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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Lineker 'Trans people are some of the most persecuted people on the planet'

174 replies

IDareSay · 15/05/2025 12:25

Just stick to bloody football Gary.

Oliver Brown in The Telegraph:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2025/05/15/gary-lineker-interview-gaza-transgender-america-bbc-motd/

“One other area where Lineker has been noticeably silent is a subject where centrist-dad equivocations are difficult: men masquerading in sport as women. This has been front-page news in his own realm, with the Football Association forced this month to ban males from all levels of the female game, honouring the Supreme Court’s ruling that the definition of a woman was based on biological sex. And yet Lineker has consistently swerved it. When his podcast, The Rest Is Football, tried a public question-and-answer experiment last November, Martina Navratilova, Sharron Davies and hundreds of other women asked him what he thought of the FA banning a teenager – revealed by The Telegraph last weekend as Cerys Vaughan – for asking a transgender opponent: “Are you a man?” Even under pressure from a nine-time Wimbledon singles champion and a celebrated Olympic swimmer, he neglected to engage. Why?
“Ugh,” he sighs, slumping so far forward in his chair he nearly hits the table. “You can’t cover that subject properly in a post. It’s too nuanced. I don’t actually think, in terms of sport, that it will ever be a real issue. Sport, as it’s already doing, will sort it out and work out rules. Like they did in boxing, when they realised they couldn’t have heavyweights against little fellas.”
Is it not blindingly obvious, however, that sport will not simply “sort it out”? It has taken many determined female campaigners a punishingly long time to undo the damage of gender ideology, compelling sports to prioritise fairness for women rather than vacuous mantras about inclusion. Amid broad acceptance that the rights of half the population should trump the view of a small, vocal minority of men that they are entitled to colonise women’s sport, Lineker makes it clear where his sympathies lie. “They’re some of the most persecuted on the planet, trans people. You’ve got to be very careful not to have bigoted views on that. I genuinely feel really badly for trans people. Imagine going through what they have to go through in life. Is there even any issue? It’s the same swimmer, the same weightlifter, the same boxer. They’re the only people I ever see.”

Lineker’s perspective here is myopic. The three examples he raises – American swimmer Lia Thomas, New Zealand weightlifter Laurel Hubbard, and Algerian boxer Imane Khelif, not transgender but permitted to win gold as a woman at the Paris Olympics despite sex tests indicating the presence of male chromosomes – are indeed well-publicised. But they are far from the only ones he could cite, with a recent report by Reem Alsalem, the United Nations special rapporteur on violence against women and girls, documenting how governing bodies’ failures to act had led to more than 600 female athletes around the world losing 890 medals in 29 different sports.
In his eyes, only cases at elite level matter. “We’ve got the Women’s Euros in the summer. Let’s see if there’s one issue – I don’t think there is. Are you telling me that there are many people who pretend to be women just so they’re going to be good at sport?” The desire of some males to receive affirmation as female can be a powerful motivating force, I argue. “It’s so complex,” Lineker says. “I see both sides to a degree.””

OP posts:
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7
JasmineAllen · 15/05/2025 14:09

Circumferences · 15/05/2025 13:27

Isreal is committing mass genocide though.
It's the worst humanitarian crisis happening right now.
To be silent is to be complicit, I don't know how anyone can defend what's going on by crying "anti semitic".....

You must have missed it but earluef this week GL posted an anti semitic trope on social media.

Criticism of GL doing that does not mean you are doing anything other than criticising GL for posting anti semitic material on social media.

YourAmplePlumPoster · 15/05/2025 14:09

After that post depicting a rat which he removed and claimed he didn't know, he should have been sacked by now.

MummBRaaarrrTheEverLeaking · 15/05/2025 14:14

By continually ignoring all the women going "come on Gary, say something" it was clear which side he'd come out swinging for🙄

TheDogsMother · 15/05/2025 14:16

Why does Gary feel he must the voice of the nation’s conscience ? He’s a former footballer and pundit FFS

Arran2024 · 15/05/2025 14:19

"Some of the most persecuted people on the planet"?!! They have most governments, most academics, most public institutions, large sections of the media, tech industries all batting for them. Now we know why Gary stayed quiet for so long.

And he clearly isn't paying attention if he thinks those three he mentions are remotely representative or even current.

NecessaryScene · 15/05/2025 14:21

They're certainly "the most told-they're-not-actually-the-sex-they-claim".

But refusing to join in someone's LARP is not persecution.

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 15/05/2025 14:28

‘Sport, as it’s already doing, will sort it out and work out rules. Like they did in boxing, when they realised they couldn’t have heavyweights against little fellas.”

Yep, Gary old chap, that’s precisely what the Supreme Court has done. it has advised that men (heavyweights in your terms) should not be beating the crap out of ‘little fellas’ ( women) in public and being awarded a gold medal for their opponents’ pains. ‘sport’ though, especially the FA, and The ECB really, really dragged their heels.

