Just been “unfriended” for believing in biology

[Somethingthecatdraggedin7]

I posted links about the Supreme Court ruling on my fb feed and have just been unfriended and blocked by a real life friend.
I hadn’t seen her for a long time so we had never talked about the issue because the last time we met (about 8 years ago) transgender wasn’t a thing. Well certainly not in my little corner of the UK anyway.
I am bemused. This is someone I had helped a lot with certain situations. She knows me, she knows that I am a kind and decent person.
But now because I post about the legal reclamation of the word woman I am suddenly persona non grata.
I have friends of differing views on all sorts of topics and we accept that we don’t have to agree on everything. Clearly this particular friend can’t accommodate diverse opinions.
So much for tolerance and inclusion then.

If they dont think the way you want them to why would you want them as a friend?

You posted links to something that you know very well people disagree over. You should have expected some of your friends to be upset by it. If you didn't want to be unfriended, you shouldn't have posted links to it.

I was unfriended by a few people back when Man Friday was a thing and that cyclist was crowing about beating all the women.

A few months later I got a friend request from one of them. Declined. She’d obviously come to her senses but I couldn’t be bothered with it.

Hang tight, the tide is turning.

People disagree that women deserve their own safe spaces and sports, away from men?? And why is that a thing to unfriend someone over?

Some people think that anti trans views are as hateful as racism etc.

If that's how you felt, and your friend posted they were happy with Trumps stance on immigration for example, and you haven't seen them for 8 years, what's your action?'

I've been unfriended by a relative after a disagreement and it is surprisingly upsetting. IRL a friend would fade off and you wouldn't really have an "event" or a trigger point you could specifically identify. But an unfriending is a conscious act. So I am not surprised you are upset - I felt the same. You will have to mourn the loss and maybe you could find a reason to reach out in a few months. You don't know what circumstances people are in and maybe she has a family member who is going through things that she doesn't want popping up in her feed. good luck

supporting women is not anti-trans. You can support the rights of both groups. When their rights clash, as they do, you can support the rights of winner while also wanting the rights of trans people to be respected.

But women have the right to complete in their own sex category in sports and to have single sex spaces. Trans women don’t have the right to compete in women’s sports or enter women’s single sex spaces. That all came about by Stonewall and others WILFULLY misinterpreting the EA 2010.

people like you, who say they think that supporting women is akin to racism, are the problem.

And in which group are we putting people who struggle with comprehension?

@AlanShore said
Some people think that anti trans views are as hateful as racism etc.

And you took that to mean
people like you, who say they think that supporting women is akin to racism, are the problem.

If I had said horrible things about transgender people then I could understand her being upset but I have only supported the definition of a woman and women only spaces, sports etc.
I actually have two friends who support trump and I loathe him but we still manage to stay friends.
I am a vegetarian but all my friends are meat eaters and one is a farmer. We accommodate each other without any problem.
I can’t see why this friend can’t accept that I hold my view on biology and she holds hers. It wouldn’t make me block her if she posted pro trans stuff on her feed.
Too many people are losing the ability to agree to disagree and instead we are dividing into warring tribes which is so destructive to society.

Well, I’m not the one who un friended the op. But there are difficult situations that have arisen
from the ruling - surely this is obvious stuff. If it wasn’t controversial, it wouldn’t have ended up in the Supreme Court. For example, (I know this person irl) - a transwoman who has had full surgery 10 years ago (to be clear, penis removed, boobs made), and appears/presents as a woman. There has been no issue with this person in women’s spaces, such as toilets. This person is no risk to anyone. But now this person is supposed to walk into men’s bogs looking like a woman? You can see that’s difficult, right?

It's always the toilets. Absolutely tedious.

Not the -

Rape crisis services
Domestic violence refuges
Single sex hospital wards
Female prison estate

Etc etc etc

And anyone who refers to the Supreme Court ruling, in which the single sex exemptions of the EQA 2010 were confirmed as having always meant biological sex, as 'anti trans' tells on themselves.

Women aren't human shields or support humans. Let men campaign to be more accepting of their fellow males than using women's services as a resource to be utilised for validation.

A lot more people use toilets than any of the other things you mentioned. Of course they are important but it shouldn't surprise you that people focus on things they can relate to.

I suppose it's a lot easier to shriek 'but they just need to pee!!!!' than admit that the deliberate erosion of single sex services has led to women being housed with violent male sex offenders in the female prison estate as policy (as just one example).

I suppose it depends what you shared??
I have GC friends who share things i don't agree with, but we are still friends!
Social media is curated by ourselves so we are all able to remove posts from people that we dont want to see (general news and other outlets can do that)
Anyone who shares something that is meanspirited or just plain hateful (like referring to a trans person as "it") will be removed from my social media feed, because I dont owe anyone access to my personal profile...

