The Democrats Need an Honest Conversation on Gender Identity

[Ingenieur]

An interesting article in The Atlantic today, and a sign the tide might be turning in the USA.

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2024/11/democrats-dishonest-gender-conversation-2024-election/680604/

Most voters think that biological sex is real, and that it matters in law and policy. Instructing them to believe otherwise, and not to ask any questions, is a doomed strategy. By shedding their most extreme positions, the Democrats will be better placed to defend transgender Americans who want to live their lives in peace.

Baby steps

Montana governor defends removal of 14-year-old from parents who opposed gender identity

“We were told that letting [the child] transition and live as a boy was in her ‘therapeutic best interest’ and because we aren’t willing to follow that recommendation, the court gave CFS custody of [the child] for six months,” Krista told Reduxx.

Transgender minors protected from estranged parents under Washington law | PBS News

Thanks for linking. I had no idea quite how important it was to US voters. Particularly among swing voters, which explains so much. Among that group it looks like it is the most important issue!

Never heard of him before today but first impressions are he's a right prat. Shouting over someone else, not letting the other guy make his point. Jay clearly doesn't support free speech.

There's a clip of Alastair Campbell on Twitter saying that he and Rory Stewart hadn't understood how important "woke" issues were in the US election but apparently a man had come along and explained it to them and now they understood.

I guess they just couldn't hear all of the women who were trying to tell them about this for the past however months and years because our voices were too high and shrill.

x.com/TwisterFilm/status/1855672906610532503

The interesting thing about the they/them ads is that by just showing Rachel Levine and the bag-stealing dude together it evokes a “Fuck off” kind of reaction.

What people SAY about men cosplaying as women and what they viscerally FEEL must be different, given how incredible effective it was.

The rights and needs of 50% of the population is not a 'single policy'. Don't demean women by suggesting this is about a single policy. In addition the 'single' policy affects children. It doesn't affect men as much, as they couldn't care less about women in their sports or locker rooms - which is something that's not going to happen anyway. Because the female trans sports people who identify as male compete in the women's category and shower with women.

That’s a bizarre, victim-blaming statement. And that’s not what my post meant at all, BTW.

How on earth is that "victim blaming"?

The Democrats aren't victims, they're a political party who have lost an election because they failed to win the support and trust of the electorate.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0mzl7zygpmo.amp

👏👏👏

Once you see it you can't unsee it. If it's not such a big deal, why is it only one side that is being told to suck it up?

• ye ould miniscule amount argument
• any man in any women's sports is not miniscule when the men will then beat all women (see Lia Thomas, Lauren Hutton, Emily Bridges, K boxer )
• Why should any woman or girl ever have her sports win taken by a man
• USA sports grants and scholarship are very big issues indeed for school and college students, allowing males to take them is a major issue
• ye even oulder it's the media's fault for reporting, that's ridiculous
• you have zero respect for women or girls achievements in sports

We are not debating healthcare on this thread. If you want to discuss Trump and American healthcare start a thread and stop trying to derail this thread.

The public really only say soundbites like ‘No men in women’s sport’ (although the occurrence of such is minuscule) because they’ve read them endlessly in media, and then repeat them mindlessly.

This comment shows just how out of touch you are, you clearly don't understand the importance of sport in the USA, the fact that it opens doors to College scholarships and more and you therefore don't understand that parents and their daughters who lose out due to men taking their places are angry.

Parents do not want their young daughters being forced to change in locker rooms with boys, they do not want their daughters injured playing sport against boys, they do not want their daughters hopes and dreams crushed because boys are taking their rightful opportunity of fair sport from them.

It is not mindless and to dismiss it as such is yet more evidence of just how little the Democratic Party and you value women and girls.

One of the talking heads on the USA election stated that over 80% of Democratic voters opposed men in women's sport. It is not a soundbite or a fringe issue.

Yes. How did a political party behaviour analysis, a political party who deliberately ignored the views of female people raising alarms about their situation and what they have experienced through their children , get categorised as a victim blaming statement?

The denial of women and girl’s voices being heard and spread without ‘bots’, of women and girls directly speaking in front of politicians, in front of traditional media is bizarre. Because when anyone tries to clarify, there is this deflection tactic employed.

Yet, women and girls have been campaigning for at least half a decade directly to governments. Directly with sporting organisations. All dismissed .

I think this really should not be underestimated.

Many girls have already been affected by the removal of Title IX and have been 'taught that their feelings are less important'. Their parents can see this.

Riley Gains also posted this a few days ago.

Two house democrats u turning.

It’s not minuscule because it goes to the heart of the them/us narrative that’s feeding popularism across the democratic world. People are tired of being told they are wrong/transphobic/alt right because they won’t go along with the brazen lie that men can be women. This Orwellian directive makes people feel like they are being gaslit, condescended to and lied to all the time because they’re not part of the special and powerful group that believes utter bullshit.

I think we can expect a whole business of reverse ferrets before the next election.

Add to that the complete narcissistic meltdowns that the left are having all over social media (all the rants, wailing, screaming and threatening post and videos) for all to see and normal people are starting to wake up to quite how unhinged the "progressive left" are. It doesn't look good and with the changes that Trump has claimed that he'll bring into malpractice time barring rule's, the olsen-kennedy review, wpath and leveen (sp) being dragged kicking and screaming into the light, there's going to be a lot of people in need of golden bridges soon

And PS I loathe Trump, but the audacity of calling MAGA a cult while not recognising the gender cult that’s become embedded in so many sections of government and civil society is unbelievably blinkered.

Not the Democrats themselves, but the people that voted for them that could now lose their healthcare - you said “sit back and watch whilst their supporters lose access to lifesaving healthcare”.

That’s victim-blaming.

A lot of women who are liberal but at the same time realise the importance of recognising the reality of biological sex and the consequences of denying it are forced into the shadows and silenced by this polarised debate. Time to recognise that by diluting the category of female/woman is doing favours to no one. Not the trans community and defo not 51% of the human race. Very sensible. Hope Lisa Nandy and the SNP are watching this with interest.

Yes we had Johnson voted in to Get Brexit Done.

See, I think very, very few people think “men can be women” and vice versa. I’ve never, ever met anyone who thinks this. You don’t even need special knowledge of science or biology to know this. “Orwellian directive”, indeed - Orwell would be so annoyed to know his work is being so misused and misquoted.🙄

Seems like a conversation might happen at long last.

Get ready for all the reverse ferretting and "Oh, but it wasn't ME who said X, and when I said Y I actually meant Z" etc.