Bridget Philipson- TW should use toilets according to biological Sex.

[LizzieSiddal]

On R4 at 7.50!!

She said she spoke on behalf of the government, they welcome the judgement and it is now clear, provision must be based on Biological Sex!

Apologies for posting then running (have an appt to get to). but didn’t see another thread on this.

(If you have the sounds App you should easily beable to go to 7.50 and listen)

Not at all. It's extremely important to be able to challenge or report someone hanging around a women's space - or simply spin around and exit pronto - without worrying that you might end up in trouble yourself.

Exactly, didn’t poor Sandie Pegg get reported for transphobia for just standing outside the changing room and waiting for Dr Upton to leave?
My BIL works with a trans man and stands outside while they change, he feels awful changing in front of them. If he was reported for transphobia he would be aghast.

How and who do I get my evidence to to make the most difference in government now?

I have written to loads of MPs and not one has written back.

The talk of third spaces is nonsense. The trans men want to be allowed go into the ladies so giving them a third space won't make them happy.

It was brought up at the tribunal for sure - she said other women were waiting outside too. Thank goodness their rights to privacy are clear as a bell now.

Yes if Labour hadn’t spent the last couple of years saying that the law was very clear with no need for it to be clarified that sex meant female/male (and did not include certificated men) then KS’s silence probably wouldn’t matter so much. It really suited Labour for the law to be widely misinterpreted and they knew that the confusion meant that service providers failed to exclude men from women’s spaces. Presumably KS is just waiting for PMQs to apologise.

You mean the trans women?

I think there needs to be public acknowledgement of the fact that it's OK for them not to be happy.

@Coatsoff42 I keep wondering how this is going to affect Sandie's case. I heard the NHS were being urged to drop this last week in light of the ruling. Also under the ruling it seems that Dr Upton will have to change in the men's facility.

@Cailin66 I agree that access to women's spaces is very important to them, they don't care about or want unisex spaces at all because that provides no validation. Only access to women's single sex spaces does that.

but but but how did you cope with such literal violence???

my understanding is that the correct response is to immediately kick off hurling abuse at the person who said it whilst filming yourself doing so and then later to take to Tik tok doing a mad angry cry about your literal existence being erased

you mean you didn’t do that??

Was a Canadian company. Bought by a big US company some years ago, much to the anger of many Canadians. But that won’t have changed their attitude to toilets any.

Phillipson was clear, but seemed reluctant to say out loud that trans women must use men’s toilets. She kept saying they must use the toilet matching their biological sex. I know it amounts to the same thing (except to the extremists who claim trans women ARE biological women because the hormones change their sex, or some such nonsense), but she clearly didn’t want to say it.

There will always be a few that sneak in under the radar. The difference is that they know they shouldn't be there and they can now be challenged.

They will be less bold about it.

You are supposed to police yourself though. Unless you are a wrong 'un...

No, sorry.

But I did tease my ex about it for years.

You think? Lol.

Yes, it will raise the bar of who thinks it is worth it. If they know they won't immediately be indulged in their fantasy then I expect plenty won't bother.

She’s also cabinet minister for equality so she was asked about it in that role

Not really. If the woman checked turns out to be female, I am sure that firstly it will become obvious quite quickly, and secondly she will reassure and thank the woman who was doing the asking for defending single sex spaces.

Just like if ‘actual’ women are ‘misgendered’ they just correct and move on. They are secure enough that their reality is unaltered by anyone else getting it wrong.

If she thinks she’s fudging it won’t do her any good with TRAs who think biological sex is a dog whistle.

@MimiGC I've seen this very stance play out on reddit where people are now saying it was a mistake to say sex and gender are different and that they should have been attacking the notion of biology all along while others are saying that they are in fact biological women because they have surgeries and use cross sex hormones or that they were always women in some unknown biological (even though they were born with typical male bodies) way which will be discovered someday. In short they are all over the place while the line from women has always been that are and remain the sex they are observed to be at birth and that the law should reflect this obvious reality.

It’s not meaningless - didn’t the women at WiSpa complain about a flasher but rather that the assailant being dealt with, the women were rounded on and suffered accusations of being ‘transphobic’?

Granted, that wasn’t in the UK. However, if a situation was to arise here that was similar, at least now women know they can confidently and with the backing of the law, assert their right not to be assaulted rather than being accused of a hate crime.

Ah, I stand corrected.

Of course this was going to be the government's position.

A few Labour MPs bleating was never going to alter that.

Exactly.

Most people aren't going to be searching intently for stray transwomen in female loos but it should put a stop to the idiots going in to flash their dicks around.

Yes. This. Having BP Education minister talking about this on an early morning radio show isn’t enough. Having her talk about it anywhere, isn’t enough

Come on Keir, do your job.

I want an announcement from KS that they have heard this judgement and it will be made clear to all public and private bodies that they must adhere to the law.

There’s been too much in the press over the past few days about many MPs not being happy and them regrouping and putting pressure on KS. To do what I’m not sure but you can bet that the TRAs are in over drive at the moment.

Lets not forget that they said a woman can have a penis, we haven’t heard that them admit they were wrong.