Another GC Employment Tribunal: Roz Adams vs Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre #5

[nauticant]

Roz Adams was employed by Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre (ERCC) as a counsellor. She is claiming constructive dismissal for Gender Critical (GC) beliefs. The CEO of ERCC is a well known transwoman known for, among other things, controversial "reframe your trauma" remarks.

There's live tweeting from https://twitter.com/tribunaltweets or if Twitter doesn't show the tweets, look at https://nitter.net/tribunaltweets. There's an informative substack here: https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/adams-vs-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre

This post explains how to get access to watch the hearing: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4988632-another-gc-employment-tribunal-roz-adams-vs-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre-2?page=24&reply=132419912

Abbreviations:
J: Employment Judge McFatridge
RA: Roz Adams, the claimant
NC: Naomi Cunningham, barrister for the claimant
ERCC or R: Edinburgh Rape Crisis Centre, the respondent
DH: David Hay KC, barrister for the respondent
KM: Katy McTernan, ERCC Senior management
MR: Mairi Rosko, ERCC Board Member
MS: Miren Sagues, ERCC Board Member
KH: Katie Horburgh, ERCC Board Member
AB: ERCC staff member (name redacted)
NCi: Nico Ciubotariu, COO of ERCC
MW: Mridul Wadhwa, CEO of ERCC
BP: Beira's Place

RA gave evidence over 15-18 January 2024.

Witnesses:
Nicole Jones (NJ): 18 January 2024 (on behalf of RA)
Mairi Rosko (MR): 19 January 2024 (on behalf of ERCC)
Katy McTernan (referred to both as KT and KM): 22-23 January 2024 (on behalf of ERCC)
Miren Sagues (MS): 24 January 2024 (on behalf of ERCC)
Katie Horburgh (KH): 24 January 2024 (on behalf of ERCC)

Thread #1: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4985570-another-gc-employment-tribunal-adams-vs-edinburgh-rape-crsis
Thread #2: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4988632-another-gc-employment-tribunal-roz-adams-vs-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre-2
Thread #3: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4990903-another-gc-employment-tribunal-roz-adams-vs-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre-3
Thread #4: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4991883-another-gc-employment-tribunal-roz-adams-vs-edinburgh-rape-crisis-centre-4

Waffle waffle waffle. Will never hear every expression of sex realist views so could not possibly comment.

NC asks for an expression of GC views that isn't transphobic. You understand what those views are?

Yeah, roughly.

NC gives another precis. Is that transphobic?

KH: To make a judgement based on two/three sentences lacks nuance.

KH we'd look at passport or appropriate id, and would expect it to say female.

Not everyone has a passport, I wonder what else they would've accepted given their contortions not to offend?

NC do you know what gc beliefs are

KH yes roughly. I've seen bits and pieces in the news. [!]

NC summarises the gc views. Transphobic?

KH yes, way in which views expressed are often at expense of trans people existence

NC if I said those things would you think me transphobic

KH making a judgement on those few comments as political view lacks nuance

Anyone else getting very strong Deptford Project takeover vibes from this witness?

Yes @Waitwhat23

Yes

(Sorry @Mmmnotsure you're doing a much better job, just can't help myself!)

Witness: I'm not in nicos head

NICO'S NOT HERE.

Thanks all for new thread

Update re me and my alleged socks. MNHQ just messaged me to say it was all a mix up. I'm sock free.

Barefoot and fancy free, Lark. 😊

It's always a nuisance to mix up socks.

😃 Well that's one suspect off the list.

Phew!

Not a typo by an intern?

.

😂

or perhaps a nuance

This witness is just like the last two witnesses.

But younger

Not a typo by an intern?

@nauticant thanks for the new thread!

NC Nico c RA saying referring to gc people as terfs is not helpful, it's abusive. And that is put in as bit of evidence agst RA

KH Not in nico's head. Can't answer to her logic in writing the report. I read that as part of the conflicting views that I decided not to focus on and focused on the email. I think training should be safe and protective space, so this sentence didn't factor into my decision.

NC I've taken you to passages that show animus agst anyone with gc beliefs.

KH The wording could have been better, in being about breach of policy rather than views. So i focused on policy rather than views.

NC Over and over in the report you see transphobic views, underlying transphobia. That is what nico is interested in.

KH to do with if a breach of trans incl policy.

ah... our good friend Lacks Nuance makes an appearance

Witness doing a waffle version of "I was doing my job properly it's not my fault"

This one aware of mayas case at least