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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Defending Women from Gender Ideology Extremism and Restoring Biological Truth

1000 replies

IwantToRetire · 21/01/2025 18:51

Purpose.

Ideologues who deny the biological reality of sex have increasingly used legal and other socially coercive means to permit men to self-identify as women and gain access to intimate single-sex spaces and activities designed for women, from women’s domestic abuse shelters to women’s workplace showers. This is wrong. Efforts to eradicate the biological reality of sex fundamentally attack women by depriving them of their dignity, safety, and well-being. The erasure of sex in language and policy has a corrosive impact not just on women but on the validity of the entire American system. Basing Federal policy on truth is critical to scientific inquiry, public safety, morale, and trust in government itself.

This unhealthy road is paved by an ongoing and purposeful attack against the ordinary and longstanding use and understanding of biological and scientific terms, replacing the immutable biological reality of sex with an internal, fluid, and subjective sense of self unmoored from biological facts. Invalidating the true and biological category of “woman” improperly transforms laws and policies designed to protect sex-based opportunities into laws and policies that undermine them, replacing longstanding, cherished legal rights and values with an identity-based, inchoate social concept.

This will defend women’s rights and protect freedom of conscience by using clear and accurate language and policies that recognize women are biologically female, and men are biologically male.

Policy and Definitions.

The policy is to recognize two sexes, male and female. These sexes are not changeable and are grounded in fundamental and incontrovertible reality:

(a) “Sex” shall refer to an individual’s immutable biological classification as either male or female. “Sex” is not a synonym for and does not include the concept of “gender identity.”

(b) “Women” or “woman” and “girls” or “girl” shall mean adult and juvenile human females, respectively.

(c) “Men” or “man” and “boys” or “boy” shall mean adult and juvenile human males, respectively.

(d) “Female” means a person belonging, at conception, to the sex that produces the large reproductive cell.

(e) “Male” means a person belonging, at conception, to the sex that produces the small reproductive cell.

(f) “Gender ideology” replaces the biological category of sex with an ever-shifting concept of self-assessed gender identity, permitting the false claim that males can identify as and thus become women and vice versa, and requiring all institutions of society to regard this false claim as true. Gender ideology includes the idea that there is a vast spectrum of genders that are disconnected from one’s sex. Gender ideology is internally inconsistent, in that it diminishes sex as an identifiable or useful category but nevertheless maintains that it is possible for a person to be born in the wrong sexed body.

(g) “Gender identity” reflects a fully internal and subjective sense of self, disconnected from biological reality and sex and existing on an infinite continuum, that does not provide a meaningful basis for identification and cannot be recognized as a replacement for sex.

Recognizing Women Are Biologically Distinct From Men.

Full statement text at https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

Every news outlet is reporting this as anti trans legisliaton.

Not one has reported it is about women's rights.

That's why I started this thread, although there are others as hoping the search engines will pick it up.

Seems that women's rights are so unimportant to anyone, that even when there is a political statement about them, the media reports it is about something else.

Defending Women From Gender Ideology Extremism And Restoring Biological Truth To The Federal Government – The White House

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including section 7301 of title 5, United

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

OP posts:
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14
Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:41

WandaSiri · 24/01/2025 19:19

@Lostcat
Collins online dictionary definition of ideology:
An ideology is a set of beliefs, especially the political beliefs on which people, parties or countries base their actions.
The tenets of GII are that that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex, etc, etc

I'll ask again:
Why are laws and policies around the world being changed to reflect the beliefs that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex?
Why are there criminal penalties in some jurisdictions for not going along with these beliefs?
Why are people hounded out of their jobs or careers for not pretending to believe?

Trans ideology is all about forcing compliance especially by women.

The tenets of GII are that that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex, etc, etc

No they aren’t .
This is a projection of anti-trans ideology.

WandaSiri · 25/01/2025 08:44

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:41

The tenets of GII are that that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex, etc, etc

No they aren’t .
This is a projection of anti-trans ideology.

Hilarious.
Total ignorance or total mendacity on display.

