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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Trump announces executive order that says legally there are only 2 genders (hmmm did he mis-speak and meant sex?)

1000 replies

IwantToRetire · 20/01/2025 17:39

Well this will add to the confusion.

Have just heard him use the word gender, even though earlier news reports had said he would say only 2 sexes.

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/trump-sign-order-proclaiming-only-160700963.html

Trump to sign order proclaiming there are only two sexes

Donald Trump's government is set to recognise only two genders, male and female. The move will come as part of a swathe of executive orders the incoming president will sign on his first day back in the White House. It is one of two branded as "common...

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/trump-sign-order-proclaiming-only-160700963.html

OP posts:
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Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 10:44

If the Democrats had won, you wouldn't be saying, "That's the fault of the Right"

Yes, I probably would, hth.

Abhannmor · 21/01/2025 10:44

SionnachRuadh · 20/01/2025 17:53

He means sex. Americans think it's more polite to say gender. I tend to assume he'll gravitate towards what most voters think is the common sense position.

On Reddit, they're panicking about LGBTQ folx being put in concentration camps. Meanwhile, at his rally last night, Trump was dancing with the Village People.

Years ago the Tea Partiers were convinced they were all going to be relieved of their guns and shoved into 'FEMA camps'. This has been changed to ' 15 minute cities' now. Paranoia left and right.

The worrying thing is how much of this crap has been imported into Britain and Ireland. Whereas , before the advent of social media , it would have been dismissed as loony American bollix by the average punter before she / he got halfway down their pint 🍻.

OverThinkingAnja · 21/01/2025 10:44

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 10:41

Lol that hilarious. every time I come in with a pro trans right stance I get accused of being a man. We all know I can’t prove I’m not on an anonymous forum. Assume you’re making that accusation because you’re out of valid arguments so retreat to focusing on the person rather than the argument.

if anyone has premium feature feel free to check my posts on other threads and see if you think a man would post like that.

You seem to have very fixed ideas of what men and women are like. Unsurprisingly

GailBlancheViola · 21/01/2025 10:47

And transwomen are MEN.

Yes. The clue is in the name - trans means on the opposite side of therefore transwomen are on the opposite side of women, ergo men.

lady69 · 21/01/2025 10:54

Absolutely banging!

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 21/01/2025 10:56

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 09:11

I think it’s a tiny narrow issues which been blown out of proportion by the right wing, aided by useful fools in the feminist quarters.

look at the stats. There are hardly any trans people. How many of you have actively in your own lives had ANY issues with trans people? It’s a media created moral panic.

when feminists pay too much attention to it they loose sight of the very real and much more serious threats to women’s rights coming from the very SAME people who are anti trans rights.

Ending up with feminists praising Trump. It’s a master stroke by him, really. embracing your own worst enemy

Trans ideology has messed up my family. My DW and I are in an impossible bind - either we lie or we risk permanent estrangement from our DS, who has been sucked into a nonsensical worldview that demonises anyone who doesn't elevate gender identity over physical reality. His character and behaviour towards his close family have changed, and not in a good way. Dismissing our experience as "moral panic" is offensive and disrespectful.

As a result of our family troubles, my eyes have been opened to the authoritarianism and misogyny of "progressive" thinking, which removes women as a class of people with female reproductive biology and gives any man the "right" to everything that women have fought for for at least 200 years in the UK. When "progressive" means twisting truth, the consequences are far reaching.

I want my son to be treated reasonably. This does not mean telling him that he is a woman, and in consequence that the has the right to use women's spaces. It does not mean affirming him in his current thinking and telling him that anyone who doesn't agree with him hates him. It does not mean encouraging him to think that the solution to his autistic tendency not to fit societal norms is to try to fit "feminine" norms instead of "masculine" ones, with the "logical" conclusion that he needs oestrogen and other "gender affirming care" that will damage his male body. It does mean not being treated worse than other men in employment and housing, for example, on the basis of "gender reassignment".

And I want my son to understand and act on his male duties of respect and care towards all women.

MarieDeGournay · 21/01/2025 10:56

JessaWoo · 21/01/2025 10:39

That's quite simplistic, don't you think?

