NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #44

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence had been intended to be 28 July with 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing was to have ended on 30 July. However, it became apparent as the hearing progressed that this schedule wouldn't be followed.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.
Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 42: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379820-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-42 25 July 2025 to 25 July 2025
Thread 43: mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379979-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-43 25 July 2025 to 26 July 2025

answer my own question www.gov.uk/government/publications/how-to-join-a-cloud-video-platform-cvp-hearing/how-to-join-cloud-video-platform-cvp-for-a-video-hearing

Reading - I keep meaning to try Terry Pratchett. Would welcome recommendations, particularly anything that would work on audible as a first for 11 yr old (we have a long car journey soon)
@Bluebootsgreenboots If you don't find a Pratchett (and love Roger Allam's voice) he does a really good narration of Scarlett Thomas's Dragon's Green. I think we listened to it at about that age.

We also listened to a lot of Anthony Horowitz's Alex Rider series in the car too (Oliver Chris is a great narrator too).

Well there's a bit of a difference between 3000 and 24 pages.

Means (I think) witness appears via Cloud Video Platform.

from herald
10:36am
Private deliberations are now taking place to consider whether it's possible to recall Ms Peggie.
Ms Russell said she will need 20 minutes to consider the new evidence, which is around 24 pages.
The two new witnesses Ms Cunningham wants to call will discuss conversations from a "Benidorm group chat" while the other person looks to give evidence on the "culture of fear" at NHS Fife.
Back at 11am.

NC: I've got to get Pete in and he's a busy man, he fitting a new bathroom at number 31 and he still waiting for the part for the boiler at West Street. He has to drop everything and rush into the F CR several times a weeks, it playing hell with his schedule.

Please share if you find out.
My prescription has changed another +.050 since I started following these threads

What is a CVP witness?

I'm a long-time lurker so I wanted to say thanks for all the fantastic, commentary, insight and brilliant humour here.
You're all a mine of information.

I'm only following here.

So new witnesses for Sandie's side to:

• refute claim she is racist?
• back up idea that they too didn't like male in changing room?
• refute the scientific sex is complicated nonsense?

Which of these or don't we know?

@FlirtsWithRhinosI can’t attach the image, it’s fabulous!
Oh I have got it!

do you mean the pickles or the latest iteration in this astonishing tribunal?

Pickle Sisters I can believe, but the pickle NHS Fife has got itself into seems like it might be a glitch in the AI matrix.

I assume cvp is video link?

From TT

NC - I'm afraid there has been a change in my x plan, given that MC say that bio sex is not binary and very complicated, it's time consuming to unpick something like that

Fifer : oh dear, there a thick mist descending over JR, like some kind of mid-morning FAFO Haar.

JR - I'm concerned MC is only involved in one issue in the case

Fifer : well aye, that's before she startit rewriting human biology based on whatever pish she read on Facebook and the Reddits, in court. Without needin asked by the way. Entirely self-instigated rake-face intersection, entered into volun-fuckin-terily.

J - I haven't heard all her evidence
J - say we finish with MC by 12, <missed Tuesday aft plan> J I have something on Weds a 11 am, start subs at 9 on Wednesday, resume after lunch, then Thursday at 9 am. Normally in Scotland we have submissions immediately after evidence, I would need persuading that we should do anything different.

NC - can we come back to you on that? See if we can find a day in September, one of my concerns is whether the Tribunal itself will have the ability to absorb our subs on the legal position.

J - I have to see your subs first to be able to answer that.

Fifer : Big Sond is intrigued, but also pissed aff that his entire week's gowf schedule is curlin up the lum in real time.

NC - can we come back to you on that, establish feasibility of a day in Sept, don't want t

J - don't want to go part heard again.

<J& Panel discussing>

J - application under rule 36 do you have comments?
NC - none
J - JR said 3,000 pages, you said 24 which is correct
NC - 24 pages

J - much more manageable

Fifer : that's code for FUCK YE ON ABOOT WI 3000 PAGES YA NOB

JR - 2 new witness tomorrow aft?

J - we need to look at material and consider, how long
NC - that's up to JR
JR - its 24 pages, manageable, 1 wit on group chat, 1 wit on other objections to CR.
J - we need to think about all this

JR - we object to CVP witness, all other witnesses have appeared in person

Fifer : aye except that one guy that got a note fae his mum ye mean? He didn't appear at all, nae submission nor nothin.

J - we need to consider all of this, anything else, 20 minute break. Court rises. Morning thread will continue here

Big Sond eyes the Hoggs of Fife carrier bag in its usual corner. He moves them into a more prominent position, so that they are impossible not to see as you enter his chambers. The message is clear.

FAFO BBACO

Fuck aroon, fun oot! Big bits are comin oot!

It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of light, it was the season of darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair.
It was the Gayest of times, it was the Saddest of times

Now a climate of panic and shame over this shit show. They have recognised that the whole of NHS Fife are coming across of inept eejits and want to do something to save their own reputations

3000 pages or 24 pages
Another demonstration of the hyperbole of the TRAs

J - JR said 3,000 pages, you said 24 which is correct
NC - 24 pages
J - much more manageable

It just feels like no one on the NHS Fife side including JR would know the truth if it bit them on the arse.

How is it even remotely professionally ok for JR to have exaggerated this to such an extent?

This is wonderful! thank you for sharing. Just when you think you've seen everything weird and wonderful that the internet can provide...
😂

I read the Bromeliad Trilogy over 30 years ago I think. I didn't realise Bromeliad was a pune (or play on words) until about 2022. The number of undiscovered puns that still lurk waiting to trap the unexpected!

@BoiledbeetleI would love one of your images on a Tshirt it a tote bag; would you mind?
I love Sad Times !

This is exciting. Wish they’d stop pissing about though so we can get onto JR inevitably making things worse with her own sides witnesses

Nooooooooooooo to another extension.

I wonder are the new witnesses colleagues who didn't speak up at the time and are now feeling regretful, seeing what JR & co are trying to do to SP's reputation, as a nurse and as a human being?

Hi Pete

Thirding (fourthing?) Bromeliad (Truckers, Diggers, Wings) trilogy, and the Carpet People for an 11 year old. My (much older than 11 now) son continues to be deeply, deeply disappointed that there is only one Carpet People book.