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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Mumsnet listed as Anti-Trans

882 replies

Hoosemover · 08/02/2025 17:21

there a list of organisations and Mumsnet is on it. Along with the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

x.com/twisterfilm/status/1888255119449268674?s=61

OP posts:
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15
selffellatingouroborosofhate · 25/02/2025 00:00

Princessconsuelabananahammock9 · 11/02/2025 04:02

So you see trans people as having a mental illness that needs to be cured?

I think that people who are in denial about their sex or hold the delusion that they can change sex need psychotherapy. This covers some, but by no means all, trans people.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 25/02/2025 00:02

EasternStandard · 11/02/2025 08:12

They do exist, and for most they want to pass.

I don't think we should have legislated for this need

It's a desire, not a "need". Don't concede on any of their language.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 25/02/2025 00:18

Darker · 11/02/2025 09:22

This thread seems to be mostly cis-gender people explaining what being transgender is and what they think about it (using their own definitions) and commenting on people’s appearance and mental health.

Then they wonder why the site is listed as anti-trans.

From experience I await another lecture on why I shouldn’t be using the word ‘cis’.

When a trans person can give a definition of "trans" that isn't circular and that all the other trans people agree with (see also: "truscum"), only then can you criticise us describing our perceptions of it based on our experiences of witnessing and interacting with people who call themselves trans.

EasternStandard · 25/02/2025 07:29

@selffellatingouroborosofhate fair point

Darker · 25/02/2025 09:27

I'm just reading more ‘othering’ of people who have an experience of gender that doesn’t conform to a binary definition.

HipMax · 25/02/2025 09:30

Darker · 25/02/2025 09:27

I'm just reading more ‘othering’ of people who have an experience of gender that doesn’t conform to a binary definition.

Nobody's experience of gender conforms to a binary definition. Everyones experience of sex does though, as we are all sex binary.

You have to understand the basics or your opinion is worthless.

Kucinghitam · 25/02/2025 09:33

Who knew? All us Bad People on this thread are either GI Joe or Barbie.

Mumsnet listed as Anti-Trans
AlisonDonut · 25/02/2025 09:37

Darker · 25/02/2025 09:27

I'm just reading more ‘othering’ of people who have an experience of gender that doesn’t conform to a binary definition.

None of us have an experience of 'gender' that conforms to a binary definition. We have sexes that do. That's the whole fucking point.

I have chainsaws and a garage of tools, I worked in construction and yet am female and also had osteoporosis from an early menopause.

GailBlancheViola · 25/02/2025 09:37

What the hell is going on with the arms of No. 7????

Cattreesea · 25/02/2025 09:41

That's bizarre.

Mumsnet is made of thousands of people with different opinions.

Also what does 'anti-trans' mean?

I think many people can both want to see trans people live a happy life, free of stigma and discrimination and be able to present as they wish while also believing that a man can't just become a woman through surgery or wanting to protect kids from taking puberty blockers.

I really don't like this 'cancel' culture that seems to not be able to tolerate debate or people expressing different views. I think it actually it is really counter-productive because it ends up putting off those who were initially supportive of trans people.

That's my journey anyway: I support the right of trans people to be free to be themselves without negative consequences but I have also been completely put off by the attempts to censor any debate on these topics.

TWETMIRF · 25/02/2025 09:48

We're told that being trans means your sex doesn't match your gender. Almost all of us don't have a gender so that makes us trans. Are we anti ourselves @Darker?

Fimofriend · 25/02/2025 09:52

spannasaurus · 08/02/2025 18:46

I can't work out why any poster who believes mumsnet is transphobic continues to use the site.

Because it validates their identity as a woman to be a member of the Mumsnet community.

popefully · 25/02/2025 10:02

TWETMIRF · 25/02/2025 09:48

We're told that being trans means your sex doesn't match your gender. Almost all of us don't have a gender so that makes us trans. Are we anti ourselves @Darker?

Also do we need to accept that female sex "matches" woman gender in order to ascertain if we are trans?
If so, can someone explain why - what is female about a woman?

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 25/02/2025 10:11

Fimofriend · 25/02/2025 09:52

Because it validates their identity as a woman to be a member of the Mumsnet community.

