My therapist seems politically opposed to my feminist views

[idontknowhowtodreamyourdreams]

I didn't know where else to post this and could do with a sense check/ideas as to how to deal with this.

I've been seeing a therapist for about a year for a range of issues, including substance misuse and recovering from abuse during my childhood and teens (sexual, violence). We've spoken about some really difficult and personal things that I have never discussed before and I have felt that the therapy has been useful. I thought I trusted him and trust is not an easy thing for me.

I'm a GC feminist. I'm also a lawyer and so I tend to have a legal lens on some of the debates around issues of trans rights and the rights of women and girls. I have talked in therapy about how I have found the tone of the debate around trans rights increasingly upsetting and hostile (on one side) and I had been upset over the discussion re the Supreme Court and the Equality Act. I've talked about both this and how hard it can be to feel like there's no space for women to express certain views without being dismissed or labelled.

My error (I totally accept I shouldn't have looked, but he should have locked down his settings) - I looked and saw a pic on SM of him at a protest. I don't want to out myself or him but he was holding a banner basically slagging off the Supreme Court.

And now I feel . . . the trust has gone. Has he been quietly judging me while I shared some frankly painful stuff? Does he respect my perspective? As I don't know if I can work with someone who doesn't. It's not a difference in political views, I feel like my views on these issues are fundamentally part of who I am as a person.

I know I crossed a boundary and shouldn't have looked, but would appreciate any thoughts as to whether I am being overly sensitive and/or whether it's something I should bring up.

Or maybe I am just wrong to care? Thoughts welcome!

MrsSunshine2b, you're bonkers, and if you really think anybody who knows your real name isn't looking you up on social media any time they have the slightest interest in doing so, you may get a nasty surprise some time! Anything on the web that somebody can read, they may read - if you don't want people reading something, learn to use the privacy filters the platforms provide, or don't write it! Since I just googled your mn nickname, you're also wrong about private schools and weight loss injections ;-)

@MrsSunshine2b 🙄🤣 You're incorrect and to be honest, appear totally lacking in understanding of social media, therapy and boundaries In general.

I haven't lied or done anything wrong or unethical. Of that I am confident.

You've shared your view, I don't need to hear it again.

I'm not in the least bit bothered what you think I'm wrong about.

If you're looking up your therapist on social media you're creepy and have massively misunderstood his role in your life.

The therapist should lock down his profile but only clients with boundary issues will have looked him up. I've had therapy in the past and wouldn't have dreamed of even trying to investigate my therapist's personal life because I know how to mind my own business.

I can share it as many times as I like- clearly you don't understand how the internet works.

@YappyEaglet thanks very much for sharing your perspective on this, it's v helpful.

@MrsSunshine2b yes, correct, you can continue to share it. And the rest of us can stop listening because it's a bit deranged. 👋

With therapy, responsibility for boundaries sits much more with the therapist than the client. That’s what my therapist told me. It would be weird if the therapist had looked up the OP’s socials or followed her. But ok for it to be the other way around. He should have his personal socials locked down so clients can’t see them, anyway, I would have thought.

It is absolutely the role of the therapist to establish appropriate boundaries. Never the client's. When trying to find a family therapist I searched extensively, including social media. Perfectly normal. My friends who are therapists/teachers/doctors/police officers all have their SM under assumed names and only ever allow access to immediate friends and family. That is the responsible thing to do.

I agree with whoever said that by having his SM unprotected he was making a statement and wanted it to be publicly visible. He's put a flag in the ground.

As for his creating enough of a safe space for you to already be vulnerable and so is doing a "good job"..... OK. It's the boiled frog. What do abusers do? They make their victims seem safe so that any transgressions, micro aggressions, are dismissed - the victim believes the abuser has their best interests at heart - anything experienced negatively has to be reframed as being "for my own good". The escalation can be over years, absolute trust is abused.

Only you can make the decision @idontknowhowtodreamyourdreams - but if it were me I know I would be guarded once I'd discovered this - and that would be expensively unproductive therapy.

You never know OP, you might be able to turn him to the light. But you'd be paying him, to do it!

Hope your next session is equally useful as the last one.

@Charabanc 🤣 I don't pay to educate people - maybe he could pay me ....

I suppose at least now he may reflect on it a bit more. We'll see how it goes.

I'm not saying you should have zero idea who your therapist is, of course even if appointments are outside of the home therapists will have clues of their life (their fashion, a wedding ring, tattoos etc there can be lots) but did you find yourself googling your therapist between sessions or researching into the things you knew like her books etc to try and guage a picture of her outside of therapy and the kind of opinions she might hold about you? That's the difference, if you are making who your therapist is outside of therapy a focus for you instead of the work, especially focusing on how your therapist feels about you, it's something to bring up with your therapist so they can guide you through why that's happen and redirect your focus back to yourself.