If the Democrats had won, you wouldn't be saying, "That's the fault of the Right". You might say it was a combination of factors, of that they ran a good campaign - not that they only won because of the other side's catastrophic failure. You're running a campaign against the left, for whatever reason.

Sadly, as someone who has always been 'of the left', I think your last sentence should be the other way round.

The left used to at least pretend to want to promote women's rights and sexual equality. Now they support transgender ideology which acts to maintain the unequal status quo between the sexes by altering the definition of the word 'woman' so it includes men, 'TWAW', which is clever-clever intellectual wordplay, but reinforces rather than challenges the position of women in society.

I think nothing good of Donald Trump. I'm in the 'stopped clock' camp - he is right to assert, for whatever reasons, that there are only two sexes [I don't care how many 'genders' there allegedly are, because gender is just a changeable social construct, whereas sex is immutable]. Full stop. That's it. Nothing else positive to say about Donald Trump ever, in any way.

PurpleSparkledPixie · 21/01/2025 11:02

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 10:41

Lol that hilarious. every time I come in with a pro trans right stance I get accused of being a man. We all know I can’t prove I’m not on an anonymous forum. Assume you’re making that accusation because you’re out of valid arguments so retreat to focusing on the person rather than the argument.

if anyone has premium feature feel free to check my posts on other threads and see if you think a man would post like that.

Assume you’re making that accusation because you’re out of valid arguments .
No. Just responding to YOUR OWN COMMENT that I actually quoted. And why would me thinking you were a man be classed as an accusation?? Now that's the funny part. Methinks a "subtle" bit of DARVO is going on here.

And based on this last post I'm also going to assume you are the poster formerly known as Adam and therefore will not be responding to you again.

HPFA · 21/01/2025 11:02

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 09:47

Why are you so focused on this issue to the exclusion of much more widespread issues for women such a violence against women, lack of equal pay, lack of funded childcare, lack
of women in power and politics etc etc?

You can turn that the other way round though.

Why the insistence on getting male people into female sports when this was obviously never going to be seen as fair by the vast majority?

When I see photos of a male atop a podium and a female stood with head bowed in second place I scream not just because these things are wrong in themselves but also because I don't understand why this weapon is just being handed to people who certainly don't have the best interests of female people at heart.

Trans activists keep asking "why do you make such a fuss about sport?" but never seem to ask themselves why it's so important to them.

Abhannmor · 21/01/2025 11:05

JessaWoo · 21/01/2025 10:39

That's quite simplistic, don't you think?

If the Democrats had won, you wouldn't be saying, "That's the fault of the Right". You might say it was a combination of factors, of that they ran a good campaign - not that they only won because of the other side's catastrophic failure. You're running a campaign against the left, for whatever reason.

The Left is to blame inasmuch as their campaign had two weak pillars - Abortion rights and ' threat to democracy '.
The Democrats did quite well in special elections and congressional mid terms in 2022. The loss of Roe v Wade helped them in these low turn out contests - even in strong Republican areas. And pro choice Referendums won in these places. But this actually neutered the issue - it could be sorted at state level.
Then the threat to democracy - if Trump loses he won't accept it. Or if he wins he'll cling on forever. But he left office in 2020? So nobody really believed in this Threat.

Trump talks about making people better off by attacking Canada or tariffs on China etc. All nonsense like his promise to bring back coal mining or steel works in the Rust Belt. But at least he said it....

RapidOnsetGenderCritic · 21/01/2025 11:20

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 10:32

it Doesn’t include men. It includes trans people.

Do you think my son, a trans person, should be included in the category of women?

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 11:34

PurpleSparkledPixie · 21/01/2025 11:02

Assume you’re making that accusation because you’re out of valid arguments .
No. Just responding to YOUR OWN COMMENT that I actually quoted. And why would me thinking you were a man be classed as an accusation?? Now that's the funny part. Methinks a "subtle" bit of DARVO is going on here.

And based on this last post I'm also going to assume you are the poster formerly known as Adam and therefore will not be responding to you again.

