No more puberty blockers for children from the NHS - reported in the Times!

[MrsOvertonsWindow]

This is massive - and long overdue

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/97ce2e81-2884-42f5-bb82-2a2778f2cc91?shareToken=9568e79f0683beea68ffe5e978b05a29

I think throwing children under the bus is the old way.
The new way is to invite the child into the bus with sweets and puppies to learn twerking, and other things........
The old way was a much cleaner faster kill. The new way is a far more prolonged hell.

I see Stonewall and Jolyon think they know more about what is safe and appropriate to prescribe than Cass, the NHS and Nice. 🙄

If you can self identify as anything why not be an expert in it!

Kemi is so good

https://twitter.com/KemiBadenoch/status/1767607669299290245?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Yes, this. They should never of had these in the first place.

Apologies, I haven't read the full thread, but can anyone tell me if this affects NHS Scotland/sandyford? I hardly dare to hope...

Thank Goodness

I would be interested to see how these studies are set up. The gold standard for interventional therapies are randomised controlled trials. I can't see how these are possible as i cant see participants being willing to be randomised between affirmative and exploratory therapy. Also, as the harms of puberty blockers and the inevitably x sex hormones, i cant see an ethics board agreeing to give kids a treatment regimen known to be harmful for anything less than a life threatening/limiting condition, which gender distress is not.

Then there are the end points. What would be measured? If the measure is the resolution of gender distress, given the known harms of medical intervention versus the lack of harm from talking therapy or doing nothing, medical intervention would have to be massively more efficacious to ever be considered as the gold standard, and unresolved gender distress would have to be viewed to be as risky as the issues with puberty blockers and x sex hormones .

Also, these are complex kids. If medical intervention is shown to relieve gender distress, but they are still not fully functioning members of society because they are depressed/anxious/ND, then does it realllly matter and is it worth losing fertility and sexual function over?

This is why the TRAs have pushed for trans not to be medically defined, but metaphysically. For the TRAs aligning the inner gender essence with with the body is just making kids who they were meant to be. Any and all harms are justified in this noble pursuit. Going to be a fucker to capture in a trial protocol and to get it through ethics tho. Sunlight.

What parent in their right mind would offer up their healthy child in the name of research?

How many children will they need for a viable and significant study?

The attempt at morphing into another biological sex is terrifying, the experimental research is pure dystopia.

Does anyone else feel that this is a massive turning point. For the first time time I feel hopeful for gender questioning children and their families.

Be yourselves , don't conform to gender sterio types , talk to your family who love you , engage with professionals who have your best interests at heart not self appointed experts with an agenda

Interesting how stonewall are concerned there isn’t a research protocol set up to stop prescribing puberty blockers but didn’t seem concerned at all that there isn’t research protocol to start prescribing them in the first place

Oh yeah, informed consent. That will be another doozy. Consent in a trial setting is waaaayy more robust than in standard of care, as it is recognised there are more risks associated with unproven therapies. I would be interested to see if they have to look foe consent for both blockers and cross sex hormones, given one almost inevitably follows the other.

This.
It seems that once medics outside the activist captured GIDs got to look at all this, the lack of research, data and evidence was immediately clear. When you look at paediatric medicine it's evident that clinicians are tightly controlled and only allowed to prescribe experimental treatments to even very ill children with the strictest of controls.

That's why Cass was quite right to place the new clinics in children's hospitals where medical ethics are understood and adhered to.

Depressingly transactivist organisations like Global Butterflies are desperate to get into these hospitals and influence practice with children, selling their own version of silencing discussion and debate:

https://twitter.com/Transgendertrd/status/1695357134391648612

When a place the NHS makes these unequivocal statements it really does send a message. It's not activists doing it, it's not politicians courting votes. It's not an opinion.

And the likes of Stonewall, mermaids, Willoughby and the Fox Botherer chucking their toys out makes them look unpleasantly and unequivocally duplicitous.

Yelling that children and parents should ignore the NHS in favour of a discredited ideology that just about everyone is sick of?

They might as well hold ten foot banners above their heads, with the wrong side of history written on them in neon.

Oh also, there is the real sticking point of when is an appropriate timepoint to call the final results. I think it would have to be after the point when people start thinking about having babies, so a minimum of 10 years our from the start of interventional therapy. This is a long time to wait amd there will be huge attrition which will inevitably introduce bias into the results.

And who the fuck is going to fund, run, manage and recruit to these studies? They would be a total nightmare.

The quote at the end of the bbc piece struck me: ... others saying clearly they disagreed fundamentally and that these should be routinely available to everyone who believes they need it

is there any other case where people would demand the nhs prescribe drugs to anyone just because they 'believe they need them' ... let alone to children ?

There definitely seems to be attitude amongst transactactivists that cross sex hormones should be treated in the same vein as say eyebrow threading.

Fantastic news. Could the fact there's going to be a general election in under a year have anything.g to do with this?

Maybe that manifesto - was it Scottish Trans something? - saying that they should all be trained to operate on each other, and that they should be able to have whatever surgeries they wanted & that they should also be able to reverse said surgeries as often as they wanted wasn’t so much of an outlier after all.

This.

A non medical organisation representing a non medical community giving medical advice that sterilises young people and advocates against research and watchful waiting.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-68295284.amp the Welsh regulations.

Has been reported briefly on R2 news for the past few hours.

I wonder if Jeremy Vine will do a piece on this? He's been annoyingly v pro trans for the last few years.

"And who the fuck is going to fund, run, manage and recruit to these studies? They would be a total nightmare."

I think this a huge point of what has been going on behind closed doors over the last few months. Before a clinical trial can receive funding you have to be able to say clearly what medical condition the treatment is supposed to be treating, and theoretically how you hope this treatment might help. The ethical standards to approve a drug trial on children are incredibly high.

Metaphorically (and quite possibly literally) people have been going 'wouldn't touch it with a 10ft bargepole'

So pleased to hear this. Let's hope it's the start of better things. If this is the chance to kick those gaslighting fuckers into touch, I hope it can grabbed with both hands.

Breaking...

In response, a Scottish Government spokesperson said: “The Scottish Government and NHS Scotland are engaged with NHS England on its planned study into the use of puberty blockers in young people’s gender identity healthcare, and discussions are ongoing to determine what future engagement is appropriate.”
Scottish Government in talks with English health officials after decision to stop prescribing puberty blockers
https://www.scotsman.com/health/scottish-government-in-talks-with-english-health-officials-after-decision-to-stop-prescribing-puberty-blockers-4552992

Are the SNP and NHS Scotland going to back down? Or are they playing for time? Are the SNP thinking going into an election as the pro experiments on kids party maybe not has much appeal. Lots of Scottish doctors certainly won't want to be guilty of continuing with blockers after this.

Also pressure on Labour to either welcome or denounce NHS England's position. If Scottish Labour become anti puberty blockers that is a BIG advantage in the election.