Mumsnet listed as Anti-Trans

[Hoosemover]

there a list of organisations and Mumsnet is on it. Along with the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

x.com/twisterfilm/status/1888255119449268674?s=61

For real!

As far as I know there’s never been a case for them here.

Maybe it's not happened but I can't imagine anyone would be put with the opposite sex

The only figure I can find is from a study by Correctional Services Canada for the period December 27, 2017 to March 13, 2020, during which time there had been one transman in a male federal facility.

I can't find any figures for the almost 5 years since then.

Only one, thank goodness, but, still, it hardly bears thinking about, what that trans man will have been through while in the male estate.

It would be interesting to know if they put any safe guarding in place. Separate showers?

Nice work finding a case! I didn’t see that when I searched.

You mean females in men's prisons? Because obviously quite a lot of males are put in with women. IDK what the safeguarding is like in Canada for them re showers etc, but there seem to have been a lot of problems in the US and of course some in the U.K.

It would be appropriate if that is the only option, to put a female in a male prison. But what would that achieve, it is a terrible outcome, isn't it?

However, in saying that, part of the whole issue is this sticking point that if someone hasn't disclosed that they are female, they will simply be treated as any other male. Like the patient who never let on that they were female and the medical team was trying for weeks to diagnose them using the male results ranges for diagnosis tools.

And when you look at the 'ideological' aspect of this situation, if a government is to fully treat a person as their gender identity rather than their sex, a government's hands are tied. They can do nothing because they have agreed that gender identity takes precedence over all aspects of life.

Either identity is to be fully treated as real or it should not be, and treated just like any other belief.

It is a woeful situation for any woman, sadly. Regardless of what they believe their identity is.

https://www.canada.ca/en/correctional-service/programs/offenders/gender-diverse.html

'CSC helps offenders who identify gender-related accommodation needs. We place them in institutions aligned with their gender identity (men, woman, non-binary, etcetera) or expression, if they prefer, regardless of:

• their sex (anatomy)
• the gender or sex marker on their identity documents'

https://www.canada.ca/en/correctional-service/corporate/library/research/glance/442.html

'Eighty-two percent of gender diverse offenders with sexual offence histories were trans-women and the remaining 17% were in the "other" group'

institutions aligned with their gender identity

Begs the question whether Canada has any of these that 'align' with a non-binary let alone the myriad 'etceteras' or whether they actually just have a binary choice... almost like humans were assumed to be somehow dimorphic, even in Canada.

Canada reallyis lost. This is mental.

What a terrible outcome

In the ball waxing case the women found the local legal businesses were unwilling to take the case. 49 refusals
He was doing a stick up robbery (sorry 😬) and the government was the gun.

He was doing similar to hotels and the government allowed him to hide from a public record search. Which is why the order made included an obliged of all further applications to file be subject to court permission.

It was pretty crazy. I lived in Vancouver when that was happening.

Such a waste of time and resources.

A lot of us here donated to Vancover Rape Relief during that awful period of Mr Bollocks-waxing, M Oger's hate-fuelled defunding hijinks and the rat nailed to the door.

It warmed my heart to see women from 4,500 miles away rallying to help. Sometimes I really love the women on this board.

Canada has been at the forefront of some very poorly thought out 'progressive' policies. Self ID, assisted dying - it all sounds caring and well meaning until you dig deep into the consequences and see who's being harmed by it. Women and indiginous communities, usually.

My close friend was one of the first to be granted assisted dying in BC.

She was 42 with lung cancer and an 11 yo.

They need to improve the policies because it is a necessary right that needs better screening.

I’m so sorry about your friend, @Princessconsuelabananahammock9

Sorry to everyone for that brief derailment.

Again, that is in no way an answer.

I’m not sure what sort of answer you’re looking for from me but that’s the only one I have.

You said you’re quite proud to be on the list.

Not sure why my experiences and opinions bother you so much.

I did.

But where did I say your experience or opinions bother me at all ?

I disagree

The law allowed it. Hid his weponising for profit (was it $5k to $10k a business ?).

No media outlet covered the story.

One woman and her twitter feed turned up and gave the general public direct access to the court room.

Her action and courage to be a seen and identified when others would not even accept the case and payment to do their job.

Her reporting ensured that the women involved (who could not hide their names on the same public record search) had their stories heard.

Her record was picked up by international media and forced prompted the Canadian media to report.

The politicians in charge of law making were asked to comment so they cant claim they did not know the shitshow issue the law created including the charming pervert (imo) who believed women should be forced by the State and that transpeople were more likely to be criminally inclined.

Other women (any local beauty business ) were protected by having a name and a picture and the creepy MO of his calls.

Parents of teen girls were alerted that a male was trying make contact.

Women globaly realised benefits of the power of independent groundroot reporting

Today I can read a near accurate transcript of how a NHS hospital decided that a woman had an obligation to be in a changing room while a male undresses, and their HR hires doctors who dont understand human biology or the need to have permission before putting hands or objects on someone.

And the BBC has a reporter tripping over themselves not to use pronouns while quoting a registered Doctor who is saying interesting stuff of how a institution handled whistleblowing on patient safety and internal HR conflict.

And the Judge put the court order in place which put a stop to that business model.

I am sure I missed stuff but the stress and harm to the women involved resulted in far reaching benefit to women.

I think you misunderstood.

I was one of the women who supported the businesses in Vancouver.

That was not a value judgement on you.

More to point out that the State set up the business model which allowed him to do what he did. And the case prove there is a problem
But it had benefits beyond the women winning their case.

I think that this NHS Fife case is going to have lasting repercussions beyond the final decision.

I think the discussion around pronouns will continue and the impacts will ripple through.

"In law sex cannot be changed so Dr Upton's sex remains that of a man. It would be very odd indeed if a judge rules that a party to a tribunal had to lie in tribunal by describing a man as a woman. Politeness is one thing but making judicial orders about someone's reality is a different matter entirely."

https://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/comment/scottish-express-referring-dr-beth-34670335

People are seeing quite a number of the repercussions of the demanded accommodations made by a group of people who have a belief about their identity. And they are realising that they have been led to believe due to the ‘treatment’ aspect that these accommodations were expected because there was a medical issue behind it all, but this case is showing that there really isn’t a biological reason behind it. It is a belief.

Language, single sex space access, and special protections in the work place are some of the discussions that will not be going backwards. It is another Isla Bryson or Gavin Hubbard moment in the news.

I agree Helleofabore they could "win" on the staff side but the whole issue has exposed a fundemental problem around informed consent in their core business.

Self ID is based on personal rights (autonomy over body modification etc) when the State had no need to know the sex of the individual as the State should not be engaging is sex based discriminaton. But we as individuals all have a right to discriminate in interpersonal dealings when it comes to autonomy over who can access our body.

Being a hospital sex discrimination would be reflected in the doctor ia always a man so what would a woman know cultural dynamic. So TWAW = woman same as man.

Yet staff can not just be told he is a woman when it comes to a service user.

So I wonder what their written policy was in that situation. As i recall Brighton's policy was fluffy stopping at the individual involved calling a senior staff member but that was to prevent outing the staff member not about patient care.

So the employer has a "100% passing" male with similar to Uptons pattern of behaviour and attituded to sex /biology. That employee cannnot be trusted to follow the non-staff policy and safety net is the staff around him. Yet he is "100% passing" so team member cant tell so they cant be the safety net

So risk is that 0.00000001% (female wanting same sex ) turns up in A&E and they have a 100% chance employee will commit a physical assault.