I'm not saying they're an empty vessel, I'm saying who they are in the therapeutic space is who they are to you - not a friend or someone "in your life". It's tempting and common for clients to blur that when you're being so intimate with someone to want to gather a picture of them outside therapy or worry about if they like you, how they perceive you etc which is why I said your therapist wouldn't be surprised but the most helpful thing you can do is be honest with him and talk about it. You say you haven't lied, but you haven't disclosed to him that you looked this up and how it made you feel even though you want to discuss the SC ruling with him but you're leaving out the most relevant info. You can discuss the ins and outs of a secondary trauma like the ruling for years and years and you'll get absolutely nowhere. If you can be honest with him he will helpfully redirect your talks to what this brings up in you and why it's triggering you so much. It's really up to you if you are in therapy to do the work and achieve your goals, or if you want to deflect (and pay a fortune!) to discuss your opinions but he's only going to validate you regardless of his opinions (that's because he is there in a professional capacity) and try to talk about why it's triggering you recently and you'll be omitting the very relevant info that this issue and wanting to discuss it is because you feel it's affected your therapeutic relationship. If you won't say that, then yes you are kind of lying but you're only cheating yourself 🤷🏾‍♀️

try to talk about why it's triggering you recently

I'm not sure that "Discovering my therapist believes in gender woo and I am now doubting his opinion" is being "triggered"?

I used that word in reference the words OP used to describe her emotional state - crying after the session for example as well as how she said she wants what the SC brings up for her in view of her previous trauma. I'm not sure why you put quotes around triggered and I hope you're not reading the word triggered as the crass social media usage. In terms of trauma and therapy triggered is absolutely appropriate to use when discussing trauma in therapy and it's applicable when your current emotions are being affected by past events and current events that reminds you of them.

However some things about a therapist do matter for the therapeutic relationship. That's why many therapists do have public social media (good for marketing and also sharing information on mental illness and health) and also they are often willing to, whether they have public social media or not, to share their views on major issues. I ask therapists during the 15 minutes initial phone call and/or intake about their political views on major human right (race, abortion, bodily autonomy, voting, awareness of disability and chronic illness) sort of topics because it matter to how I will interact with them in the space - do they actually care about the groups I'm part of, do they affirm me and care about those issues. If they don't agree with them or have no opinion - that shows be they're either against me in those ways or are indifferent to me and my groups which won't work with me. I do search up therapists before I meet with them (that's often how I find them, and I'll look for info on them, training and views and often now therapists have public social media, so I check to see if they do. I also do this with doctors because they'll often have info on their history, any research or publications and specialisms).

I think that's totally fair! Absolutely do your research and pick your therapist based on what works for you and what criteria matters to you however I'm not sure I agree with writing off therapists who have "no opinion" because most likely of course they do have an opinion, it's just irrelevant to their practice and it should be. Has this approach found you a therapist you've been able to successfully work with? That's all that matters really, it's unclear from your post whether you have found one you can work with or are still meeting several.

Personally with the 15 minute screening calls I always advise that your best bet is really getting details on the modalities your therapist works with, laying out your primary issues and goals in therapy and asking for their experience is helping clients with similar issues and goals and how they like to work i.e frequency required, recommended number of sessions etc because these can really differ and clients have different preferences. If you're able to cover everything about you and the work you're wanting to do and interview them on a range of political issues that's great. I still would suggest not to write off those not sharing their opinion with you as being against you or not considering you. The amount of info a therapist will disclose really depends on their specialisms and the type of therapy they deliver, so you could be writing off a really good fit for you in terms of what they can do for you, solely because how they work involves keeping a more traditional boundary between therapist and client.

TL;DR The relationship between therapist and client and the relevance of discussing secondary issues or any self disclosure by a therapist really depends on the type of therapy you're doing and in any modality imo it should only be done if it has benefit to the client in the specific work they're doing.

You may already know this but anyone offering therapy to adopted children has to be registered with Ofsted. Not every therapist is experienced enough or can be trusted not to let their feelings get in the way, which is why the Gov put the restrictions in place.

I am mentioning this because it is a good example of therapy not depending on the modality but on the personal feelings of the therapist and how these were influencing treatment.

Adopters we're being undermined by therapists who prioritised the birth family - calling the birth parents "your real mum and dad" and using the adopters' first names for example.

Anyway, under your very rosy view of therapists, this should not have been necessary. All these therapists should have been able to put their personal feelings aside and dealt with the client in a thoroughly professional way.

But they didn't/ couldn't, to the point where the Gov acted.

