Trump announces executive order that says legally there are only 2 genders (hmmm did he mis-speak and meant sex?)

[IwantToRetire]

Well this will add to the confusion.

Have just heard him use the word gender, even though earlier news reports had said he would say only 2 sexes.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/trump-sign-order-proclaiming-only-160700963.html

WHAT

RIGHTS

Damn...

Why would I need to argue with people on Reddit?

Is that what you do?

You asked a question and I answered it.

Is there something about my answer you didn't like?

@leftorrightnow is a right old transphobe.

Rachel Levine wielded far too much power and I am so glad he is out.

Another document recently unsealed shows that Rachel Levine, a trans woman who is assistant secretary for health, succeeded in pressing wpath to remove minimum ages for the treatment of children from its 2022 standards of care. Dr Levine’s office has not commented. Questions remain unanswered, but none of this helps wpath’s claim to be an organisation that bases its recommendations on science.

Archived here:

archive.ph/2025.01.20-090040/www.economist.com/united-states/2024/06/27/research-into-trans-medicine-has-been-manipulated

That 2nd paragraph should have quotes around it, as it's copied from the article I posted, sorry!

Why would I need to argue with people on Reddit?

Because you asked why there can't be biological women only spaces alongside "protections for trans women". It's only trans rights activists who think there shouldn't be, so there is no argument here.

Is that what you do?

No, I just lurk and report people threatening violence to women and politicians. There are lots of them. You won't find so much of that on Mumsnet.

I'm quoting you as you said there isn't a single trans person in political positions and as has been shown you are wrong.

For such a tiny, most oppressed minority they are certainly doing far better than other minorities in being in positions of political power and authority.

Well, if they can't access hormone treatment that's a huge issue especially for those who have already transitioned.

I don't think we know the full scope of issues yet.

What happens when Lisa who transitioned years ago no longer has access to estrogen?

Or when she goes to her job interviews? If trans women no longer exist does that mean they can refuse to hire her? Or find her previous name and start calling her Luke?

I have no clue what will happen, but I don't think anyone does.

Unless someone more knowledgeable than me can share what they know?

I genuinely don't know what this means long term?

Apparently, according to the galaxy brains on Reddit, with Zuckerberg's reverse ferret and TikTok being threatened with banning in the US, Reddit is "the only platform where there is free speech about the GOP" I read this morning.

LOL.

I think he might have...can't remember now. But definitely only 2 - male and female.

Men who identify as trans exist. Of course.

They are not actually the opposite sex, though.

Once that's established, and everyone agrees, then men taking provision and services meant for women shows up the disadvantage to the female sex. And therefore makes no sense, certainly in terms of equality.

A separate issue is whether or not you agree with the ideology as a concept. Personally, I don't. I think it's homophobic and regressive. But I wouldn't outlaw it. People have the right to be homophobic and sexist, and I have the right to disagree with them and explain why.

There are trans women who are kind and supportive of women.

There are trans women who are sexist assholes.

I'm not big on generalizations. I don't think they help anyone.

All those people are men though. Being a woman isn't a special prize for "kindness".

Also, how is that relevant to my post?

https://can-sg.org/2024/06/28/scandalous-suppression-of-research-on-transgender-health/

Men who identify as trans exist. Of course.

They are not actually the opposite sex, though.

Once that's established, and everyone agrees, then men taking provision and services meant for women shows up the disadvantage to the female sex. And therefore makes no sense, certainly in terms of equality.

A separate issue is whether or not you agree with the ideology as a concept. Personally, I don't. I think it's homophobic and regressive. But I wouldn't outlaw it. People have the right to be homophobic and sexist, and I have the right to disagree with them and explain why.

Exactly.

Because you said they don't care about your feelings so why should you care about theirs?

Of course some trans women care about women's feelings. They aren't all assholes.

It doesn't change their sex, I'm just explaining why appealing to my female socialised training to "be kind" isn't going to work on me @Princessconsuelabananahammock9

Or when she goes to her job interviews? If trans women no longer exist does that mean they can refuse to hire her?
This is actually an imprtant question from @Princessconsuelabananahammock9 that is going to beceome relevant.

Ok once we've all agreed there are only 2 sexes can employers discriminate against men who think the'y re women?And men who present as women?

These are going to be the sort of cases that are going to start occurring now, and it's ging to be hard to think through morally and legally.

I think the point is that reasonable compromises tend not to be sufficient for trans rights activists - for instance gender-neutral toilets are not acceptable because transwomen, being women, demand to use the women's toilets. It's all or nothing.

I think the reference to Reddit was because it has banned gender-critical contributors, and therefore it is a platform famous for very extreme and uncompromising 'trans women are women full stop' arguments, along with violent and threatening comments about gender critical people.

Even very reasonable and compromising comments, like JKR's 'dress however you please..' tweet, are attacked on Reddit, so 'try that on Reddit' usually means 'It might seem reasonable to us, but Reddit will shred it!'
It's not usually intended literally, I believe.

What happens when Lisa who transitioned years ago no longer has access to estrogen?

i'm sure that's a very important question for many people in the trans community. And I can understand the concern.

Personally, if the ideology had never got off the ground, this wouldn't be much of an issue.

and reducing the privileges that it provides men with, is going to, in my opinion, massively reduce the need for any wrong sex hormones in the future.

As is not teaching gender ideology in schools.

So maybe this will be a non-problem for future generations.

I don't see why I would need to convince anyone to agree with me in order for their to be those provisions?

I don't argue with the KKK in order to protect my rights?

That would be a collosal waste of time and I won't convince them black people should have equal rights.

I'm discussing government policies.

I'm not concerned with making everyone happy. I just think there is a middle ground being missed.

Yes I completely agree with you @Ereshkigalangcleg.

But some others may take it further by saying that men doing woman-face isn't a very nice thing to do to women at all, so how can they be that nice?

What in particular do you disagree with here?

https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/2025/01/defending-women-from-gender-ideology-extremism-and-restoring-biological-truth-to-the-federal-government/

I'm not concerned with making everyone happy. I just think there is a middle ground being missed.

If you think that, start with the people who don't think there is a middle ground at all then