Page 13 | Bridget Philipson- TW should use toilets according to biological Sex.

LizzieSiddal · 2025-04-22T07:19:55+00:00

On R4 at 7.50!! She said she spoke on behalf of the government, they welcome the judgement and it is now clear, provision must be based on Biological Sex! Apologies for posting then running (have an appt to get to). but didn’t see another thread on this. (If you have the sounds App you should easily beable to go to 7.50 and listen)

Zebedee999 · 22/04/2025 14:31

Forgettingblue · 22/04/2025 14:18

I think they have both realised its unpopular and that the TRA arguments don't hold together under scrutiny. Starmer became a bit of a national joke with his previous comments on this issue, with those comments becoming an ongoing news story in their own right. I think he wants to shake that off .

Over the years, more and more real life cases of the problems that arise when you allow men to say they are women, have hit the newspapers. This has made the public realise its all nonsense, and dangerous and unfair nonsense to treat men as if they are women in all and every circumstance. They've realised that more was being asked of them than being polite to unhappy men who said they were women, and they don't like how its actually affecting real women and girls.

Furthermore the country is in a mess and many people are living under financial stress and very unhappy. Everyone feels there are big issues the government needs to address. They will be seriously pissed off if the Government now wasted time and energy trying to change legislation to give men rights to be women instead of sorting out the large structural problems that are making life harder for many citizens, whether housing, health or COL.

Finally the supreme court ruling gives the Labour government a way to escape the mess they got themselves into by saying they are just following the law.

Basically I think Labour have finally realised that most of the public are fed up of this nonsense and want it to end.

Edited

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I totally agree.
Except where you say Starmer is hoping to shake off looking the idiot for not knowing what a woman is. Once exposed as an idiot how can any woman see him and Labour as anything but idiots?

GCAcademic · 22/04/2025 14:32

Merrymouse · 22/04/2025 14:27

Do men routinely use urine bottles in multi occupancy wards without drawing the curtain?

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No. My husband had to use one in a private hospital room, and even then he insisted the curtains were drawn just in case a nurse walked in.

Forgettingblue · 22/04/2025 14:35

Zebedee999 · 22/04/2025 14:31

I totally agree.
Except where you say Starmer is hoping to shake off looking the idiot for not knowing what a woman is. Once exposed as an idiot how can any woman see him and Labour as anything but idiots?

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I meant I think he is desperate for people to start asking him what a woman is, and how many women he now thinks have penises! I think he wants this whole issue to go away now!

Forgettingblue · 22/04/2025 14:41

Forgettingblue · 22/04/2025 14:35

I meant I think he is desperate for people to start asking him what a woman is, and how many women he now thinks have penises! I think he wants this whole issue to go away now!

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That should have said STOP asking him ( not start) obvs.

MixTapeMel · 22/04/2025 14:44

Teateaandmoretea · 22/04/2025 13:30

One of the biggest differences between males and females is the voice. So a quick conversation would sort out any possible confusion.

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This has happened to me fairly frequently my whole life for the same reasons - attire and the fact i nearly always wear a baseball cap. It's folks not actually looking at me (i have a feminine face for example), just a glance at my overall appearance. Nowadays if i'm going into a public loo dressed like that I sing, put's everyone at ease.

1apenny2apenny · 22/04/2025 14:45

I think people are being very generous to KS and Labour. I don’t trust them as far as I can throw them. The only thing that makes me worry less is knowing that organisations such as Sex Matters are on the case.

This is a very important issue, KS said a woman can have a penis, he hasn’t admitted he was wrong to say that and it was shockingly disrespectful to women.

ErrolTheDragon · 22/04/2025 14:48

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2025 11:58

I remember one of the men had a cardboard sign which said “Keep Mumsnet out of Politics” 😂

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The sad sound of an empty stable door shutting.😂

TeenToTwenties · 22/04/2025 14:48

I personally don't think now is the time to be pushing people to say they were wrong. I think that will come in a public enquiry a few years down the line.
Just be happy they are now accepting sense rather than doubling down.

PrettyDamnCosmic · 22/04/2025 14:50

1apenny2apenny · 22/04/2025 14:45

I think people are being very generous to KS and Labour. I don’t trust them as far as I can throw them. The only thing that makes me worry less is knowing that organisations such as Sex Matters are on the case.

This is a very important issue, KS said a woman can have a penis, he hasn’t admitted he was wrong to say that and it was shockingly disrespectful to women.

He is a lawyer & in a technical sense he was correct as a man with a GRC & a penis was regarded as a female but this now been clarified by the SC.

SternJoyousBee · 22/04/2025 14:52

cardibach · 22/04/2025 13:56

Except as the ruling clarifies, there was nothing wrong with the Act. It specifies sex and gender as being separate - it’s been conflated by powerful pressure grouos but the Act itself made it clear in the first place. All the judgement does is confirm it.

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The problem was and is the GRA and the Scottish Government trying to bring in the GRR and self-id. If anything needs to re-written (or repealed) it’s the GRA.

ErrolTheDragon · 22/04/2025 14:53

Bruisername · 22/04/2025 13:34

Ben Bradshaw on the world at one hoping for single gender spaces

and brought up transmen for once

and said how hard transwomen would find it to pee in a bottle in a men’s ward - so propagating the myth that most have surgery

So he brought up transmen but then made that comment about transwomen without thinking about hard it would be for transmen to pee into a bottle if they were on the men’s ward?

also - did he say ‘single gender spaces’? What on earth is one of those supposed to be? Other than single occupancy ones, I suppose.