No one is going to do similar on other issues which arouse strong feelings, like polical affiliation, gender critical views. You have to manage it by yourself.

It is properly damaging to work with someone you believe despises you. I mentioned before how I adopted two children and gave up work to look after them and my female therapist was clearly bewildered/ angry with me for it. She said some unforgivable things - apologised at the next session after discussion with her supervisor but she couldn't take them back and I couldn't work with her any more.

I definitely do that - I was talking about multiple experiences all of them in the past. But I'm likely to be doing it again in a few months.

In the 15 minute call I do start with modality (though most have that on their website so I already know), I normally ask how they implement the modality and their experience and how they work etc. I then ask about views and the reason 'no opinion' is bad for me is 1. If you don't care that's also bad in respect to the issue because it means you aren't affected or people you know aren't affected or affected enough for you to engage and have a stance (silence is accepting the behaviour in my view). 2. It may not be relevant now but it may be later in our work 3. I think all the questions and specific views I ask about are relevant, because I don't ask on small issues just big one, that focus on rights (I wouldn't ask about pension policy and how they think we need to deal with them, that's detailed and irrelevant), I ask about big rights (race issues, which matter to me and add nuanced detailed to my life as a Black women, gender issues, abortion, bodily autonomy, disability issues which again matter as I often end up linking things to my chronic illness issues and also sexuality as a bisexual person and also things generally on rights for refugees, BAME groups, religion (even though I'm non religious and would want non religious therapy, I still want someone who isn't antagonist towards other religions), class issues as well. The reason I care is because for me these things are about fundamental values, and how they approach the world, so if we don't match on these things (give or take) then I don't feel safe in their space, and I don't feel that we'll work well at all.

For me a therapist with those 'traditional boundaries' likely wouldn't be for me as if imagine they have similar attitudes to other things which don't work for me (self disclosure, being a blank face/overly neutral therapist). All fine, just not what I want and I've had that before and didn't like it at all. I don't ask on small issues again just big political themes - I wouldn't ask in as much detail as I have above, just 2/3 general questions overall and maybe follow-up depending on what they say. The therapy I had years ago (through a system, I didn't know anything about modality and things and it wasn't for me, the therapist even acknowledged that), as I've gone on, I now know the modalities that work and with therapists in those modalities they've never had a problem with the questions and self disclosure and have boundaries I feel are fair but also help be build a relationship and feel safe in the space.

I need someone as @Arran2024 mentions who has the same beliefs on major rights issues (some impacting my life and rights every day) because I don't believe or accept the 'neutral' in the space argument as it will, subconsciously impact the bond and it matters deeply to me, I don't want someone who just says I disagree with this major right issue but in the room with you, I won't. I don't believe that's truly possible for major issues (not small irrelevant things), and I don't want that even if they can do it.

I agree I think there are unfortunately a lot of inexperienced and unprofessional therapists around, in fact there are a lot that offer services they aren't qualified to be provided. I think regulations like requiring them to register with Ofsted is a great example of regulating which therapists can see those clients because in the days of the internet you do have some people listing everything under the sun as their specialism. I definitely don't have a "rosy" view of therapists, but I respect the professionalism and training of those properly qualified and registered with a proper governing body. I also really recommend if possible finding a therapist who doesn't just work solo / privately and still works in larger teams or organisations as well.

I did see your earlier post, and I'm sad to hear you had such an experience. Of course you couldn't keep working with her but I don't think she should be working with any clients if she made such comments. Again though to be clear, when I am talking about self disclosure from a therapist depending on the modality, I am for example sometimes a therapist might share if they have been through something similar in their past only if and when it's particularly relevant and helpful to the client, sharing their opinions or judgements on the client isn't acceptable in any modality.

I've only read your updates, OP, so I don't know if this has been mentioned. But I read the 'Ask A Therapist' sub over on Reddit sometimes, and a client looking up a therapist's social media is an issue that comes up fairly often. Most of the therapists on that sub say that it's not intrusive at all, and in fact they pretty much expect clients to look them up -- it's just natural curiosity about someone you're sharing so much with.

You haven't done anything wrong. It's on your therapist to lock down his SM if it has things on there he wouldn't want his clients to see. As a vaguely similar relationship in terms of the power dynamics, I'm a writing teacher who also has a career as an author, and I'm not surprised or offended in the least when students check out my social media (though they're probably disappointed as I don't have much of a presence anymore!).

Good luck. I think you're handling this beautifully and I admire your courage in tackling this with him.

