Why is anti-trans so important?

[Elizabethbd]

So, I will preface this with saying that I’m not in the UK, and my country does not yet have the kind of anti-trans debate as there is in the English speaking world.

So, I have a hard time understanding why this is such an important question to many women.

Surely there are women’s issues that affect a larger part of society.

I’m thinking rape and violence towards women, homelesness, sex trafficking and honour killings. Why are these issues not more important and worthy of attention, as they affect so many more women than those who come into contact with trans women (or men)?

Exactly! Female only spaces are so important to vulnerable women, and when you allow a male person in they are no longer female only and cannot serve their intended purposes.

@MageQueen I genuinely wonder how much misunderstanding there is out there.

It would explain a lot.

They're men. They're a collective threat to us in exactly the same way that all men are.

I'm irish but living in the UK. I'm only responding to someone here who said they felt threatened by trans women in bathrooms.... I said I feared men more than trans women that's it. Then they doubled down with ridiculous interpretation of statistics.

Like I'm not totally in disagreement with you, I'm sure I would be considered a transphobe I don't really understand the sporting events/prison situation, like I'm not involved in those areas and totally see valid points from your side regarding that Plus i dont really agree with young kids transitioning (but then i dont have a trans kid).... I'm just saying I don't feel like trans women pose any more threat to me I'm a public bathroom than a cis woman mainly because there are just way more cis women.

Beetle it’s my most asked question to the TRA’s. Someone, anyone, please attempt to answer!! For the love of India Willoughby!

I said I feared men more than trans women that's it

And @Eolhc1990 can you explain how you tell the difference between a man and a transwoman, given you fear one but not the other.

I feel like they are less of a threat than cis het men for 2 reasons.

1. There are so few trans women less than 0.3%.

1. Largely I feel (maybe incorrectly) that trans women are mostly interested in men so while I'm quite masculine looking I don't think I'd float their boat.... same reason why I'd prefer to share a bathroom with a gay man than a straight man.

That's just where I'm coming from.

Ha that was meant to say 1 and 2 doh

I said I feared men more than trans women that's it. Then they doubled down with ridiculous interpretation of statistics.

You'll find that confirmation bias happens a lot around here.

And I very much agree with you. I've never felt threatened by the presence of trans-women, in my bathroom or not. I find those who do - without actual, verifiable evidence - rather sad, and those who attempt to misuse statistics in the desperate hope people won't pull them up on it, intellectually dishonest.

Well if someone presents as female then I assume they are a woman or a trans some if someone presents as a man I assume they are a man or a trans man.... im not going to be pulling down their pants to take a look. Hence why the whole bathroom debate is so ridiculous

I have an on-going employment tribunal court case which will hopefully see males who 'identify' as women being kicked out from female only spaces like toilets, changing rooms and showers in workplaces, please search for Faye Russell-Caldicott at crowdjustice.com

It's a very real thing now in workplaces where males go into female spaces, supported by trans staff policies, and women who don't want to share with a 'nice' male don't feel like the space is usable anymore and self-exclude. I can't think of many other contexts where the impact is often daily, i.e. workplaces, so of course it matters a lot.

That’s not what I asked. I asked - how can one tell the difference between an innocent trans woman (male) from a not so innocent male (also male).

Without relying on clothes, hair make-up etc How does one present as a woman or a man?

Here's the thing.

If you did understand the prison situation, you might understand why it is completely illogical to feel safer around trans women than other men.

A random trans woman is not less likely to harm you than a random man. The prison statistics would indicate that the opposite is most likely true. This is probably due to the link between paraphilias of all kinds, and committing sex crimes.

When you sort male prisoners by offence committed, more than half of trans women prisoners have been convicted of a sexual offence, compared to only 16% of other male prisoners. That's quite a stark difference, isn't it?

We know that trans identifying men have committed violent offences ranging from indecent exposure to sexual assault to rape, murder and attempted murder. We've read it in the papers. We know their names. We've seen them posting pictures of themselves masturbating in women's toilets online. We've seen them threatening women with rape and murder and disfigurement, both online and in real life. Some of them even posed for a selfie with some Scottish MEPs while brandishing a placard calling for TERFs to be decapitated.

In what world do you think people in this group pose the same level of threat to you as my friend's mum Janice who is just popping into the ladies' loos during a trip to M&S?

Like in what context? In a public bathroom? If there is someone in a female bathroom I'm going to assume they are identifying as female..... such a weird question

And if a male had introduced himself with a male name to you in a work meeting only a couple years ago and he was obviously male and then suddenly there was a staff email saying he'll be using female facilities, which happened to include open plan showers, would you stop using it or share the space?

What does it mean when someone 'presents as a female'?

If there is someone in a female bathroom I'm going to assume they are identifying as female..... such a weird question

its not a weird question…but its a very weird answer

Yet again....

If you want to win that argument, make better points. Women defending the rights they fought for is not immoral. Putting men’s wants ahead of the safety of women and children is patriarchy, and we are not going back to being dominated by men or by the handmaidens who support them.

weren't you the one wanging on about someone not understanding statistics?

way to totally not understand probability - go you!

I mean I wear men's clothes and no make up so if I'm in the toilet queue with you are you going to think I am a transman in the wrong queue?

Of course you're not.

So it can't be clothes that makes a woman

I don't wear make up so it can't be make-up that makes a woman

What makes you look at a man in the queue for the women's and think oh that persons fine that's a transwoman, totally safe.

Also I don't mean to be rude, but Ireland isn't exactly known for being the epicentre of feminism either.

I know they're big on all the LGBTQ+ stuff right now but from where I'm standing it looks like they've just embraced another patriarchal religion after finally loosening the stranglehold of the Catholic church.

blimey

last time I was at waterloo station a drunken gammony type in a polo shirt decided to run through the ladies lavs, until the extremely stern attendant told him to get fucked.

do you think he was in the ladies because he identified as a 'female'? if so I have a bridge I'd like to interest you in...

If a male person is in a female single sex space, it is irrelevant to how they present or not. Female people are highly likely to be able to correctly identify a male person’s sex and it doesn’t matter how that male person is ‘presenting’. They are male and therefore should respect female people’s needs to have single sex spaces- just for female people.

"...a cis woman mainly because there are just way more cis women."

There are in fact zero cis women on the planet.. the whole planet.