Another breastfeeding one

[MisssCackle]

Couldn’t see a thread on this.
In the latest of Breastfeeding batshittery..‘Breastfeeding and Lactation Support UK’ have today posted this.

I am so angered by it. The UK breastfeeding rates are amongst some of the lowest globally. We should be empowering women, not erasing them. Encouraging them to leave if they disagree?? They should be ashamed.

There's that "inclusive"/"exclusionary" thing again. Not inclusive of anyone who believes that if you breastfeed you are a woman, whether you like it or not.

Top level dickpandering.

Why on earth would any males need “including” in a breastfeeding support group?
Such utter tripe.
“The validity of people’s existence” !!
What the actual fuck?

We are prepared to piss off many (most?) of our target audience in order to placate a men's right group.

Isn’t this aimed at transmen?

And she’s a student midwife….

This was my thinking, aimed at transmen (aka biologically female) or non binary people who were born female. I think sometimes we can get so fixated on the issues around transwomen or non binary biological men trying to access female spaces and services that we sometimes forget that there are also biological women who also need that service but who would find it difficult without adaption. I don't see it as dickpandering at all.

So, in the name of being "inclusive", they have to exclude 99.99% of breastfeeding women, who do see themselves as ladies and mamas? How does that make sense? Oh yeah, they dont give a shit about the erasure of women, and have chosen to pander to a tiny vocal minority. I hope loads of people leave the group.

So this makes sure transmen get lactation support. It’s totally contradictory, however I can see the logic.

A better solution would surely be to have FB groups aimed at transmen who are doing pregnancy and feeding, with lactation specialists and midwives supporting them.

So none of us can refer to ourselves as women or mothers to appease the tiny minority who think they aren’t (despite having just given birth)?
How does that make sense to you?

I left a similar group that had been a huge support to me for the same reason. I overlooked the nonsense for as long as I could but the obsession with calling it chest feeding, endless navel gazing about non binaryness and identity politics was just too much. Women, only women, feed babies from their breasts, only their breasts, and I’ve never had it explained to me how the words are more of an issue than the act itself. Pregnancy and breast feeding are unique to women, if you’re not comfortable with your womanness don’t do those things. If you can breastfeed why does calling it breastfeeding cause you hurty feelings?

Its only a hop skip and a jump from not being allowed to call it breastfeeding, then goodness know what you will not be allowed to say

A better solution would surely be to have FB groups aimed at transmen who are doing pregnancy and feeding, with lactation specialists and midwives supporting them.

Of course, if that was really the intention. But I think this is more plain old virtue signalling than a serious attempt to support the surely vanishingly small number of pregnant transmen.

ETA: grammar

Sorry but chestfeeding sounds like something the xenomorphs from the alien franchise do before they burst out of your body. Even just saying "feeding" would be better.

I assume if they are feeding their babies then they havent had "top surgery" so they have breasts, which they are using for their primary purpose. If that makes them so uncomfortable then why are they doing it, let alone go through the extremely female process of pregnancy and birth?

I agree that specialist support would be beneficial for non binary or trans men who want to breastfeed for multiple reasons but it could also be quite isolating and not practical in real time. As has been recognised in this thread its a small minority group and being able to actually meet up with my bf group was really helpful to me.

To be honest, I find the need to be addressed as "lady" or "mama" in order to feel included in a group a bit bizarre. I personally dislike the term 'ladies' because of the outdated connotations and expectations about what a 'lady' is and mama's' honestly just makes me cringe a bit. Noone in my bf group has ever been told to say "everyone" and I'm not aware of anyone being non binary or transgender in my group but most of the time if someone is putting in an open message they do use exactly that term and will naturally say hey everyone. I have yet to feel excluded by that given that I know I'm a breastfeeding woman. I think sometimes there's something to picking your battles. I personally could not get worked up about this. Its still a perfectly acceptable use of language.

I don't think erasing women (or shaming women) ensures that "transmen" get support though.

I would say you can refer to yourself as whatever you want. When you're referring to other people then yes I think it's fair to be considerate even if you don't personally agree with them. I think saying everyone is a fair way to do that even if you are GC since its a term most people use anyway.

Possibly because it’s their only way to have a baby? And they want to give their babies the best start they can via breastfeeding? So need to access support via these channels that we all have access to? That would be my guess anyway.

At the same time, I will say that when it comes to actual technical terms used in explaining how to breastfeed, that I have no issue with people calling it chestfeeding if they need to (as opposed to just "feeding" to differentiate between the many different types of feeding), as long as they ALSO talk about breastfeeding and then people can decide what they feel is most applicable to themselves. Same applies for breast cancer health promotion etc.

Indeed.

It is a group of 57,000 members. What I take issue with is the quite aggressive tone of the post which will likely alienate a large majority of said members. It is not a supportive group for women who want breastfeeding support if they are being told they are essentially, not allowed to be referred to as mothers.

How can you call yourself any type of man if you choose to get pregnant and breastfeed? You might not feel like a woman with breasts but you are a woman with breasts and it’s far healthier to accept that.

Consideration is a two-way street. Where is the reciprocal consideration in the position you are arguing?

Just because you find "mama" cringe or dislike the term "ladies", doesn't mean nobody else should be able to identify with those words or use them to address their peers.

I find it a bit grating when people address a mixed group with "hey guys", but I wouldn't kick them out of a support group, shame them or tell them they're inconsiderate and hateful.

I can’t answer that as I am a born female but I could empathise with those who would do anything to have a child despite elements causing discomfort for them. As a currently breastfeeding mom I find it wild that this post is dressed behind a cloak of giving a shit about breastfeeding rates when actually it’s just another trans bashing one.

Well, isn’t calling themselves ‘breastfeeding’ support exclusionary language?

Oh goodness yes, no problem whatsoever with a transman saying chestfeeding or a councilor using the term

but i should be able to call it breastfeeding without someone throwing a wobbly