Omg this is bonkers who one earth is Adam?

stop invalidating my point of view with fake accusations. Of course I’d be less legitimate if I was a man pretending to be a woman?

some recent random threads I’ve posted on, Including one I started.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/styleandbeauty/5250774-how-much-swimwear-do-you-take-on-holiday-with-you?page=4&reply=141445074

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/chat/5198495-how-did-you-celebrate-your-40th?page=3&reply=141499060

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/money-matters/5243088-whats-your-best-tips-for-saving-up-being-frugal-and-managing-money?page=4&reply=141176150

www.mumsnet.com/talk/money-matters/5147420-how-im-turning-my-ps12k-debt-around?reply=141499380

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:39

like I said I’d be much less gentle if this was a group of men

Your quote @leftorrightnow - what exactly do you think you're holding back on?

Maaate · 21/01/2025 11:39

Oh when will these TRAs change the fucking script?

It's BORING me.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:44

@Maaate

So far we have had:

Yes the left took it too far

You shouldn't have focused on "trans rights" or let the right do so

You shouldn't praise the thing you agree with that Trump has done

What are you even bothered about, there's no issue with women losing rights

Men aren't being included in the definition of "women" "trans people" are, so why are you bothered, no men are involved

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 11:44

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2025 11:37

Yet you haven’t read any of the threads detailing the extensive negative impact that trans rights and its activism has had on women and girls.

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/3348290-It-will-never-happen-resource-thread

That’s right despite not being Adam I haven’t read every single thread on this issue. Have read enough to have a clear picture.
as I said, I don’t agree with going overboard on trans rights but Trump is now pulling too far the other way and he’s not doing it for the sake of women no his presidency won’t improve women’s rights

myplace · 21/01/2025 11:45

I wonder, if Trump were to announce it’s really harmful to drink bleach and we need to clarify that on the packaging and make the lids secure, would you be arguing that was unimportant too?

If he came out with the need for guns to be stringently controlled and only accessible in certain highly regulated situations?

If, say, he began working on ending the stark inequity of black women’s health outcomes, particularly maternity provision. Are we still aghast about that because of who he is?

The man’s a toad. Sometimes he’ll accidentally do some good, and it’s worth noticing when he does. Not to applaud him, but to know where next to focus.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:46

as I said, I don’t agree with going overboard on trans rights but Trump is now pulling too far the other way

As he was always going to. The impetus was on US leftists not to hand him the victory on a silver platter.

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 11:47

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:39

like I said I’d be much less gentle if this was a group of men

Your quote @leftorrightnow - what exactly do you think you're holding back on?

I’d tell you straight out you’re playing into the hands of the global right wing turn and being useful fools for Elon and Farrage and Murdoch as everyone else who created the Brexit travesty.

NotBadConsidering · 21/01/2025 11:47

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 11:44

That’s right despite not being Adam I haven’t read every single thread on this issue. Have read enough to have a clear picture.
as I said, I don’t agree with going overboard on trans rights but Trump is now pulling too far the other way and he’s not doing it for the sake of women no his presidency won’t improve women’s rights

Have read enough to have a clear picture

You haven’t read anything every thread but you feel you have a good enough grasp to dismiss statements that the impact on women and girls has been extensive?

Ok.

leftorrightnow · 21/01/2025 11:48

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:46

as I said, I don’t agree with going overboard on trans rights but Trump is now pulling too far the other way

As he was always going to. The impetus was on US leftists not to hand him the victory on a silver platter.

The election was actually pretty close. One of the closest in recent history. Wasn’t a landslide by a mile off, although you should think it was judging by the MAGA camps behavior

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:49

@leftorrightnow

Then do it, it's just the same ridiculous accusation whether you say it or darkly allude to it.

And as I said, we disagree entirely on who are actually the "useful fools" here.

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:51

Also, Brexit is done. I didn't vote for it but we live in a democracy, and them's the breaks. Get over it. If you don't like democracies, there are other forms of government you could experience.

Maaate · 21/01/2025 11:52

Ereshkigalangcleg · 21/01/2025 11:44

@Maaate

So far we have had:

Yes the left took it too far

You shouldn't have focused on "trans rights" or let the right do so

You shouldn't praise the thing you agree with that Trump has done

What are you even bothered about, there's no issue with women losing rights

Men aren't being included in the definition of "women" "trans people" are, so why are you bothered, no men are involved

Frustrated Cbs GIF by Paramount+

Why don't you care about VAWG, or abortion, or children, or the pay gap, etc. etc.

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