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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Defending Women from Gender Ideology Extremism and Restoring Biological Truth

1000 replies

IwantToRetire · 21/01/2025 18:51

Purpose.

Ideologues who deny the biological reality of sex have increasingly used legal and other socially coercive means to permit men to self-identify as women and gain access to intimate single-sex spaces and activities designed for women, from women’s domestic abuse shelters to women’s workplace showers. This is wrong. Efforts to eradicate the biological reality of sex fundamentally attack women by depriving them of their dignity, safety, and well-being. The erasure of sex in language and policy has a corrosive impact not just on women but on the validity of the entire American system. Basing Federal policy on truth is critical to scientific inquiry, public safety, morale, and trust in government itself.

This unhealthy road is paved by an ongoing and purposeful attack against the ordinary and longstanding use and understanding of biological and scientific terms, replacing the immutable biological reality of sex with an internal, fluid, and subjective sense of self unmoored from biological facts. Invalidating the true and biological category of “woman” improperly transforms laws and policies designed to protect sex-based opportunities into laws and policies that undermine them, replacing longstanding, cherished legal rights and values with an identity-based, inchoate social concept.

This will defend women’s rights and protect freedom of conscience by using clear and accurate language and policies that recognize women are biologically female, and men are biologically male.

Policy and Definitions.

The policy is to recognize two sexes, male and female. These sexes are not changeable and are grounded in fundamental and incontrovertible reality:

(a) “Sex” shall refer to an individual’s immutable biological classification as either male or female. “Sex” is not a synonym for and does not include the concept of “gender identity.”

(b) “Women” or “woman” and “girls” or “girl” shall mean adult and juvenile human females, respectively.

(c) “Men” or “man” and “boys” or “boy” shall mean adult and juvenile human males, respectively.

(d) “Female” means a person belonging, at conception, to the sex that produces the large reproductive cell.

(e) “Male” means a person belonging, at conception, to the sex that produces the small reproductive cell.

(f) “Gender ideology” replaces the biological category of sex with an ever-shifting concept of self-assessed gender identity, permitting the false claim that males can identify as and thus become women and vice versa, and requiring all institutions of society to regard this false claim as true. Gender ideology includes the idea that there is a vast spectrum of genders that are disconnected from one’s sex. Gender ideology is internally inconsistent, in that it diminishes sex as an identifiable or useful category but nevertheless maintains that it is possible for a person to be born in the wrong sexed body.

(g) “Gender identity” reflects a fully internal and subjective sense of self, disconnected from biological reality and sex and existing on an infinite continuum, that does not provide a meaningful basis for identification and cannot be recognized as a replacement for sex.

Recognizing Women Are Biologically Distinct From Men.

Full statement text at https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

Every news outlet is reporting this as anti trans legisliaton.

Not one has reported it is about women's rights.

That's why I started this thread, although there are others as hoping the search engines will pick it up.

Seems that women's rights are so unimportant to anyone, that even when there is a political statement about them, the media reports it is about something else.

Defending Women From Gender Ideology Extremism And Restoring Biological Truth To The Federal Government – The White House

By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including section 7301 of title 5, United

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

OP posts:
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Greyskybluesky · 28/01/2025 00:59

Anyway you've only got about another 20 posts to waste Lostcat before the thread runs out. Congratulations on proving you've taken absolutely nothing on board from it!

FlowchartRequired · 28/01/2025 01:00

Now that is not going to fit with Lost's world view. Oh dear.

nocoolnamesleft · 28/01/2025 01:01

Shame to have an interesting thread destroyed singlehandedly by one misogynist.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:02

Lostcat · 22/01/2025 09:40

Trans people are not a threat to women’s rights.

Criminalising abortion kills women.

Multiple states have abortion rights on their statutes. Some states had referendums on abortion law at the same time as the presidential election, and six states voted for Trump and for legalising abortion. It's by no means a given that Trump is going to try to outlaw abortion.

Males in women's prisons are a threat to female prisoners. This EO protects female prisoners, explicitly.

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:03

I know it’s impossible for you all to get your head around- because of your singular and fanatical understandings/ beliefs about sex, but for what it is worth, as I said earlier in the thread , I’m not an advocate for all “mixed sex/ gender” toilets/ bathrooms. I support trans people’s rights to use bathrooms in accordance with their gender: this does not mean I want to abolish women’s bathrooms or I want men in women’s bathrooms.

FlowchartRequired · 28/01/2025 01:03

Shitposters gunna shitpost.

Maybe we need to have duller sounding titles? Then they won't be tempted out of the woodwork.

Hermyknee · 28/01/2025 01:04

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:03

I know it’s impossible for you all to get your head around- because of your singular and fanatical understandings/ beliefs about sex, but for what it is worth, as I said earlier in the thread , I’m not an advocate for all “mixed sex/ gender” toilets/ bathrooms. I support trans people’s rights to use bathrooms in accordance with their gender: this does not mean I want to abolish women’s bathrooms or I want men in women’s bathrooms.

