TWO “Female Boxers” Set To Compete At Paris 2024 Were Previously Disqualified From Women’s World Championship For Having “XY Chromosomes”

[Signalbox]

Surely this cannot be true. In boxing of all sports. I thought boxing had told men they needed to compete with other men?

”Two athletes competing at the Paris Olympics as “women” were previously disqualified from a women’s world championship for having “XY chromosomes.” Imane Khelif of Algeria and Lin Yu-Ting of Taiwan are scheduled to compete in Olympic women’s boxing next week despite past questions surrounding their biological sex.”

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Is this true?

Responding to Khelif’s victory on Thursday, Mr Adams told reporters: “Testosterone is not a perfect test. Many women can have testosterone which is in what would be called ‘male levels’ and still be women, and still compete as a woman.

The fact is that as soon as a man is in a women’s competition, that competition is unfair. In boxing, it’s also dangerous. The fact that he has sometimes lost is irrelevant. Even if he was out first round, the fact he is there means a woman isn’t, and that’s unfair.

Male athletes being beaten by female ones is just evidence that mediocre males can be beaten by elite females. It doesn't make things fair and is a really, profoundly stupid argument. Cliff Richard plays tennis as a serious hobby. If he was beaten by Emma Raducanu in a match would you argue that males don't have a physical advantage in sport? 'Crap male athletes can be beaten by brilliant female athletes, therefore they should be allowed to enter top sporting events' is an embarrassment of an argument.

Khelif is not trans. Iran, arguably the most homophobic country on the planet, state-sponsors sexual reassignment surgery and fields 'transitioned' males in women's sporting events. The argument that an authoritarian regime would never support trans athletes is both wrong and irrelevant.

Honestly, it feels like we have to repeat the same arguments over and over on these threads.

I believe that Adams is referring to 46XY 5ARD. So a male DSD.

We know that male individuals have competed in womens events at the Olympics with this DSD.

I keep on seeing people saying the IOC wants an excuse to drop boxing from the Olympics. Given that boxing is a really popular and well-established sport, what is behind that thinking? Do they see it as being too dangerous? (Which would be ironic.)

Oh right, back to women should just ‘try harder’ or ‘train harder’ or ’be better’.

Khelif has failed gender tests by a world sporting federation. Khelif has been shown to be not female and decided not to pursue a case at CAS.

Slow handclap for the misogynists.

no - it's nonsense and he should know better

@Plasmodesmata no it’s not true. Any “woman” with testosterone levels in the male range is either

a) doping
or
b) seriously unwell, likely with multiple cancerous tumours
or
c) actually a man

More info here: x.com/hoovlet/status/1819017510005407984?s=46&t=vZsKCHJJ4lL6NrAoNyJFww

I wonder if the two male boxers will deliberately underperform to kill off this debate?

It’s the first item on BBC TV One O'clock news. Interview with Lisa Nandy.

What is with the claims on Twitter claiming that Khelif has a cervix and a uterus (tweets which are getting tens of thousands of likes) Where the hell are they getting that from?

And I see Sally Hines is posting her usual nonsense. The GCs are coming after a woman athlete for not conforming to our conservative and racist ideas of what a woman is. Yes it's nothing to do with fairness and safety in women's sport and everything to do with enforcing damaging stereotypes 🙄

How can she bear to be so disingenuous?

Imane Khelif is a woman, not a man.

She has also been beaten in boxing by not 1 but 9 women before. If Carini wasn't able to join these women then that's on her.

"I hope we’re all agreed we’re not calling for people to go back to the bad old days of sex testing, which was a terrible thing to do and I’m sure we all agree that’s not the way forward in this situation.”

But why is it a terrible thing?

It's a once in a lifetime cheek swab - not painful, undignified or intrusive. In 1996 the IOC polled athletes about sex testing and 82% of women voted in favour - but the IOC dropped it anyway. The only reason to class it as 'terrible' is if you think keeping men out of women's sport is wrong.

ScienceofSport has written a great thread on the use of cheek swabs this morning.

Bottom line - they are not perfect but can easily be used as a “screen” rather than a “test” with any athlete failing the screen then sent for more detailed tests to establish the circumstances.

x.com/scienceofsport/status/1819332741105606960?s=46&t=vZsKCHJJ4lL6NrAoNyJFww

He is very much a man. That's why he was disqualified from women's boxing by the international governing body. He's also clearly a man.

Think about what kind of person you are criticising the reaction of a woman who was repeatedly punched by a man. Seriously. You are not the good guy here.

Anyone who truly believes IK is a woman - in the actual sense of the word when we're not pretending - would surely support sex testing?

Anyone who believes IK is male but has CAIS ( the key being COMPLETE insensitivity to testosterone) would surely be saying how they know this?

More clarity is beneficial to all sides of this argument surely?

Saying stuff like "but there's always physical advantages like foot size and height, or they've been beaten by women before" makes it clear that truth is not sought, but obfuscation. Which is ALWAYS about men's rights when it boils down to it.

my local ish green candidate (sadly she was unsuccessful and the tories won the new seat she contested) has weighed in.

She's a geography teacher so quite well educated...

Someone is all up in her FB post dropping truth bombs, I'd not be surprised if it's a MNer.

Tony Jeffries, who is a boxing silver medallist, but not - in all fairness - much of a biologist, has weighed in saying she's a woman with XY chromosomes and high testosterone. Glad you cleared that up Tony.

They are lying and spreading misinformation due to the existence of Swyer Syndrome. Women with Swyer have an XY chromosome but also a uterus. So they are using the existence of such women to pretend that is what Khelif was born with. If women with Swyer syndrome have a uterus, Khelif has a uterus. That's their whole argument. Never mind the fact that osteopenia and extreme risk of osteoporosis is caused by Swyer syndrome and taking punches like an Olympic level boxer wouldn't happen.

It's all so genuinely disgusting. I feel fucking sick all day. We're a lost cause.

yep. very easy to justify on the basis that anyone who passes the test is automatically in, always. nearly everyone who disagrees with having the test either explicitly or implicitly favours self ID, which is plainly no more acceptable for boxing sex categories then it is for boxing weight categories.

Does that mean that rare Swyer people are the only female people who are XY?

If it's acceptable to test for relative disability in the Paralympics, why isn't it ok to test for sex differences in the Olympics?

No it's a proven lie. A blatant woman-hating lie.

Using women with cancer to try and justify men cheating in sports is pretty low too.

The Algerian boxer certainly seems intent on gold, as do his team.

Because abusive men should just get carte blanche to do what they want, I think. That must be it, doesn't make sense otherwise.