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 08:44

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:41

The tenets of GII are that that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex, etc, etc

No they aren’t .
This is a projection of anti-trans ideology.

So why is the word cis imposed then?

And why have women lost sex based sports and spaces because gender identity has been pushed as trumping sex based rights?

Just saying that this is not happening is complete nonsense. We all know it is happening.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:48

WandaSiri · 24/01/2025 19:19

@Lostcat
Collins online dictionary definition of ideology:
An ideology is a set of beliefs, especially the political beliefs on which people, parties or countries base their actions.
The tenets of GII are that that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex, etc, etc

I'll ask again:
Why are laws and policies around the world being changed to reflect the beliefs that sex change is possible, that everybody has a gender identity and that gender identity trumps sex?
Why are there criminal penalties in some jurisdictions for not going along with these beliefs?
Why are people hounded out of their jobs or careers for not pretending to believe?

Trans ideology is all about forcing compliance especially by women.

My point is that there is no distinction between having a problem with trans people and having a problem with trans Ideology if all you mean by trans ideology is being ok with trans people.
It’s like saying I don’t have a problem with gay people , I have a problem with gay ideology.

You’ve invented a thing called GII and decided it means you believe “x, y, z”. It doesn’t.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:52

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 08:44

So why is the word cis imposed then?

And why have women lost sex based sports and spaces because gender identity has been pushed as trumping sex based rights?

Just saying that this is not happening is complete nonsense. We all know it is happening.

Edited

Cis is just a descriptor of a person who is not trans. Like straight is a descriptor of a person who is not gay. Etc.

In terms of sports- this is one specific policy question that can be addressed without all this rage about trans people. But if we must address it - the idea that women’s sports are being overrun by trans people is just bollox- look at the actual data on the number of trans women participating in elite sports . It’s tiny.
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2024/4/16/editorial-obstacles-trans-womens-sports/

AlisonDonut · 25/01/2025 08:56

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:52

Cis is just a descriptor of a person who is not trans. Like straight is a descriptor of a person who is not gay. Etc.

In terms of sports- this is one specific policy question that can be addressed without all this rage about trans people. But if we must address it - the idea that women’s sports are being overrun by trans people is just bollox- look at the actual data on the number of trans women participating in elite sports . It’s tiny.
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2024/4/16/editorial-obstacles-trans-womens-sports/

Edited

Cis is a made up term that was devised by men who [redacted], and it comes from the 'cissy' porn that introduced them to the concept.

hihelenhi · 25/01/2025 08:59

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:52

Cis is just a descriptor of a person who is not trans. Like straight is a descriptor of a person who is not gay. Etc.

In terms of sports- this is one specific policy question that can be addressed without all this rage about trans people. But if we must address it - the idea that women’s sports are being overrun by trans people is just bollox- look at the actual data on the number of trans women participating in elite sports . It’s tiny.
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2024/4/16/editorial-obstacles-trans-womens-sports/

Edited

No, that is the problem. It isn't the case. There are (sexist) assumptions inherent in that description. "Cis" is entirely ideological language. It is like saying "heathen" is a person who is non-Christian, or anyone who is not an adherent of Islam is an "infidel." It is loaded with ideological assumptions.

Why don't you define 'trans' for us?

Try and do it without using sex stereotypes.

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:00

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 08:52

Cis is just a descriptor of a person who is not trans. Like straight is a descriptor of a person who is not gay. Etc.

In terms of sports- this is one specific policy question that can be addressed without all this rage about trans people. But if we must address it - the idea that women’s sports are being overrun by trans people is just bollox- look at the actual data on the number of trans women participating in elite sports . It’s tiny.
https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2024/4/16/editorial-obstacles-trans-womens-sports/

Edited

Yes but it is identifying people through the lens of trans ideology. I'm not cis and I am not trans because I am just me. I don't believe in trans ideology so I don't need a descriptor and I reject it wholeheartedly. Anyone imposing it on me is imposing an ideological belief.

And whilst I can have sympathy with some trans people on a human level you have to look at the impact of the demands of those people. With the example of sport there is one Lia Thomas (as one example) Lia has impacted dozens of females.