Pun intended

JasmineAllen · 15/05/2025 14:29

TheDogsMother · 15/05/2025 14:16

Why does Gary feel he must the voice of the nation’s conscience ? He’s a former footballer and pundit FFS

I'd hazard a guess it's got something to do with the size of his ego.

TheywontletmehavethenameIwant · 15/05/2025 14:35

Circumferences · 15/05/2025 13:27

Isreal is committing mass genocide though.
It's the worst humanitarian crisis happening right now.
To be silent is to be complicit, I don't know how anyone can defend what's going on by crying "anti semitic".....

I would dispute your assertion that it's the worst humanitarian crisis, it might be the only hyped up conflict the West care's about but there are far worse things going on in the world, that the West don't care about.

An example

'Sudan: Famine and fighting spread as warring parties weaponise hunger
Numbers: More than 12 million people have been displaced since conflict erupted in April 2023. Some 25 million people – over half the population – are facing acute hunger, and famine has been declared in at least five areas for which experts say they have reliable data.'

SeaBaseAlpha · 15/05/2025 14:43

Urgh.. my celebrity crush throughout my childhood.. so disappointing.

EdithStourton · 15/05/2025 14:45

I wish he'd stick to sodding football.

He appears to be entirely clueless about everything else. He's the sort of person who makes me think that Doc Stock has a point.

YourAmplePlumPoster · 15/05/2025 14:50

"Some of the most persecuted people on the planet."

Try being a woman in Afghanistan, Iran, or other parts of the underdeveloped world.

YourAmplePlumPoster · 15/05/2025 14:52

This bloke who lives in leafy Barnes and earns millions a year has no clue about how many oppressed women in the world live.

mordaunt · 15/05/2025 14:53

lady69 · 15/05/2025 13:21

He is an anti-semite and twit. He also was a creep around young women for years and had a reputation for wandering hands for years in the tv industry. How he has any sort of public profile STILL after all these years of him being an obnoxious gobshite prick of a man i do not know. .

Edited

Well well. It IS the BBC after all. Covering the tracks of older men (allegedly) targeting young people is par for the course.

Brefugee · 15/05/2025 14:57

I always quite liked him. As a football fan i often wonder how he managed to go a whole career without picking up a yellow card. Bonkers.

But i'm confused by this part:

"In his eyes, only cases at elite level matter."

"Where does he think elite players come from? they do not emerge, fully-formed, blinking in the sunlight, do they? They work up from grass roots level.

not sure if anyone posted the archive link because i have only skimmed the thread,
so here it is

http://archive.today/3OFao

SidewaysOtter · 15/05/2025 15:05

In his eyes, only cases at elite level matter. “We’ve got the Women’s Euros in the summer. Let’s see if there’s one issue – I don’t think there is. Are you telling me that there are many people who pretend to be women just so they’re going to be good at sport?” The desire of some males to receive affirmation as female can be a powerful motivating force, I argue. “It’s so complex,” Lineker says. “I see both sides to a degree."

So there's no transwomen at elite level, so no problem that Gary can see. And he can't wrap his head around the idea that men would identify as a woman in order to win, and when presented with reasons to the contrary he pulls out a vague and weaseley "both sides" argument.

Yet another man who just cannot understand any viewpoint other than his own. So predictable and so tedious.

Boredofgcses · 15/05/2025 15:13

He is a deeply ignorant arrogant man who should have kept his comments to an area he is knowledgeable about - football , nothing more .

YourAmplePlumPoster · 15/05/2025 15:16

Everyone should write to BBC complaints about this man.

YourWiseBee · 15/05/2025 15:17

I think Lineker is so far up his own arse in self righteousness that there is nothing that he can say now that is worth listening too.

he reminds me very much of fox killer or Alastair Campbell. People who I have zero respect for and never will.

YourWiseBee · 15/05/2025 15:24

Should add JOB to my list above too.
Although a few takes I do have.

”You’ve got to be very careful not to have bigoted views on that.”

basically I follow the religion of woke so I can’t say anything that will deviate from that or else I will be crucified and my brand tarnished.

i think he’s been a stupid prat and will soon descend into irrelevance when he leaves BBC and I suspect the BBC will have the flags out for him leaving as the views he supports (or at least is too scared to say no) are too extreme even for the BBC.

Boiledbeetle · 15/05/2025 15:30

Well hasn't he just proved he doesn't give a shiny shit about women.

Plonker.

MissScarletInTheBallroom · 15/05/2025 15:34

The most persecuted people on the planet?

Are they, Gary, really?

Up there with women in Afghanistan, for example?

Dvdlove · 15/05/2025 15:36

I met GL at an awards thing he was compereing. I was one of the only women in the room. Suffice to say his attitude towards women/me (and he was married at the time) would win no awards.

mumda · 15/05/2025 15:37

There's a lot of comments about him being silent on the 'rape gangs'.

BunnyLake · 15/05/2025 15:49

Is this the guy who shat his shorts on the football pitch. If that doesn’t humble you nothing will!