NHS Fife tries to silence nurse - Sandie Peggie vs NHS Fife Health Board and Dr Beth Upton - thread #5

[nauticant]

Sandie Peggie, a nurse at Victoria Hospital in Kirkcaldy (VH), has brought claims in the employment tribunal against her employer; Fife Health Board (the Board) and another employee, Dr B Upton. Ms Peggie’s claims are of sexual harassment, harassment related to a protected belief, indirect discrimination and victimisation. Dr Upton claims to be a transwoman, that is observed as male at birth but asserting a female gender identity.

The Employment Tribunal hearing started on Monday 3 January 2025 and is expected to continue for 2 weeks. The hearing commenced with Sandie Peggie giving evidence. Dr Beth Upton started giving evidence on 6 February.

Access to view the hearing remotely can be obtained by sending an email request to [email protected] headed Public Access Request (Peggie v Fife Health Board) 4104864/2024 and requesting access.

The hearing is being live tweeted by https://x.com/tribunaltweets and there's additional information here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/peggie-vs-fife-health-board-and-dr. This also has threadreaderapp archives of live-tweeting of the sessions of the hearing for those who can't follow on Twitter, for example: archive.is/xkSxy.

An alternative to Twitter is to use Nitter: https://nitter.poast.org/tribunaltweets

Thread 1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5186317-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse

Thread 2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5267591-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-thread-2

Thread 3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268347-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-3

Thread 4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5268942-nhs-fife-tries-to-silence-nurse-sandie-peggie-vs-nhs-fife-health-board-and-dr-beth-upton-thread-4

Do hope that was a Princess Bride shout out by NC.

Again - why is a complaint labelled 'hate incident' - it rather suggests a predetermined outcome of any investigation. It's not neutral. How come they're allowed to do this but Sandie Peggie isn't allowed to call a man 'he / him' which is not hateful but just a statement of material reality?

Bangs head on desk.

'any docs relating to suspension '

NC - 'that order makes beyond doubt how central nature of cause of that investigation are to matters tribunal [unclear]for this claim

what we're looking for is material to answer ' why was it necessary to suspend SP, why was it necsesary for her to have senior supervision on return to work'

The Judge's long hand is taking me to the fair

No-one knows if it was investigated properly or not, because the paperwork to prove it is noticeably absent

'why did investigation take so long to get going'
'what did trust think it was investigating'

NC the order for production of this info is in very broad terms (she quotes) and it simply hasn't been complied with. Some has been wrung out in dribs and drabs from first R but not from second R.

Edit- not sure if first and second R is right way round.

Are you using headphones? Much clearer with for me.

What changed about what the Trust was investigating

Exactly

'what changed bout what the Trust thought it was investigating'
'when was the change'
'and 'why''

I'm wondering if she's sitting there pissed off as she didn't realise there were things that haven't been disclosed and that she'll have to try and deal with that

NC: I want to remind you - we say it's very clear that 1st rspondent's defiance of judge's order must have been deliberate

I'm super late to the party but was wondering if it's worth emailing for access?

Do they make you turn your camera on?

"first respondent's defiance of Judge Tinnion's order must have been deliberate" omg!

'First respondant's defiance of the judge's order must have been deliberate.'

That is a powerful statement.

Fife wanted everything done in secret, entirely in character to withhold until the last minute. Sounds like grounds for an appeal if the tribunal finds against Sandie - but also impossible for them their processes were correct if they havent documented that.

Didn't something like that happen in the Rachel Meade SWE case? Except that they actually went on to suspend the 2 women who supported her?

I don't like JR but I do think she is reasonably competent so presume her clients have been withholding things from her

1. yes, 2. no

Is it just me or is everybody else's jaw on the floor over the possibility that they stopped an investigation that might come up with the 'wrong' conclusion and are now relying in court on a 'better' one?
And they thought they could get away with it??

They reply very quick and don't need camera on

Probably a question I should ask again in a few weeks but does anyone think it'll be possible to understand the amount of money this tribunal has cost the taxpayer. FOI request?
I would love to be the accountancy team doing the books at a future date:
"so NHS Fife Trust, as a percentage of it's annual budget, spent HOW MUCH defending the right of a man to enter a womens' changing room?"

Well this is looking like a rather murky and devious attempt by NHS Fife to hide evidence of LOTS of doing their investigations wrong.

I've just missed the last ten mins, can you summarise for me? Please

If this is true, then it is shocking. I wonder if their legal team knew about these shenanigans?