Slaughtering women & girls is *not* terrorism, according to the police

[YellowAsteroid]

Well, what is it then, when women & girls are targeted because they are specifically girls & women ?

Just your common or garden slaughter?

I'm so so angry about the way in which the regular murder of girls & women because they are female is not seen as political, or a terrorist action.

Incels hate & feel threatened by Taylor Swift & strong, influential women like her.

They hate young girls being inspired by other women & having positive female role models.

I absolutely agree. Since I started working in the VAWG sector it enrages me beyond belief that the powers that be keep pretending there isn't a pattern, a theme, or a common denominator at play with these sort of violent crimes.
They're hate crimes. They're terrorism. They affect how safe 50% of the population feel, how they perceive themselves in relation to other people, and what choices they make on a daily basis.
The problem is male violence, male entitlement, misogyny and the excuses society makes for those things.

I know what you mean. Americans are still considered Italian if born to parents with Italian ancestry who live in the States.

Joan Smith writes about the link between domestic violence, VAWG and terrorism.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/aug/05/many-terrorists-abuse-women-research-extremist-attackers-violent-misogyny

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Home-Grown-Domestic-Violence-Turns-Terrorists/dp/1787476049

I said on another thread I saw a screenshot this morning from elsewhere online from a popular incel forum where the men on there were celebrating this and calling it life fuel. There were people braver than I who had been on the site where they said it was full of violent fantasies about harming women and girls but then after they all add, but only in GTA 6 or only in video games. They obviously feel like they can say what they like as long as they pretend it’s just a joke.

Well it isn’t funny at all to me or any woman. The authorities need to start taking this form of terrorisim which as the political aim of subduing women seriously, trace the men who use these sites before more harm is done.

It was absolutely pre-meditated. He took a taxi (which he refused to pay for), was armed & with intent.

No it is not political in this instance. This particular atrocity has the hallmarks of a hate crime against women and girls.

With all due respect to your friend, unless she was born outside of Japan but nonetheless is ONLY considered a citizen of Japan becuase she doesn't qualify for citizenship of wherever she was actually born, she may well be culturally japanese and she certainly has every right to consider herself so, but that is not her only background.

DH's family and mine were both immigrants to the country we both come from. He considers himself both and has both passports etc. He speaks the languages etc etc.

I consider myself purely a national of the other country, notwithstanding that I now live in England (where my parents are from), have a British passport etc. I do, however, consider myself to have English heritage.

I actually find it very annoying when people try to pretend that even though they were born and bread in a country, they aren't actually that nationality. I bet they don't feel like that when they're trying to qualify to compete for the Olympics or when they're signing up for benefits.

This boy may well have Rwandan heritage but we know nothing about his background beyond that.

Exactly this. It’s sickening.

No, they're considered Italian American. They do absolutely identify with their Italian ancestry and culture, but they are still American and are as likely to play baseball, eat apple pie etc etc etc etc.

Exactly. Also the aftershocks, how many parents will refrain from sending their kids to similar camps for fear of similar attacks.

I'm undecided whether calling it terrorism is helpful or unhelpful in tackling VAWG but I agree that it fits the definition.

The intent to inflict violence on women is definitely political if you accept a small p definition of politics. It's about women having a second-class status to men and men being entitled to use force, sometimes fatal, to achieve that.

All the men out there who wouldn't inflict it themselves and nod along sympathetically with women when they hear/read about it but otherwise do nothing and don't call out poor male behaviour when they can are contributing to the problem. Pointing out they are ignoring a form of terrorism rather than 'one of those things' might help to focus their minds...

When a man commits violence against women and girls, all women and girls are harmed and all men and boys benefit. It's absolutely appropriate to call this terrorism when it occurs.

Reposting from another thread:

Every man who has a woman say "yes" when she wanted to say "no" because she feared that he would murder her has benefited from the lesson to all women that men like Kyle Clifford [who murdered Carol, Hannah, and Louise Hunt with a crossbow] teach.

Every man who gets a job because a woman was too scared to even apply because she feared that she would not survive the walk home has benefited from the lesson to all women that men like Josef Puska and Wayne Couzins teach.

Every man who gets a job in construction or tech because a woman left the industry because of sexual harassment benefits from the actions of the harassers, even if he does not himself harass.

Men as a class benefit from male violence against women. Even the "good men".

Same as the Irish. Irish born Americans are always very proud to refer to themselves as "Irish-American".

👏👏👏

There is no hate crime for killing women or girls. Misogyny does not come under hate crime legislation.

This thread takes the fucking biscuit! The armchair detectives have the case all sown up eh? Don't need a police investigation at all it seems! Oh and nice to see the racist digs too 🙄 after all male and Rwandan well he's goota hate women eh?? 🙄

Truth is neither OP or any of the rest of us have any idea what the motivation was. This is all just wild speculation.

But we don't know anything about the motive for the attack yet. I'd agree that there's a terrorising effect, that it makes women and girls frightened to live their normal lives. But we don't know if that was the aim. It could be something more personal to the perpetrator. We don't know yet.

I'm conscious that MN keep pulling threads that speculate about the matter. This one will likely go the same way, I imagine.

You say it far better than me @tinydancer88

And I wasn't really only referring to the awful awful slaughter in Southport (that genteel quiet beautiful town, my heart weeps) - it was the spur to a broader point, but motivated by the Radio 4 BBC News this morning that police did not see it as a terrorist event.

It really angered me - this IS terrorism against women and girls.

2 women a week, murdered because they are women.

Exactly parents will think twice before putting their children into similar camps. Afraid to enjoy their summer.
There was no warning before this pre-meditated mass stabbing.

It’s not wild speculation though is it? That a female centred space was targeted and the victims were pretty much all female conclusions can be drawn It’s unlikely to be the real ira for example is it?

Yes, if it was an out of control mental health crisis it would have happened wherever he was, with a mix of people, he chose to get a taxi specifically to this dance workshop for primary aged girls.

He didn't target a men's bodybuilding class did he?

It's insanely offensive to the hundreds of thousands of mentally ill people in the UK who seem to manage not to go around killing primary aged girls to pin this on mental health. And it allows men to get away with VAWG.

Exactly.

And even if there was 'only' one specific intended target that was personally known to him, why there? Why then? From the little we know, he seems to have travelled there specifically with the murder weapon. It doesn't seem to be a massive leap to assume if that was the case, it was done to cause the maximum level of fear to a particular demographic. If it was 'just' one woman or girl he was after, what on earth could she possibly have done? It just seems to be so likely to be about power and control, which is overwhelmingly the driver of violence against women and girls.

I hadn't seen that. Thanks.

Psychosis usually has its own internal logic. It’s really not appropriate to speculate, and in any event it’s not about letting killers off lightly as the detention somewhere like Broadmoor can be much longer than a prison sentence with fewer rights.