"Trans women ARE biological women"

[TangenitalContrivance]

I see this argument and comment more and more the last few weeks and hugely over the last 3 days.

For example:

https://www.reddit.com/r/transgenderUK/comments/1k1tliv/trans_women_are_biological_women/

This statement, and the comments underneath it absolutely baffle me.

The approach, one that I am sure will only work with a minority of the people who said TWAW, is to undermine the definition of words, yet again, and deliberately cloud the water when it comes to speaking clearly and using terms that everyone agrees with

I have seen it said in more places than Reddit however, and by respected people

I agree that some things should never be aired in court. The piss protestors' underwear, for example.

This is the kind of thing that really gets on my nerves. The idea behind it is that if I met a transwoman I would immediately fall on my knees and repent the delusion that I was a human being with rights, quickly followed by fully embracing my true purpose as a support animal for the Glorious One. It's not going to happen.

I know two trans identified males. Both already had problems, mainly in terms of mental health but also some physical health conditions. Identifying as transgender will solve precisely none of these issues. If anything, it will exacerbate them.

They are often extremely annoying nowadays. I avoid them as much as possible.

I'm sure we all know lovely men who are no threat to women. They still don't belong in women's spaces and as they are lovely and no threat to women, they understand why and don't take it as an insult or affront or act of insanity. Why on earth would they?

Lovely men who are no threat to women should be in men's spaces setting an example for less lovely men and holding the line.

For the millionth time…
Sex is binary (yes, even in medicine). There is no need to talk about chromosomal sex, endocrine sex etc etc. Humans are mammals whose reproductive systems develop embryologically along one of two pathways depending on whether they are going to be producers of small mobile gametes or large immobile gametes.
We inherit DNA from both parents. For convenience this is stored as chromosomes. From our mothers that will be an X chromosome. From our fathers an X or Y. The presence of absence of the Y instructs the route of embryological development from a bipotential gonad (can become either ovary or testes) to either Mullerian route (no Y, becomes ovary) or Wolffian route (Y present, becomes testes). Embryological development proceeds and after puberty sexual maturity is reached but the process starts at conception and the development of gonadal tissues, hormones, everything follows on from there.

For a small number of people there is an issue in the pathway. Perhaps part of the Y chromosome gets attached to an X chromosome during meiosis (cellular replication after fertilisation). Perhaps there is an extra chromosome or a missing chromosome. Perhaps there is a failure of gonadal tissue to form properly. Perhaps the hormone receptors or the enzymes that act on those hormones don’t act properly. All of those things mean that in a tiny number of cases sex is not as clear as xx/xy or hormones, and that is precisely why that is not how we categorise sex. It is about which gamete the body is designed to produce. Failure to be able to do so does not mean those people are some new type of human or new sex. It means there’s been an issue in the process and things have turned out differently. There are other conditions where this happens (other trisomies, non disjunction etc) but they happen on chromosomes not linked to sex so the features are different. We don’t say people with Down Syndrome, Edward Syndrome or Patau Syndrome are somehow a new type of human because to do so would be both offensive and absurd.
To make the same judgement on sex is also nonsensical and absurd but it’s been used that way because some people for a whole variety of reasons don’t want to be the sex they are and are unhappy that that can’t change so we get this bizarre discussion about chromosomal sex or hormonal sex as if these things exist separate from each other and have anything to do with what “gender” someone may or may not identify as.

Loving the direction this thread has taken 🤣

They say laughter is the best medicine and this is doing me no end of good. And I agree with pp - we DEFINITELY don’t want EHRC p*ss protestor airing his undies (or anything else) in public.

And male p*ss smells! No getting over that chaps

The boys' toilets were off the entrance lobby of my kids' primary school. You couldn't get in except by passing them.

Good grief, they stank, even with the door closed!

They weren't used by adult men, as there was a male staff toilet. And the vast majority of the boys would have been pre-pubescent. Yet still the toilets absolutely reeked.

It's great for compost, though. Female urine has more oestrogen in it than is good for compost but the nitrogen from the dudes is very welcome.

Everyday is a learning day on MN! That is a brilliant bit of information.

I just want to say this post has legitimately made me shed a tear, I’ve been on the WYOO board of another parenting forum for the last 2 days arguing for women’s sex based rights.

I’ve been called a bigot and a transphobe and as a lone voice it has taken its toll. No matter what logical and evidenced reasons I’ve put forward for my position they have been completely dismissed as being from transphobic sources or any crimes committed by M to F trans were actually just committed by CIS males.

It’s been nice to come on here and feel like I’m not going crazy. I’ve never doubted my position but god it’s been so depressing that all these women want to give away our daughters sex based rights with so little thought.

Beautifully said!

Welcome to the den of sin and wrongthink, you filthy heretic!

Have a teacake.

It’s so annoying. I’ve had women (allies of the trans communities) telling me that wanting female only spaces ‘reduces women to their genitalia’. It’s so disingenuous. People have got to the point where they will argue black is white in the pursuit of ‘being kind’.

I can’t imagine that many of these women have daughters.

It’s just a stupid thought-terminating cliche.

Is that why pee from a bitch kills the grass?
But dog pee doesn't?

Or at least someone once told me that. Never been a caine owner.

Looks at male dog then brown grass patches. I can confirm pee from male dogs kills grass.

Neighbour has had 3 bitches over 15 years. Every Spring he's out there re-seeding all the brown patches. Perhaps BaronessE dog identifies as a bitch when weeing 😬

Thanks, just like Magdalen Burns rather be a heretic than a fucking liar!

They’re on babycentre now calling for all toilets to be made unisex as a way of circumventing the supreme court ruling, these handmaidens are absolute lunatics! 😵‍💫

Fortunately my dog can’t get to the grass bit of our garden unless he’s let through so no brown patches.

Sometimes he cocks his leg, sometimes he squats to wee.

Maybe he’s non-bonery?

(I’ll get me coat)

Yes. I’m wondering if all the women enthusiastically arguing for mixed sex facilities have terrible hygiene standards or just no sense of smell?

I don't know about dogs, but it would make sense.

what nonsense could be the response to ‘sex is obviously binary because there’s no other way to produce babies’?

"So you think infertile women aren't really women"