I'm confused what gender critical people want. Could someone clarify?

[Christinapple]

They want any LGBT person or supporter who makes a threat of violence arrested? Correct? For an example there was Sarah Jane Barker who made a "if you see a TERF, punch 'em in the face!" comment. There was a Glasgow protest where someone held up a cardboard sign with a guillotine crudely drawn with a crayon and "decapacitate TERFs" or something scrawled. These happened years ago and to this day the GC community still talk about and refer to them and say they should have been arrested/charged/convicted.

For another example a trans person a while back jokingly posted something like "let's give KJK a NZ welcome" on twitter which then led to a lot of angry GC people from here making police reports and brigading them (someone posted a link on here and lots went over to be abusive directly to her).

And then Graham Linehan threatens to/incites others to punch trans people in their genitalia (not his first time btw, he has a long track record of threatening and inciting abuse and violence towards LGBT people and their supporters), and yet these same GC people flock to twitter to say that it's "free speech" and "people shouldn't be arrested for online communications".

So what is it to be? If you want LGBT people arrested and charged for threats then GL would need charged too.

If you want GL to have a "legal pass" to make threats then that means it should be the same for all including LGBT people and allies.

Whatever the law is it needs to apply to everyone equally. You can't have one rule for GCs and another rule for LGBT people and allies.

Y'know I saw the title of this thread and thought

"Oh it's going to be one of those bad faith threads"

I clicked on it, and saw the OP.

I was not disappointed.

I have not wasted my time reading it.

Miss Congeniality - great film!

Although - on one level of course Miss Congeniality takes a woman who does not conform to a US version of stereotypical femininity and squishes her right into that in a beauty pagent.

But it has so many layers, her original character shied away from those stereotypical feminine traits so that she would be taken seriously in her job. She looked down on the beauty pagent women at the start. But she realised in the end that she could be gorgeous, a tough FBI agent, a good friend, good fun... the whole works.

WHO KNEW??

But I think that this group sees being "queer" as an identity in its own right. Genitals don't matter and you are considered a horrible person if you choose your partners based on that - didn't Nancy Kelly who used to run Stonewall say something about examining your prejudices if you exclude people on the basis of genitals? So they think lesbians should include trans women. But basically in their world none of it matters - being queer means you are up for everything.

Christinapple I do kind of agree with you. I don't think incitement to violence is helpful from either side.

I think there's a fine line between free speech and hate speech. I think Linehan and KJK sometimes overstep that line, as do some trans activists.

I do think 5 armed police officers for a tweet is overkill though, for either side.

As to what gender critical people want more generally, I can only answer that for myself. I want an end to medicalisation of teens identifying as trans, though I support medical treatment being available to adults (over a certain age and with careful scrutiny). I want to maintain the right to single-sex spaces and services, though I support provision of gender-neutral spaces and "open" teams in sports.

Hope that answers your question. Also I'm sure many people on here will disagree with me, which is fine, as "gender-critical people" are not a single hive mind.

Are you being deliberately obtuse?

It’s the double standards the police apply that are infuriating. Glinner said to punch trans women in the balls. TRA signs at protests have said to ‘decapitate TERFs’. Which is worse??

Dick.

👍🏼

The Miss Congeniality films are a favourite of mine, a bit like comfort food in film form 😁

oh don't get me wrong, i absolutely LOVE them

It's much worse than that. GL suggested a well-known self-defence technique when all else had failed, referring to men who were in a space they have no reasonable cause to enter. The TRA signs advocate violence against any woman who has reasonable views, protected in law, and worthy of respect in a democratic society.

Do you celebrate Miss Congeniality Day?

We do.

The message is, in the end, we’re all women. We stand together, we have something special in our sisterhood. All the make-up and bikinis are a side quest.

as "gender-critical people" are not a single hive mind.

Speak for yourself

No I've never heard of it before, but I like the message!

Ohhh when is Miss Congenality day?

Miss Congeniality Day is April 25th, because it's "not too hot, not too cold, all you need is a light jacket".

From Rhone Island’s ‘perfect date’ answer.

The perfect date!

Apparently that was a real answer to that question given by a beauty pageant (scholarship program!) contestant.

I re-watched it today 😂

Putting that in my calendar

Please don't lump LGB in with the T+ brigade. Same sex attraction is not the gender cult.
As for being GC, you will find the majority are standing up for women and girls rights that have been eroded by men. There are very few examples of GC women getting violent. The TRAs on the other hand... Definitely two tier policing going on.