No male should be in women's sport. The solution is a women's and an open category.

The same with all other single sex provisions, the small number of trans women impacts large numbers of females.

I know you know this. No one is so stupid not to understand the impact on women.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:00

AlisonDonut · 25/01/2025 08:56

Cis is a made up term that was devised by men who [redacted], and it comes from the 'cissy' porn that introduced them to the concept.

Wow you really really have a problem with trans people.why?

Cis is simply a descriptor that refers to a person who is not trans.
its no more or less “made up” that any word that is used to describe things.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:01

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:00

Yes but it is identifying people through the lens of trans ideology. I'm not cis and I am not trans because I am just me. I don't believe in trans ideology so I don't need a descriptor and I reject it wholeheartedly. Anyone imposing it on me is imposing an ideological belief.

And whilst I can have sympathy with some trans people on a human level you have to look at the impact of the demands of those people. With the example of sport there is one Lia Thomas (as one example) Lia has impacted dozens of females.

No male should be in women's sport. The solution is a women's and an open category.

The same with all other single sex provisions, the small number of trans women impacts large numbers of females.

I know you know this. No one is so stupid not to understand the impact on women.

Yes but it is identifying people through the lens of trans ideology.

What? Do you recognise that some people are trans or do you think being trans is just made up?

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:02

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:01

Yes but it is identifying people through the lens of trans ideology.

What? Do you recognise that some people are trans or do you think being trans is just made up?

I don't know because no one has actually ever defined what trans is?

Can you define it?

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:02

the demands of those people
listen to yourself. Listen to the water.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:04

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:02

I don't know because no one has actually ever defined what trans is?

Can you define it?

I’m sure you have been on threads where I have defined it at length.

Thank you for being honest about how you really feel- you don’t accept that some people are trans. You think being trans means nothing and is made up.

AlisonDonut · 25/01/2025 09:04

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:00

Wow you really really have a problem with trans people.why?

Cis is simply a descriptor that refers to a person who is not trans.
its no more or less “made up” that any word that is used to describe things.

I have a problem with men who transgress boundaries. Just because you fell for a ridiculous concept doesn't mean everyone did.

And it is from cissy porn, I even remember the time when someone discovered the chemical link and then within days, across all the activist sites it was 'oh it is simply a descriptor for 'on the same side as''. Loads of us have been watching this for donkey's years and we saw it happen in front of our eyes.

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:05

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:04

I’m sure you have been on threads where I have defined it at length.

Thank you for being honest about how you really feel- you don’t accept that some people are trans. You think being trans means nothing and is made up.

Care to give a detailed explanation again, I've never seen one?

hihelenhi · 25/01/2025 09:12

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:05

Care to give a detailed explanation again, I've never seen one?

Yes, please do. It's kind of key to the points being made on this thread.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:19

hihelenhi · 25/01/2025 09:12

Yes, please do. It's kind of key to the points being made on this thread.

So to be clear you also don’t understand/ recognise/ acknowledge that being trans is an actual thing? You also think it means nothing and is made up?

Right. Exactly . this is why you support this EO as this denial is now the official policy of the US government. It is anti trans ideology- designed to eliminate any recognition of the existence / legitimacy of trans people . It has nothing whatsoever to do with women’s rights.

WandaSiri · 25/01/2025 09:22

@Lostcat

No.
Gender identity ideology is a pernicious set of beliefs which seek to replace sex with gender identity.

We are not ok with the coercion to pretend that we also believe that you can be born in the wrong body, that your sel-declared gender identity is more important than your sex and that sex-based pronouns have to relate to gender identity. That we have to accept that we all have a gender identity - the imposition of the descriptor "cis" is an example of this.
That male people can be lesbians. That there is no such thing as homosexual attraction, only homo-genderal attraction. The hounding of Jenny Watson, who is trying to set up lesbian dating nights, is an example.

