NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #42

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 February 2025 and was expected to last 2 weeks. However, after 2 weeks it was not complete and it adjourned part-heard. It resumed on 16 July and the last day of evidence will be 28 July and then there will be 2 days of submissions from counsel meaning that the hearing will end on 30 July.

The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton gave evidence from Thursday 6 February to Wednesday 12 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely was obtainable by sending an email request to [email protected] by 5pm on Wednesday 9 July. Detailed instructions were provided here:

drive.google.com/file/d/16-9POEZ7yHWUr6EmbfquJZO18Gv78bSm/view

The hearing is being live tweeted by x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-005 and tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr-bd6. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.ph/WSSjg.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: nitter.net/tribunaltweets or nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Links to previous threads #1 to #40 can be found in this thread: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379717-sandie-peggie-list-of-threads-covering-employment-tribunal-and-afterwards

Thread 41: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5379334-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-41 24 July 2025 to 25 July 2025

R - no comment is that weird incident appeared before this one
JB - I get the logic but these can be moved about, it's how the evidence was produced. Not given access to files to check
JR - it's possible things weren't moved
JB - yes

JB didn't have access to all the files, so JR can say 'ah but you didn't have access to all the files'

The gun might not be smoking but someone’s been shot and the gun’s right there…

She risks being like Gill Bigelow on Line of Duty, calling for an urgent exit that never comes.

JR - so not saying misleading
JB - no
JR - anything else to say ???? ???
JR - one explanation for diff pathways, DU moved everything to file during meeting
JB - yes
JR - PD gave evidence that scsh were taken during teams, you in a position to say not
JB - no

Strong finish by JR.

I do think Sandies team should have let JB examine the phone itself.

It would stop any doubts.

I’m not very techie but have been taking lots of screenshots for some instructions about a niche bit of software this week, adding arrows and references (and have been cropping the screen so they don’t notice I was on X and Mumsnet). Is it being suggested that some extra dates were hurriedly pasted in over the screenshots from another doc (but the font was a slightly different colour)? Have I misunderstood?

Could the judge make an order to seize the phone now?

I would have thought that he was paid if he is providing the evidence during normal working hours.

But that makes me wonder - what happens if you work part time or shifts and are called to give evidence outside your normal working hours?

She is being so combative! This guy isnt going to lie for either side can she not be respectful or do we reserve that for Dr U only?

Thank the Lord! No further questions

She's done!

Wow only 5 minutes not 10!

Someone earlier said they thought JR's criticisms of JKB's writing is classist, and I think I agree. He's got letters after his name, but he was in the military first, so maybe not an academic like her. I know lots of ex-military guys and I'd trust them over a smart-arse barrister any day.

From TT

JB - the scsh to the left appears to say the framework appeared
JR - no comment is that weird incident appeared before this one
JB - I get the logic but these can be moved about, it's how the evidence was produced. Not given access to files to check
JR - it's possible things weren't moved
JB - yes
JR - 10 more mins?
J - yes
JR - 1695 - your report. you say scsh5 was accessed in downloads, 6 in doc/med/work, and that implies not downloaded in meeting
JB - was curious yes
JR - indicate that trib beingm isleaded?
JB - was curious, everything downloaded in meeting would have gone to downloads
JR - so not saying misleading
JB - no
JR - anything else to say ???? ???
JR - one explanation for diff pathways, DU moved everything to file during meeting
JB - yes
JR - PD gave evidence that scsh were taken during teams, you in a position to say not
JB - no

Fifer : Speccie Loddie cannae lee tae save himsel. It's a weel kent Speccie Loddie Initials Plus Computers For A Company Name trait.

True, but this guy is ex-mil, he may not have the social graces of a civvy boffin. I don't think it discredits his expertise, just that JR has nothing else to throw at him.

I can understand Upton, relatively new to the hospital, not knowing the name of the scary intimidating nurse, but remembering her face.

I can understand Upton going back to those notes and inserting her name once Upton learned it.

If the notes were something private to help Upton through the experience on placement I can understand Upton leaving it at that.

But I absolutely cannot understand how, once it was known that this was going to go before a tribunal and form part of the sworn legal evidence, Upton, allegedly intelligent, allegedly professional, did not at that stage insert a clarifying rider explaining that timeline. Mind numbing, jaw dropping, boggling stupidity.

JR pointing out that some of the 'added later' was only a few mins later

I'm not sure it would be worth it at this point. The case is clearly leaning on one direction.

JR is totally making it worse. She is extracting more evidence of additional inconsistencies in the screenshots.

It seems almost like she is trying to put clear blue water between Fife and Upton, ie make clear Upton has tampered with evidence Fife has relied on, so she can say “there is now a conflict between my clients” ? But of course that would not be in the interest of Upton who is still her client so that can’t be what is going on. I have no reason at all to doubt her professionalism (not being snarky at all, I really don’t).

JR is being put in a very uncomfortable position by this evidence as neither witness can account for the obvious inconsistencies. I wonder if she will be speaking to the bar ethics advice line in the lunch break. I would be thinking about it if I was her.

I think you’ll find DU’s phone has mysteriously disappeared or been replaced. Sad times.

Perhaps JR was suggesting "I'm at a loss (to understand / explain discrepancies)" meant "I'm at a (financial) loss if my report doesn't say what my instructing agents want it to say"?

DU writes Rahana as ‘Rihanna’ in his (diary of Teddy Upton 12) uncompliant women, evidence notebook.

hard to believe the msm would pay any heed to it....

BBC and Guardian say 'hold my beer'.

Was that an option do we know?

Never say clearly remember Casey Anthony 😬

I think Upton refused - would only give info to Fife

Hahaha - I keep getting reminded of the primary school joke -
How many letters in alphabet?
26
No 22, JR got shot & ET went home