Why is anti-trans so important?

[Elizabethbd]

So, I will preface this with saying that I’m not in the UK, and my country does not yet have the kind of anti-trans debate as there is in the English speaking world.

So, I have a hard time understanding why this is such an important question to many women.

Surely there are women’s issues that affect a larger part of society.

I’m thinking rape and violence towards women, homelesness, sex trafficking and honour killings. Why are these issues not more important and worthy of attention, as they affect so many more women than those who come into contact with trans women (or men)?

Well it obviously is. We wait with bated breath for any intelligent argument from the TRA side, granted.

Thats not true the statistic is that trans women that are already INCARCERATED are more likely to have been convicted of a sexual crime than straight men. But statistically you are more likely to meet a woman who has been convicted of a sexual crime in the bathroom since trans people only make up 0.3% of the population.

How could anyone possibly tell that this lovely lesbian was actually born male

https://www.thepinknews.com/2015/07/19/this-trans-woman-wants-to-widen-the-bandwidth-of-gender-by-keeping-her-beard/

You're moving the goal posts here. I was responding to your point about feeling less safe around straight men than around trans women. The statistics don't back that up.

If there are three people in front of you, a trans woman, a man and a woman, the one most likely to be a sex offender is the trans women, then the man, and then (a very very long way behind) the woman.

And to add...

Meet Alex.

Alex Drummond as pictured on the cover of her book Grrl is a transwoman. Do you want to tell her she's making a mockery of trans? That she's ignorant and stupid? That she's pretending?

Or do you just save your insults for the women pointing out that the world has gone mad?

Managed to lose the original quote I was responding to but they know who they are.

I'm really hoping you understand enough about statistical analysis not to be basing that erroneous statement on the statistical interpretation I suspect you are.

I'm going to guess that you are my age or older (50)

You seem to be working with a very outdated definition. I had to explain it all to my parents. There has been quite a change in recent years. Especially in terms of how the law recognises things.

What has JKR done that’s so horrendous? Why are you starting threads and not going back to them?

Your thread

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5360731-harry-potter-and-the-ongoing-spat

Do you know it's bad manners to start a thread and not return?

There is no obligation for any man to remove his penis to be considered a transwomen. Most don’t.

Eddie identifies a transwoman. Why are you denying her existence

And being in error is not telling a lie. There was no intent to do so. Still want to know why women can't be priests. It is part of the historical process of putting women in their place, after all. It is rooted in tradition, and Christ not choosing women disciples, but that doesn't explain why. And part of putting women in their place, regardless of denomination.

Well perhaps when you've done people the courtesy of replying to their well thought out posts on your plop and run thread you can come back and explain why it's wrong.

Because if women don't have a word to describe ourselves we cease to exist in law.
If men can be considered women we end up with male rapists in female prisons.
Men watching nonconsenting women and girls undress in female changing rooms.
Men punching women in the face in boxing in the Olympics.
Men taking women's positions where female representation is required removing female representation.
Men in female rape and domestic violence refuges.

I don't see how anyone doesn't see this as a huge problem. And the above doesn't even come close to the mutilation, sterilisation and medicalisation of children too young to consent. It's all utter madness.

Men can dress however they like, they will never be women.

@deadpantrashcan meet Pips Bunce | Director, Credit Suisse. Pips a woman on Monday, Philip a man on Tuesday falls under the trans umbrella.

"I identify as gender-fluid and non-binary and so decide how I choose to express on a given day regarding my gender expression. Being non-binary, I do not identify as either the binary gender of male or female. With over 12 percent of all millennials now identifying as either Trans*, gender fluid or non-binary, I am pleased that more people are now feeling empowered to be authentic in how they identify."

Do we just let him in the women's on alternate days? Or what?

Do you understand statistics? There is no statistic on what percentage of trans women are convicted of sexual crime.
Your point only makes sense if you take all 3 from a prison.
Considering Cis men commit 98% of sexual crime, cis women 2% do even if the entire population of trans people were sexual convicts they still only make up 0.3% of people so it's going to be significantly lower than men or women.

No, male people commit 98% of all sexual crimes.

And the 2% committed by female people includes women who were acting as an accessory to a male primary perpetrator, and some trans women whose crimes have been erroneously recorded as having been committed by a woman.

The prison statistics are the best statistics we have about the incidence of sex crimes committed by trans women. On what planet do those statistics make you think trans women represent less of a threat to your safety than other men?

Men commit 98% of sex crimes, not 'cis' men

yeah

a man in the ladies loos is waving all the red flags because he wants to push women's boundaries. even if he's wearing a skirt.

Men commit 98% of sexual crimes and most transwomen are included in that 98%

I say most because some men's crimes are being recorded as being committed by a woman

Aaah, this sort of comment, and the one you made earlier about poor transwomen who have spent YEARS becoming what they want to be.... is pretty much where I was 10 years ago.

It seemed so obvious to me - yes, there are a few dodgy ones, but the vast bulk of trans women are men who have struggled their whole lives, who have put so much time and effort into becoming as close to a woman as they can, up to and including remving their penises.

And then.... then I discovered that sadly, this just wasn't true.

I disocvered Philip Bunce - a banker at a major bank who was named in the Financial Time's list of Women making a difference in business. Philip was a male banker at Credit Suisse, who sometimes (not always) came to work in a dress and on those days, people called him Philippa. Wow, what a woman.

Around the same time, I was introduced to Rachel Mckinnon - a transwoman cyclist. [[https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/latest-news/rachel-mckinnon-becomes-first-transgender-woman-win-track-world-title-397473

And I suddenly realised - all those years of watching American tv shows and movies where transwomen were SO desperate, and SO determined ws absolutely fucking meaningless.

And at the same time, I started to see endless posts of men, who made almost NO effort to actually PASS as women, claiming to be transwomen. And Trying to take things from women - sport success, business success, political success.

And I thought - FUCK THAT.

Perhaps that's where you will be soon.

Exactly. If he doesn't take women's "no" for an answer in relation to single sex spaces, there's a good chance he also doesn't take women's "no" for an answer in other ways.

Presumably all the 'transmen are men' people also argue that transmen commit violent and sexual crimes at the same rate as 'other men'. And have the data to support that claim. Or is that different?

the recent outrage of many men at being told 'no, you can't use the women's loos' has been most instructive to anyone paying attention

Great post magequeen