I think it's great you know what you're looking for and I really hope you find a good therapist next time you look. I can understand from a screening perspective if you know these issues are going to be interconnected with what you'll be discussing it sounds like it's really helpful for you to assess therapists (which is bloody hard in 15 minutes!!) in that way especially if it's found you a good match in the past. I think for some of your list it's surely more about finding out how educated your therapist is on the issues rather than if they affirm/ agree. I'm not sure I think anyone who disagrees with disability rights for example should ever be a therapist 😟 but I can see how someone being very familiar with the impacts a disability has is more valuable than a therapist that doesn't know much on the issue.

I still professionally believe that in the course of therapy it's not helpful to discuss these issues in the details and specifics as we would with primary trauma so I'm not sure within the work when it would be helpful to discuss if you agree/disagree on a particular issue because with secondary issues the work in therapy needs to be about it's impact on you personally and your mental health, rather than going over the abstract itself if that makes sense. It might be cathartic to talk about what's going on in the world and want your therapist to agree or disagree with you in the room, unless you're digging into the topic with it's focus being on you and the issues that have brought you to therapy and how they tie together it's not good work and I'd expect any therapist worth their salt to be redirecting the discussion rather than engaging regularly in talking about stances on political issues without directing it back to the clients issues.

It doesn't sound like you're doing this, you've explained you are more wanting to match with a therapist on that basis, but in OPs case she has been doing good work with this therapist and making progress which is why I recommended her full disclosing what she found out so the discussion with her therapist can be more fruitful 😊

Yes you're right, for me I've had therapists who lacked education on things around disability (which I didn't plan on discussing but it impacts my life so it obviously came up quite a bit) and it did make it more difficult for me. I also leave quite a bit of these questions for intake as I'm aware 15 minutes is not a lot of time.

Of course these are secondary issues (not all of them for me personally, the race, disability and gender stuff impacts me a lot day to day and has impacted my primary trauma issues or how it was dealt with after, which is also now traumatic for me) - so I don't spend time asking about it in sessions that I'm paying for - I do however want to know for safety issues and also building a therapeutic relationship that's strong so ask before we start in the 15 minute phone call and/or intake. Yes I do think some of what you're saying makes sense regarding the OP - she should, and in my earlier posts I also said this, be honest with how what she found makes her feel (which she's done and I think is good) as it can he good for repair work with a therapist and also important as she's making strong progress with a therapist whose good aside from this issue and it's better to repair the relationship by taking about how it affected her etc than start all over again (other than if its a major unethical thing the therapist has done and OP may think - depending on his response yhis is too much for her to ignore). She may decide to bring up how she found it - I recommend this because then he will know she saw the post - and can have the opportunity to explain more personally how he still respects her, why he did it. Whereas now he think they're still talking more generally. But looking at SM on its own, is normal and shows normal curiosity - I've done it before (normally near starting with a therapist, as I learn to trust them) or when looking for a new therapist.

How do you know what's a primary or secondary issue though? Surely many people go into therapy thinking they have a primary issue but it turns out to be something completely different?

Definitely a lack of education on key demographics can be a deal-breaker because the therapist can unconsciously be dismissive or not recognise their impact. In OPs case if she has seen this before starting work with her therapist, I'd probably advise her to look for someone else because from the start there could be a potential issue of OP feeling unsafe or uncomfortable. However because she's got an established relationship that's working for her I really believe it's something they can work through and actually could be really beneficial work for the OP for them to talk about it openly. Especially for disclosing that she did look up his social media because although very normal and common, there could be really useful information in the particular time or headspace that led her to do so.

I'm sorry again you've encountered those who have been uneducated on keys things for you but I'm glad you sound like you really know what you're looking for in a therapist and I wish you all the best finding your next one.

By primary and secondary I mean in relation to the OPs experience, so the things we have personally directly gone through and the things happening outside of us that trigger them. It's important work with a primary trauma to slowly eventually be able to go through the experience, it's details and specifics, in full in order to process it and begin to live along with it. When a client is triggered by a secondary issue (so seeing a news item that brings up feelings) it's then not actually got any therapeutic benefit to focus too much on the specifics of that secondary trigger without directing it back to the client and their experiences. For example, I have had some jewish clients triggered by and wanting to discuss Oct 7th, because it's understandably brought up things they have experienced in their lives but it's a secondary issue, so the discussion can't be spent too long on the geopolitics or horrific specifics of what happened on October 7th, instead we want to dig into what that's brought up in their own personal experiences and emotions, or any core beliefs it's triggering. I feel the SC ruling is similar to OP. Her feelings and it being in her thoughts is understandably relevent due to her past experience, but discussing it as a ruling or the sides for or against it is less helpful than figuring out what it's touching for her on a deeper level.

Thought this might make for interesting reading OP!

Navigating thorny topics in therapy