"Human Milk" ffs

[SecondUsername4me]

Not linking to DM (clicks) but an article on the app today talks about how one NHS trust has said that hormone fuelled milk produced by transwomen is equally as good for baby as breastmilk produced by women.

The director says the terminology Human Milk should be used as both milk types are equal.

In the letter, the Medical Director claims 'there is clear and overwhelming evidence that human milk is the ideal food for infants', referring to both breast milk and the 'induced lactation' of biological men

Ffs these poor babies.

The £££££ that has been thrown in faking shit for men so they can cosplay womanhood while actual disease and illness is left to fundraise for its own research is sickening.

I found something else...

Do you guys remember that trans woman who posted a selfie "breastfeeding" a baby and it turned out he was a big guy in this climate thinktank? He was also featured on TV doing his laundry as a "mum" affected by the COL crisis. His name's Mika Minio Paluello.

Well there's a website with a LONG list of people "supporting" him to "breastfeed" his baby. Several MPs on there and other public figures. Worth a scan to see if your local MP is on there, if this would affect your voting decision.

https://www.welevelup.org/surveys/solidaritywithmika/

Nb the list is in no kind of order so you have to do a control-F to find your own MP if he/she is there.

https://www.fda.gov/drugs/information-drug-class/information-about-domperidone#:~:text=Domperidone%20has%20been%20associated%20with,domperidone%20use%20in%20lactating%20individuals.

For me, this is huge. I've no qualms about being a single issue voter. Things like VAT on schools, hunting bans, etc pale in importance, for me, compared to safeguarding babies.

sorry, we really need a "sarcasm" font.

My point being: there are zero to very scarce resources for women on this subject (maybe because it hurts some feelz, it may come into being and women who are having bf issues might benefit? it's a faint hope, but where there's hope, there's life)

I couldn't comment on who on that terrifyingly long list is abusive/ likes enabling abuse and who is simply thick. But a few names jumped out, including a children's author and a barrister.

From the TV clip it seems Paluello may think that doing the washing up and the laundry are also activities that women do.

It's like me being really upset that I can't fertilise an egg.

There are no drugs licenced for the purpose of stimulating lactation in women in the UK. Any use of drugs for this purpose is off label.
https://gpifn.org.uk/galactagogues/

(I do not like the image that is used in this, skin to skin between baby and mother stimulates the cocktail of cascade of interacting hormones from within the brain, something that no external hormones or male hormonal system can reproduce.)

Drug intervention is only used for a short tiime if the benefits outweigh the risks for mother and baby. In MOST cases, women are advised to supplement formula before any dugs solution is considered the best option.

Yep - all that would be harmlessly laughable if it weren't for the "breastfeeding".

That list was eye opening, especially in comparison with the Times comments. I usually scoff when people say MPs are out of touch with ordinary people, but my god. The MPs on that list are out of touch with ordinary people. From a variety of political parties too (but not all of the parties, go figure).

The only thing the man has is a feeling of "being left out" he has no need, no entitlement, no biological primal urge to do this.

This. The do gooders, rather than the deliberate enablers, are just not moving past the magical thinking that these men are "women" in every sense. It's nonsense.

I have a couple of mum-friends who couldn't breastfeed and had to switch to FF when their babies were still little.

Their grief about it was entirely in terms of fear that their LOs weren't getting the nutrition they needed. They feared that formula isn't quite as beneficial etc.

Not one of them grieved for the "euphoria" or the "experience". They were all just frantic that their baby wasn't getting the best start in life.

(Nb their babies are now older kids and are totally fine, this is not a formula bashing post.)

I'm just contrasting the motivations of mothers in trying to breastfeed. By mothers ofc I mean the actual female ones.

Yes - I can’t remember ever thinking about it as something that was for the mother, and if there were posts on MN that talked about it in that way, I can’t remember them. There are definitely posts about fathers/MILs feeling excluded by exclusive breast feeding, but there the push is towards mixed feeding, and the discussion is about the impact on the baby, not the mother.