That makes them mixed sex

UtopiaPlanitia · 28/01/2025 01:05

I posted this detailed article on another Trump EO-related thread and thought it might be of interest here too:

https://badfacts.substack.com/p/america-changes-sides

"In this post I’ll break down what the EO means for American life and what’s changed already."

America Changes Sides

What Trump's two-sexes order means for sports, misgendering, prison, gays, and more

https://badfacts.substack.com/p/america-changes-sides

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:05

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:03

I know it’s impossible for you all to get your head around- because of your singular and fanatical understandings/ beliefs about sex, but for what it is worth, as I said earlier in the thread , I’m not an advocate for all “mixed sex/ gender” toilets/ bathrooms. I support trans people’s rights to use bathrooms in accordance with their gender: this does not mean I want to abolish women’s bathrooms or I want men in women’s bathrooms.

Transwomen are men. They emit sperm and have sperm injectors, aka penises. This makes them part of the male sex class that pose a forced pregnancy threat to women.

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:05

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:02

Multiple states have abortion rights on their statutes. Some states had referendums on abortion law at the same time as the presidential election, and six states voted for Trump and for legalising abortion. It's by no means a given that Trump is going to try to outlaw abortion.

Males in women's prisons are a threat to female prisoners. This EO protects female prisoners, explicitly.

Edited

It's by no means a given that Trump is going to try to outlaw abortion.

oh please. Are you now seriously trying to claim trump isn’t a threat to women’s abortion rights? He was responsible for appointing the Supreme Court justices that led to the overturning of roe and wade.

Datun · 28/01/2025 01:05

I love the relentless TRA logic.

Being forced to lift your skirt to urinate in public won't get you raped, and anyway it's only white middle class women that want single sex facilities. Whilst simultaneously not reading an article about Indian women being raped because they don't have them.

Maybe some posters really are happy for women to be as vulnerable as they possibly can be, given that it never appears to place them in any kind of danger.

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:06

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:05

Transwomen are men. They emit sperm and have sperm injectors, aka penises. This makes them part of the male sex class that pose a forced pregnancy threat to women.

oh god here we are with the descriptors of gametes and genitals.

FlowchartRequired · 28/01/2025 01:08

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:03

I know it’s impossible for you all to get your head around- because of your singular and fanatical understandings/ beliefs about sex, but for what it is worth, as I said earlier in the thread , I’m not an advocate for all “mixed sex/ gender” toilets/ bathrooms. I support trans people’s rights to use bathrooms in accordance with their gender: this does not mean I want to abolish women’s bathrooms or I want men in women’s bathrooms.

The fallacy in what you write is that you include biological males in your definition of 'women'. Therefore they are not 'women’s bathrooms' at all, they are mixed sex toilets. Remember Lost, human beings cannot change sex and women are adult human females.

Have you thought about my single sex question or are you still avoiding it?

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:08

Hermyknee · 28/01/2025 01:04

That makes them mixed sex

so have we always had mixed sex toilets in the uk then? Because trans women have been using female toilets for decades. So what’s the fuss? It’s worked out ok eh? And somehow we still have male and female toilets.

Greyskybluesky · 28/01/2025 01:08

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:06

oh god here we are with the descriptors of gametes and genitals.

I know, right ? Biological facts are just euuwwww!

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:08

We had this thread topic and all these arguments already at https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5257294-i-think-the-spell-is-finally-broken

It's boring having to deal with the same old wilfully-ignorant people who pretend that transwomen are somehow different from other men and can't force women to become pregnant through rape. Because that's what single-sex spaces are about: sparing women from the threat of rape and forced pregnancy.

I think the spell is finally broken... | Mumsnet

[[https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal...

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/5257294-i-think-the-spell-is-finally-broken

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:09

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:08

so have we always had mixed sex toilets in the uk then? Because trans women have been using female toilets for decades. So what’s the fuss? It’s worked out ok eh? And somehow we still have male and female toilets.

It hasn't worked out OK. Katie Dolatowski.

Hermyknee · 28/01/2025 01:09

Nearly at the end…..

I supported a village in Africa to get their girls to school. They needed money to build single sex toilets that were the limiting factor for girls. I think similar is going on in Syria.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:10

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:06

oh god here we are with the descriptors of gametes and genitals.

You mean facts? Yeah, we've noticed that TRAs really dislike facts.

hihelenhi · 28/01/2025 01:10

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:06

oh god here we are with the descriptors of gametes and genitals.

Yes, it's almost as if they are 100% relevant to what sex you are. Whether you are actually male or female in reality. And what happens to you because of that.

What gametes & genitals do you think the raped people in India from that article had versus the people who raped them? Come on, this isn't difficult.

Were they the raped or the rapist because of some mysterious "automatic cognition" that they were one sex or the other that bore no relation to what gametes and genitals they were born with? Was it random which one they might be?

