are not cis women. That is a term invented by TERFS to try to exclude transwomen from womanhood and implement two tier womanhood. Please, do your research if you want to support trans folx, otherwise you may end up causing damage to the most vulnerable folx.

Incorrect we have ALWAYS had support regarding different feeding positions that can be used, aids that can be used such as feeding pillows for better positioning etc. We also the vast majority of the time send people many different images, support page links, videos support etc we don't only use one form of material to give support. But I'll take your suggestion on board whilst we're updating our current guides etc

To be honest, I don’t care how I’ve come across. It’s made me quite angry how people have spent all day attacking a group of people who give up a lot of time helping and supporting those who breastfeed, all over a post about inclusivity, which most people in the group have zero issues with.

So yes, I will be rude to people who are making assumptions and whatnot.

but I’m not the one being dismissive here, I’m not upset about how people like to be addressed. I still identify as a woman and a mother, I’m not that insecure that I need to always be identified that way when in a group setting.

But what if all posts started in that way? Where does that leave the person who doesn't identify in that way?

Ummm… chestfeed please. Breastfeeding is very exclusive and offensive. Thankyou

Are you a biological women? Because if you aren't then you should NOT be posing as breastfeeding support online.

Yet trans women often use the term cis women 🤦🏼‍♀️

You are tying yourself in knots over your nonsense. You must be exhausting yourself, I mean that in the kindest possible way. Nothing you are saying or doing is actually anything to do with supporting mothers.

how are you not bored yet?

Midwives can be male, health visitors can be male, gp's can be male ALL of which can and often do give breastfeeding/chestfeeding/lactation support and help. Why does someone have to be female to provide support?

Did a bit of a double take at this. A woman, needing support and advice, feeling vulnerable and perhaps desperate (I remember the lonely nights breastfeeding, needing advice and feeling completely alone in the small hours) would have her post declined for not using ideological language? You do have to wonder how many women would simply self exclude with that kind of reception.

But as long as you feel virtuous, right?

No. No they don’t. Only those pretending to be trans do so,and those well meaning folx such as yourself. I mean, how would you like it if every day you were reminded you would never be a woman and had to be referred as a transwoman, whilst those who were not trans got to be “cis” women. Do you not see how harmful that would be, please, just use “woman” it will include all those who identify as women and prevent harm to vulnerable trans folx.

So you are in fact male then?

I’m just here to educate the no doubt well meaning folx who founded this group. They seem very uneducated in how to support trans identifying folx.

Quite. To be fair, I just had a look at that group, out of interest, and they’ve got some quite exacting standards for posts and discussion in their list of rules. Some make sense and would certainly help foster a supportive environment, some… do not.

Except that’s not what happens. They say “oh heck, my bad”, edit the post to change “ladies” to “everyone” and repost. It’s really not a big deal and takes minutes at most.

They agree to the group rules when they join, they are then tagged in them as well they are well aware of the rules and any post that goes against the rules are decline otherwise what would be the point in having rules. Would your energy be the same if someone posted using racist language would you be okay with that being posted in the group?

Creepy? For being inclusive - ok