BorneBackCeaselesslyIntoThePas · 22/04/2025 15:07

There used to be a tagline for a company that read ‘life comes at you hard’

i fully identify with that idea because I (and I’m sure lots of other people on this forum) have been trying to calm our trans identified son down and thus isn’t the end of the world

and just for added flavour, we think this whole thing is rubbish. Women are born not worn. But life takes you to strange places, and it’s pretty dark here

TwoLoonsAndASprout · 22/04/2025 15:20

BorneBackCeaselesslyIntoThePas · 22/04/2025 15:07

There used to be a tagline for a company that read ‘life comes at you hard’

i fully identify with that idea because I (and I’m sure lots of other people on this forum) have been trying to calm our trans identified son down and thus isn’t the end of the world

and just for added flavour, we think this whole thing is rubbish. Women are born not worn. But life takes you to strange places, and it’s pretty dark here

Just replying to send you a hug. You are in an impossible place - I have been there, and it is indeed very dark there. Stay strong and be kind to yourself - I’m sure you are doing the very best you can in a horrible situation.

WeMeetInFairIthilien · 22/04/2025 15:35

Main headline at the BBC.

Bridget Philipson- TW should use toilets according to biological Sex.

Forgettingblue · 22/04/2025 15:37

BorneBackCeaselesslyIntoThePas · 22/04/2025 15:07

There used to be a tagline for a company that read ‘life comes at you hard’

i fully identify with that idea because I (and I’m sure lots of other people on this forum) have been trying to calm our trans identified son down and thus isn’t the end of the world

and just for added flavour, we think this whole thing is rubbish. Women are born not worn. But life takes you to strange places, and it’s pretty dark here

I'm sorry. That must be so hard for you.

MrsOvertonsWindow · 22/04/2025 15:54

New headline on the lead article about this in the Times:
"Keir Starmer no longer believes trans women are women"

It must be like having that infected tooth pulled out for him. Finaly he can speak rationally about all this.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2025 16:03

BorneBackCeaselesslyIntoThePas · 22/04/2025 15:07

There used to be a tagline for a company that read ‘life comes at you hard’

i fully identify with that idea because I (and I’m sure lots of other people on this forum) have been trying to calm our trans identified son down and thus isn’t the end of the world

and just for added flavour, we think this whole thing is rubbish. Women are born not worn. But life takes you to strange places, and it’s pretty dark here

I feel for you 💐

chaosmaker · 22/04/2025 16:20

Hwi · 22/04/2025 10:30

They could use disabled toilets if there is nobody in the disabled toilet or no queue for it? No?

NO, unless they are disabled, OBVIOUSLY.

BiologicalRobot · 22/04/2025 16:27

From that guardian article comments section a few pages ago

Yep, let's forget intersex people.
Just because religion boils it down to male and female, biology does not.

senua · 22/04/2025 16:37

New headline on the lead article about this in the Times:
"Keir Starmer no longer believes trans women are women"
It's a clever headline. KS didn't actually said TWANW so they've said it for him, daring him to deny it.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 22/04/2025 16:44

He’ll look insane if he denies it.

Merrymouse · 22/04/2025 16:51

BiologicalRobot · 22/04/2025 16:27

From that guardian article comments section a few pages ago

Yep, let's forget intersex people.
Just because religion boils it down to male and female, biology does not.

UK law has never recognised any sex other than male or female so no change there.

moto748e · 22/04/2025 16:56

From the BBC piece:

Many Labour MPs will be uneasy about the comments from Sir Keir and Phillipson.
For now this appears confined to private frustration.
Some MPs who have campaigned in support of trans rights pointed to commitments in Labour's general election manifesto to introduce a "trans-inclusive ban on conversion practices" as well as to "modernise, simplify, and reform" gender recognition law.
Those are still Labour Party policies, as far as we are aware, but any sign of backsliding on that and this debate may again become a tense one within Labour's ranks.

The Beeb making its opinion clear, there. I wonder how many 'many' are. 10%? 50%? I did think that "we" in the last sentence sounds a bit odd. Who is 'we'? The BBC? It's not a formulation they normally use. But I guess it's a good question to ask:"Is modernisiing, simplifying and reforming gender recognition law still Govt policy, or not?"

TeenToTwenties · 22/04/2025 17:00

It would be modernised, simplified and reformed if it were just repealed!

ErrolTheDragon · 22/04/2025 17:13

moto748e · 22/04/2025 16:56

From the BBC piece:

Many Labour MPs will be uneasy about the comments from Sir Keir and Phillipson.
For now this appears confined to private frustration.
Some MPs who have campaigned in support of trans rights pointed to commitments in Labour's general election manifesto to introduce a "trans-inclusive ban on conversion practices" as well as to "modernise, simplify, and reform" gender recognition law.
Those are still Labour Party policies, as far as we are aware, but any sign of backsliding on that and this debate may again become a tense one within Labour's ranks.

The Beeb making its opinion clear, there. I wonder how many 'many' are. 10%? 50%? I did think that "we" in the last sentence sounds a bit odd. Who is 'we'? The BBC? It's not a formulation they normally use. But I guess it's a good question to ask:"Is modernisiing, simplifying and reforming gender recognition law still Govt policy, or not?"

It’s the ‘backsliding’ that sounds odd to me - I’m not sure I’ve ever heard the term being used outside of fairly evangelical Christian contexts, eg university CU. Maybe not so odd then…