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:10

Lostcat · 26/01/2025 16:58

Ok I am going to take you at your word and give it a try.

The first thing that is difficult in offering a definition is the lack of consensus around terminology - people understand sex and gender in different ways. So I am going to avoid using these short hands and try to describe this in full.

First of all 'biological sex' has multiple components/ is a complex process of development. There are our chromosomes, there is our reproductive anatomy , there is our external genitalia, there are gametes, there are our hormones. All of these together make up biological sex.

Although for the overwhelming majority of people, these aspects all align into one of two cluster typologies, there are also a minority of people who develop differently, producing a range of complex variations so that different aspects of these sex axes/characteristics do not 'align' (in typical ways) with other 'axes'.

Most of these variations have only become visible with the development of contemporary medical technologies that have made previously hidden differences/ aspects of the body observable (when previously they weren't).

There is still so much we don't know/ are learning about biological sex development - for example, there is a lot of interesting research into neurobiological development/ differences. Scientific understanding of the physiology of the brain is still very much developing.

There is also an aspect to 'sex' which is cognitive. This is what some people call 'gender identity'. I am going to avoid that terminology as I understand it triggers people / is associated with being "woo" "ideology". Instead, I am going to call this cognitive aspect to sex "automatic cognitive sex". I am using the word "automatic" to signify that this is related to automatic processing in the brain (e.g. it is not "deliberate" "conscious" or "chosen").

We all have a cognitive sex. This is simply the awareness/ recognition/ understanding of self as being male/a man/ a woman/ female etc. For the vast majority of people, just as their different physical sex characteristics (chromosomes, gametes, genitals, hormones) align, their cognitive sex aligns with their physical sex characteristics. This is so common/ obvious that we take this alignment entirely for granted - indeed we presume that one simply leads to the other - i.e. "I know I am a woman because I was born female".

HOWEVER, just as there are some people who are born with variations in sex development, there are some people for whom their "automatic cognitive sex" does not align with their physical sex characteristics as observed at birth. We don't know why this is or what causes it, but it is very possible that it has a durable developmental biological underpinning - there is some interesting research into this looking at sex development, hormones and neurobiological differences, although the science is in its infancy.

This is what it is to be trans. Although we do not know what causes being trans, we do have a huge body of scientific evidence that being trans does in fact exist (it always has - everywhere) and is very much real. It can be extremely painful/ distressing - particularly when it is repressed/ denied by self and others. It is not something over which a person typically has control, and it is typically not able to be changed/ altered - therapy and other mental health interventions to "cure" transness do not help, but cause significant harm. Being trans often starts very early in life, even if people do not always have the conscious words, ideas, cultural references to identify/ understand/ express their experience until later in life.

This is what being trans is/ means. Nothing to do with gender stereotypes, clothes, behaviour, someone's voice, hating women, hating gay people, belief in "gender woo" or any of the other things people have so far suggested on this thread and many others.

Ok you can all commence getting angry and ridiculing me now. 3, 2,1....

OR... Maybe just read and think about it for a while, and who knows we could have a productive exchange.

Edited

There’s nothing wrong with being trans

FlowchartRequired · 28/01/2025 01:10

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:08

so have we always had mixed sex toilets in the uk then? Because trans women have been using female toilets for decades. So what’s the fuss? It’s worked out ok eh? And somehow we still have male and female toilets.

This bollocks again!

Try answering my question about single sex care, the thread is nearly full so you need to get on with it.

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:11

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:10

There’s nothing wrong with being trans

We all have a cognitive sex. This is simply the awareness/ recognition/ understanding of self as being male/a man/ a woman/ female etc.

I don't. Goes with the autism.

Also, YOU DON'T RAPE SOMEONE OR MAKE THEM PREGNANT WITH YOUR BRAIN. That's why genitals and gametes should trump feelings and identities in law and policy.

hihelenhi · 28/01/2025 01:12

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:10

There’s nothing wrong with being trans

There's nothing wrong with being honest about the sex you literally are. There's a lot wrong with pretending you're something you're not and demanding everyone agrees.

Also, why are you reposting your long post about "cognitive sex" again as if it's somehow definitive? It's irrelevant to what women's rights are for and you couldn't answer anything we asked you about it anyway. It's pseudoscientific nonsense.

Lostcat · 28/01/2025 01:12

selffellatingouroborosofhate · 28/01/2025 01:11

We all have a cognitive sex. This is simply the awareness/ recognition/ understanding of self as being male/a man/ a woman/ female etc.

I don't. Goes with the autism.

Also, YOU DON'T RAPE SOMEONE OR MAKE THEM PREGNANT WITH YOUR BRAIN. That's why genitals and gametes should trump feelings and identities in law and policy.

Edited

I don’t

That’s true. I wished very shortly after I wrote that I had said- almost all of us.

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