She doesn't sound like any great loss as a friend.

She cannot debate a topic calmly and rationally without taking things personally. She denies proven scientific fact. She's on a par with flat earthers, and those who think vaccinations mean Bill Gates is taking over your brain!

Oh well, never mind.

Why is it difficult. Surely the only thing making it difficult is the behaviour of other men. Those other men reject this individual because of obvious differences and somehow that's ok. But when women reject that individual because of obvious differences, that somehow in some people's minds is not OK.

The issue can be solved immediately by men learning to treat people with respect, regardless of how they look. Why should women be called on constantly to provide a solution. It is a problem created by men.

The second solution is to create trans loos.

But now this person is supposed to walk into men’s bogs looking like a woman? You can see that’s difficult, right?

No, he's always supposed to have used the men's, or unisex toilets. Any difficulty is entirely down to his choice of modus vivendi, isn't it? Why should large numbers of women be forced to feel uncomfortable, or afraid, because he doesn't want to?

I increasingly see this snippy, prissy tone all over MN. No room for nuance, no empathy, just a wagging finger.

This has happened to me a few times. It's bloody sad. But probably if it wasn't on social media I wouldn't notice. As friendships often drift in and out.

I appreciate that yes this is going to be upsetting for your friend and others. However you do not know that "there has been no issue with this person in women's spaces, such as toilets". You mean no issue for your friend. You don't know if their presence made other women feel uncomfortable or anxious. Someone may appear female to you, but not to others because of factors like male body proportions. How people see and perceived others varies massively.

Did you know your friend/acquaintance before they decided to be castrated and have breast implants? If not, how did you know they were not a woman? If they are obviously not, then that may answer why many women wouldn’t confront them. Self-preservation. Even if women’s stress levels were raised by their presence, or on high alert to get out of there. So it is actual women who remove themselves from the women’s facility because there is a male who wishes to place himself in there.

If I were in an enclosed space alone with a strange male, I’d be on alert. To be honest, even more so if they were obviously ‘presenting’ as if they were a woman, and insisting on using female spaces. They may be fine, but it highlights they are males who are fine crossing women’s boundaries. I know it was/is classified as a male fetish as well. If I entered a woman’s toilet, and viewed only a male (under any guise) in there, I’d probably pretend I just wanted to wash my hands and keep on the door side of him. Then vamoose till he had left, and then go back in.

Even a male eunuch is not a woman. Fine for everyone to live their own lives as they wish, but when males encroach on women I’d detect some warning signals. I just wouldn’t want to feel more vulnerable in my everyday life. And wouldn’t override my natural self preservation instinct to play along.

A very old and dear friend of mine went dark on me after a nostalgic chat about how much we loved a certain author turned to how sad me and a third friend in the chat were that this author wasn’t being more helpful in publicly supporting GC perspectives. She suddenly stopped engaging in the chat and I think she is ghosting me now. I wish that she had been more curious about my perspective after knowing me since childhood and knowing what a proper ‘lefty, support the underdog, human rights’ type I’ve always been. But I’m too scared to truly ask her why she has pulled away. I’m pretty sure another friend ‘constructively dismissed’ me after she found out about my views but I’ll never really know because she started being so catty towards me that it was me who ultimately walked away. I must admit that I have also walked away from a friend after a discussion about the trans issue because I just couldn’t deal with her nauseating, privileged, ‘be kind’, ‘pick me’ attitude in welcoming men into women’s spaces without consideration for women who don’t consent. But that was more of a decision based on my exhaustion with having to pretend I could see her POV when I found it tiresome. So maybe sometimes these issues just show up fundamental differences between people that can’t be overcome. I’m super careful who I bring this up with now because sometimes it’s easier to just not know where someone stands on this. It’s a bit of a Pandora’s box and reveals a lot about a person’s intelligence and/or integrity.

But you can't possibly know there have been no issues. You can't know if there were women who encountered your friend in a women's space who were frightened (because they weren't expecting a man in that space but were too polite to say anything). Or just unsettled. It is very unlikely women didn't know he was a man. Where is the evidence that he would be at risk in the men's? I am sure your friend is a lovely person but you can't possibly know that his presence in women's spaces didn't bother any women.

They can accept it they have unfriended you and got on with their life, you seem to be the one questioning it

Tbh, if one of my friends had such differing views to me that they blocked me I would let them go. They are following the no debate narrative. I’ve never published my views on line other than here anonymously but my closest friends were introduced to my sex realist views slowly, a hint here, a comment there, reference to something in the news.

Both are in agreement after conversation. My oldest friend’s SIL, on an evening out, picked up my hint immediately and we spent a very happy evening terfing.

Maybe it was a bit full on for her.