I don't "have an identity as a woman". I was born female, whether I like it or not. And I don't like it: I sometimes experience phantom penis and other symptoms of dysphoria about my female body. I also have the insight to recognise that this is a mental health problem, that it's probably part of being autistic, and that surgery wouldn't actually give me the male body I keep thinking that I should have and would damage the healthy female body I do have.

MarieDeGournay · 25/02/2025 10:19

Darker · 25/02/2025 09:27

I'm just reading more ‘othering’ of people who have an experience of gender that doesn’t conform to a binary definition.

People who ignore scientific fact and claim that there are more than two sexes and that you can switch between, and that transwomen are women are 'othering' themselves, Darker.

They put themselves in the same category as people who believe in astrology or that the earth is flat or that 5g fries your brain or whatever. Some of these beliefs are less harmful than others, but they all have the shared feature of being non-factual.

So anybody who claims that human sex is a spectrum not binary, and you can change from one sex to another is putting themselves in the category of 'OTHER: DOES NOT ACCEPT SCIENTIFIC FACT'

I think most of us would have no problem agreeing with you, Darker, that 'gender' should not conform to a binary definition. It should be possible for little boys and little girls to grown up doing whatever they damn well want, and not be pushed into pink/blue/princess/pirate stereotypes.

In particular, it should never ever be suggested to children that if they feel they don't correspond to a stereotyped 'gender binary', then they must be the problem - they are in the wrong body, their gender identity does not correspond to their biological sex, they have to change themselves - psychically, emotionally, physically, pharmaceutically, surgically.

Gender critical feminism says fuck that - it's the 'gender binary' stereotypes that have to change, not the children.

Anybody who believes the opposite is 'other'.

EmpressaurusKitty · 25/02/2025 10:24

Darker · 25/02/2025 09:27

I'm just reading more ‘othering’ of people who have an experience of gender that doesn’t conform to a binary definition.

Does ‘Gender is sexist bollocks’ confirm to a binary definition?

Helleofabore · 25/02/2025 10:56

I love that someone actually believes that people ‘conform’ to a binary. I honestly thought that since the 80/90s it was understood that no one conformed unless they took great pains to, or were forced to.

AnSolas · 25/02/2025 11:11

GailBlancheViola · 25/02/2025 09:37

What the hell is going on with the arms of No. 7????

Girlie arm on one side
Same as no 5 has boyie arm and a asymmetrical hair cut.

popefully · 25/02/2025 11:14

Darker · 25/02/2025 09:27

I'm just reading more ‘othering’ of people who have an experience of gender that doesn’t conform to a binary definition.

That's literally what Gender ID is though.

If you don't feel feminine/ whatever "being a woman" is supposed to be, you're different and your body is probably wrong.

Do you honestly not see that? How is it inclusive to say a woman is a type of personality, rather than literally any personality at all?

popefully · 25/02/2025 11:30

The very idea itself that something about a person either "matches " their body or not is bizarre to me. How does that concept do anything except "other" people?

I genuinely would love to know.
It's like asking if your height matches your star sign.

Fimofriend · 25/02/2025 15:54

Darker · 09/02/2025 10:02

I experience parts of the site as trans-phobic.

It’s the “I’m not transphobic, but..” vibe.

No one says that. They simply explain that being for women is not being transphobic.

Darker · 25/02/2025 16:08

‘Vibes’ are generally unspoken.

I find a lot of posts here lack genuine curiosity or spirit of enquiry or positivity towards transgender people.

BezMills · 25/02/2025 16:26

How can you possibly know what gender any of us are?

Most of us are under the trans umbrella by some definitions, maybe you are too (I neither know nor care if you are tbf).

Kucinghitam · 25/02/2025 16:28

"I know what you're really thinking (and it's non-approved thoughts)..." Layla, is that you?

Helleofabore · 25/02/2025 16:34

Darker · 25/02/2025 16:08

‘Vibes’ are generally unspoken.

I find a lot of posts here lack genuine curiosity or spirit of enquiry or positivity towards transgender people.

Why do people have to have some
special curiosity about this group? Or to feel ‘positive’ rather than just feeling neutral.

Sounds like you have a prejudice against anyone who is not enthusiastically affirming. It sounds like you, personally, wish to dictate the level of enthusiasm felt for this group.

By all means, crack on with that, but don’t be surprised if people simply ignore your expectations. I mean, you don’t seem to be showing any positive ‘vibes’ towards people who you might not agree with , so isn’t that hypercritical?

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