Transwoman accused of sexual assault after concealing male genitalia on date

[BunfightBetty]

Could be interesting. Consent is surely only consent if you know what you're consenting to...

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-15019143/Trans-woman-sexually-assaulted-man-concealing-male-genitalia.html

I read through this thread over the course of a few hours.

Fascinating stuff that made me feel, if I'm totally honest, so very old and not to mention quite sexually out dated in view of the current curriculum which is way more inclusive and fluid now than it was when I was at school.

I'm 45 and from the days when identifying wasn't even really heard of and I never heard of anyone actually practicing it, nor did I ever read about it.

Whilst I do believe in my own mind what she did was wrong because they were much younger back then and she probably looked much different, I think eventually the laws will have to change to reflect what the youth of today are growing up with and accepting as the new inclusive norm and a safer world for all.

Love is love is the theme of the future, not just today. It is only the biological aspect that is holding us to the ground in that respect that we do still see a difference between men and women. But then we also have non binary people of all ages who are not male, nor are they female. They change sometimes too on a daily or sometimes even an hourly basis.

One thing I notice is that this wouldn't have even been an issue to be considered had she not sent him a message confirming that before the age of 7 she had lived as a male. I cant see this being much of an issue in the future as it will be a much more inclusive and accepting, safer space for everyone.

I feel concern for everyone involved and wish them all the very best if they are reading this. xx

Looks about 45! Drugs have been mentioned, and also the possibility that the victim was vulnerable in some way - though at this point we know nothing about the victim beyond him being male.

I don’t know where to even start with this.

No. The issue is not that the offender texted the victim to tell him the truth. The issue is that he didn’t tell him the truth before taking part in sexual activity.

Consent matters. Hence the conviction.

It is only the biological aspect that is holding us to the ground in that respect that we do still see a difference between men and women.

Well of course we do.

Because there is.

And we are never going to 'identify' our way out of basic, biological, verifiable fact.

I honestly despair of anyone who thinks we can.

No hes English and as je still has a penis he can't be put in a woman's jail

"Consent matters. Hence the conviction."

Yes, what I mean is, had she not pointed it out, he would have been none the wiser and would not have arrived in court.

I hope that he gets a sentence comparable to the two women mentioned upthread, eight years and ten years. The judge mentioned possible custody, which doesn't fill me with optimism.

I think the judge will have to take into consideration the changes between when he/she was at school and when these young people were. I don't think she will get any prison time.

But then we also have non binary people of all ages who are not male, nor are they female.

They are though aren’t they. They might not like it but they are.

What difference does the dates someone was at school during make to the law?

The law applies to everyone. Ignorance is no defence.

When arrested, Watkins told officers: 'Me and him had sex without me telling him I was a boy. When I let him know I was a different gender, he didn't like it.'

So from Watkins own mouth ‘I was a boy’. No woman, not girl, boy.

She? We're discussing a man trying to pass himself off as a woman.

I wonder what made Ciara tell him. Guilt? A wish to continue the relationship but knowing he'd be unable to keep his secret much longer? Just generally being an idiot?

@TheseWordsAreMine Hypothetically, suppose a transwoman has penetrative sex with a biological woman. The transwomen does not tell her that she is penetrating her with a real penis. The biological woman only finds out later and would not have agreed to this if she had known. Would you consider that rape?

Love is love?!

Am I understanding right, you're saying that the problem here is the victim being not 'accepting' enough?!

Please say I've got the wrong end of the stick.

we also have non binary people of all ages who are not male, nor are they female

No, we don't.

Love is love is the theme of the future

Really? I'd re-think that saying if I were you as it is one used by those who wish to have sex with children, want to be associated with that do you?

I think that is what the poster meant.

I would say it's a load of old guff but actually it's far more offensive than that. Cool girl is not a good look when someone has been sexully assaulted

I'd go with wanting to continue the relationship.

@TheseWordsAreMine theres a lot to disagree with in your posts. I’m going to start with two points.

Rape is rape when the victim is unconscious and doesn’t know.
Sex by deception is illegal whether the victim finds out or not.
It disgusts me that you think it’s ok as long as the victim doesn’t find out. Really disgusting.

Speaking of disgusting, you may be unaware, ‘love is love’ is the slogan of paedophile apologists. You may want to think about it a little harder. Saying love is love is dangerous. Sometimes love is a crime- incest, abuse, pedophilia. Not all ‘love’ is equal.

It is only the biological aspect that is holding us to the ground in that respect that we do still see a difference between men and women. But then we also have non binary people of all ages who are not male, nor are they female. They change sometimes too on a daily or sometimes even an hourly basis.

This takes the Olympic Gold for total and utter risible nonsense.

Errr….. so so many incorrect things in one post. Bless you. What HE did was sex by deception. Why are you trying to minimise that? Are you saying we should scrap the offences of sex by deception and sexual assault? Why? Are you saying it’s ok for someone to coerce someone into non consensual sex? You’re condoning rape? Why are you wishing someone who coerced someone into non consensual sex the best?

p s non binary people are in fact male and female. They’re just attention seeking idiots. Sex is immutable and binary.

Was the biological woman there when it happend?

It's rather hard (pardon the pun) not to notice the difference. If it was in the dark I suppose that could happen. However, sex is sex at the end of the day, it's up to the two of them to find out what's happening before it takes place. You cant get around that unless they met in the dark and never saw each others bodies.

I don't really see how your scenario could ever happen in the first place. It rather paints the biological women as you explain in a rather bimbo like light that radiates only ignorance, even if they are in pitch black darkness.

What would the biological woman possibly think was going on other than a penis unless it was stated something was going to have to be added in order for that to take place? It's not rape no, she consented and I hope a woman like that in 2025 doesn't exist.

I read through this thread over the course of a few hours

Not with much attention, it seems.

The British Heart Foundation print cushions with that quote on it. It's an LGBTQI+ slogan.

Most definitely that is rape.

For one thing, there are risks associated with penises (pregnancy, STDs) which do not apply in the other scenario.

But it's just generally wrong and I imagine someone experiencing that would feel very violated.