(trigger warning - suggestion of cruelty to animals following)

Can’t help thinking that if male animals can produce milk as viably and safely as females, the dairy industry would be using this technology instead of slaughtering so many male calves.

I'm not willing to hide that for me, there were benefits to breastfeeding beyond the most important benefit (feeding my children). Abusive males and thick abuse enablers aren't going to change my reality.

But let's pretend for a second that the content of male nipple secretion is harmless (it isn't). A male pursuing the aim to make an infant suck a secretion from their nipples is actively taking from the breastfeeding relationship in ways which could significantly affect the success of feeding. Women are not machines, successful breastfeeding is a two way relationship which needs a supportive environment to flourish. It can be very difficult for some mothers, especially when support is hard to find.

A male who is focussing on something so purely about themselves and their own identity is at huge risk of not providing enough of the support the mother actually needs and not providing enough of the mundane routine endless care that newborns actually need and that forms the basis of the parent - child relationship.

Can’t help thinking that if male animals can produce milk as viably and safely as females, the dairy industry would be using this technology instead of slaughtering so many male calves.

Excellent point

I've heard so many women being made to feel terrible by medical professionals for feeding their children formula, yet now the same medical profession claims this artificial milk produced by men is just as good. How??

I'm not willing to hide that for me, there were benefits to breastfeeding beyond the most important benefit (feeding my children).

Oh absolutely - it helps safeguard against ppd, delays menstruation, helps with pp weight loss, protective factor against breast cancer and some other female-reproductive-system cancers.

Lots of benefits to bf for the mum, I'm a huge fan of bf. None of those benefits are relevant to men at all.

Just wanted to add - although there are these benefits to the mum, I still have never met a FF mum who regretted not having those benefits. For them, the regrets/grief/needless guilt they had were exclusively about the benefits to the baby.

I've never ever met a mum who said "I can't breastfeed and I'm sad about that because of the protective factor against breast cancer". It was always more like "I'm worried my baby isn't getting the breastmilk antibodies"

Thanks for that link @Mumoftwo1312. I've just scrolled through all the names, and the political parties, organisations and professions represented.

Admittedly a few are - I am going to assume - fake but dear Lord, the human race is fucked. At this rate, I'm going to end my days living up a mountain. I don't even like mountains.

I have formula fed a baby and breastfed a baby. I agree that I do get joy from breastfeeding and although it is primarily for baby it is also for me and I'll miss it when we stop. Having said that, my motivation for starting breastfeeding was purely for baby. My first was formula fed (attempted but failed breastfeeding) and I wasn't ever sad for me missing out on it, I felt bad because I felt like I wasn't giving her the best but also really loved the convenience of others being able to feed her.
Just wanted to put a spin on the doing it for you, maybe it is partly for you but perhaps not when initially deciding to attempt it? Do we really think these men are approaching this the same way?

It’s in plain sight - normalising males putting part of their bodies in children’s mouths to suck on for the adult male’s pleasure and validation.

I agree some of them may be fake but I don't think the MPs are. Eg Clive Lewis MP has publicly defended the stance on this.

precisely zero of those benefits are about reinforcing your "euphoria" about being a woman, though

absolutely. I don't know any mother for who breastfeeding wasn't about trying to make the right decision for their child. I know plenty who struggled and felt intense guilt from organisations who made them feel inadequate.

(trigger warning)
Crown Prosecution's Website. Sexual Offences Act 2003 – offences against children. From Chapter 7, Section 8: Causing or inciting a child under 13 to engage in sexual activity.

'A child under 13 does not, under any circumstances, have the legal capacity to consent to any form of sexual activity.'

'These are offences of strict liability as to age. The prosecution has to prove only two facts.
First, the intentional sexual activity and
Second, the age of the complainant at the date of the sexual activity, using, for example, a certified copy of a birth certificate together with evidence of identity.'