We are not ok that legislators and policy makers have been bamboozled or threatened into insisting that single sex spaces and services have to become single gender spaces and services. Putting males in women's sports, prisons, refuges, etc against the wishes of women, without consulting women, is an example of this.

People have been fined or imprisoned or lost jobs for expressing disagreement with the tenets of this ideology. Women and children in particular have been harmed by the imposition of these beliefs.

lifeturnsonadime · 25/01/2025 09:22

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:19

So to be clear you also don’t understand/ recognise/ acknowledge that being trans is an actual thing? You also think it means nothing and is made up?

Right. Exactly . this is why you support this EO as this denial is now the official policy of the US government. It is anti trans ideology- designed to eliminate any recognition of the existence / legitimacy of trans people . It has nothing whatsoever to do with women’s rights.

Edited

Do you understand that you are asking us to agree or disagree with something that isn't defined?

Do you understand how unreasonable that is?

You have said that you have previously given a detailed description of what trans means on another thread, please can you therefore define it again, once you've done that then I will understand what you are asking me.

This is really not an unreasonable request.

I find it absolutely baffling that you are refusing to define what you mean by trans on this thread.

AlisonDonut · 25/01/2025 09:22

If there was one, it would have been put into this legislation in order to refute it.

The closest they could get was 'gender identity' which doesn't even have an actual definition because there isn't one. As they say, it is shifting.

And pretending that people are either Cis or Trans is part of that 'socially coercive means' which is mentioned in the second line of the OP under 'purpose'.

WandaSiri · 25/01/2025 09:23

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:19

So to be clear you also don’t understand/ recognise/ acknowledge that being trans is an actual thing? You also think it means nothing and is made up?

Right. Exactly . this is why you support this EO as this denial is now the official policy of the US government. It is anti trans ideology- designed to eliminate any recognition of the existence / legitimacy of trans people . It has nothing whatsoever to do with women’s rights.

Edited

Don't be disingenuous.

Give us a definition.

AlisonDonut · 25/01/2025 09:23

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:19

So to be clear you also don’t understand/ recognise/ acknowledge that being trans is an actual thing? You also think it means nothing and is made up?

Right. Exactly . this is why you support this EO as this denial is now the official policy of the US government. It is anti trans ideology- designed to eliminate any recognition of the existence / legitimacy of trans people . It has nothing whatsoever to do with women’s rights.

Edited

If you think it isn't made up, then define it. It's pretty simple.

hihelenhi · 25/01/2025 09:25

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:19

So to be clear you also don’t understand/ recognise/ acknowledge that being trans is an actual thing? You also think it means nothing and is made up?

Right. Exactly . this is why you support this EO as this denial is now the official policy of the US government. It is anti trans ideology- designed to eliminate any recognition of the existence / legitimacy of trans people . It has nothing whatsoever to do with women’s rights.

Edited

No.

I think "being trans" is ONE ideological way of describing someone who doesn't feel they fit old societal sex stereotypes or for their sex and comes with the ideological concept of "being born in the wrong body".

But as I have explained earlier, we know there are others (for example, radical feminism) some of which many of us here grew up with, that also support the idea that you don't have to fit sex stereotypes, but it is not a sign that you are "born in the wrong body". It is a sign that sex stereotypes are wrong .

So. In order to define yourself as what you call "trans" you have to have a belief about what would make you so, what makes you different from others of your sex but the same as members of the opposite sex and how you "know" that you are this.

So once again, if you could tell us your definition of trans, instead of getting outraged that we should even have to ask, as if it's something self evident (it isn't) that would be a starting point. Thanks.

Lostcat · 25/01/2025 09:26

AlisonDonut · 25/01/2025 09:23

If you think it isn't made up, then define it. It's pretty simple.

if you think it isn’t made up
Again, I value this honesty. I think it’s important to be clear what it is that people actually believe / are saying on these threads. Namely that: being trans is “made up”. It doesn’t mean anything at all.

Chersfrozenface · 25/01/2025 09:27

@Lostcat I agree with a PP.
"You have said that you have previously given a detailed description of what trans means on another thread, please can you therefore define it again..."

You could use Copy & Paste.

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