Women's rights general conversations - Thread 7

[Kucinghitam]

Continuation of Thread 6.

There is so much excellent information and so many active discussions on FWR that I wondered if it would be useful to have a thread to sort of "cross-fertilise" between them - airing little thoughts or vignettes that wouldn't themselves merit their own thread, to highlight other posts/threads of particular interest or to point to notable developments on fast-moving threads so that casual observers know where to look.

(For example, "the X thread has meandered onto a fascinating discussion of Y" or "Poster P's amazing analysis on thread Z might have relevance to the scenario in thread W" or "Has anybody noticed this recurring theme that keeps coming up??" or even "Random bloke asked me to smile while I was choosing onions in the supermarket, grr"- that sort of thing).

Having read up on the original painting, and noticing the church in the background is an addition, I think I've worked it out.

I haven't, cake. Who is it?

I think it's the CoE, possibly whatsisface who's in charge at the moment. Not God, the other guy! Likely because of the money the church is reportedly putting aside for reparations, following on the heels of genderwoo.

This makes me angry - whether you agree about the rightness of reparations or not, slavery and colonisation were real things that actually happened and impacted the lives of black and brown people all over the world negatively. Homophobia (which ironically, the Church seems all for) is a real thing which causes death and misery on men and women. The "oppression" of people who claim a special identity is fictional. Nowhere in the world now, or ever (as far as we know) has there been institutional persecution or oppression of such people. I accept that there is a minority of people with identities who genuinely suffer from dysphoria, but that is not oppression. It is not pain inflicted by outside forces. Even if we agree that gender stereotypes are oppressive, they oppress all people - those of us who claim special identities are not singled out and paradoxically they often subscribe to gender enthusiastically.

So it angers me to see it all lumped together as silliness.

*slavery and colonisation were real things that actually happened and impacted the lives of black and brown people all over the world negatively and enriched Britain

I actually don't completely disagree re. reparations. Who to take money from and who to give it to, I haven't the foggiest.

That's my issue with the idea, too, ICake.

Apologies, I wasn't clear - my anger was directed at the cartoon, not anyone posting here.

I wonder if women will ever be compensated for centuries of men appropriating our bodies and our labour, raping, assaulting and murdering us as well as stealing our children?

Indeed! According to the Mormons' brilliant genealogy website, I am an extremely distant cousin of both QE2 and Dead Lady Di, one on my father's side and the other on my mother's. I forget which way round it was. No, obviously I didn't trace that myself - the Mormons have it automated. It made me laugh, as it went back so many generations that if I am, then so is pretty much anyone. But one set of "grandparents" are in fact great-grandparents, who raised four illegitimate children (from two of their daughters) as their own, in a dockland town in the 1920s.

So on the one hand I should presumably be paying reparations, but on the other - given my dad's build (which I have inherited) and colouring (ditto, though I didn't get the tanning gene) I should probably be claiming them, as I suspect slave labour from Yemen/North Africa in 1920s Wales may have played a part.

I think the idea is to use the churches untold riches to invest in black businesses, societal stuff and things like that. There's no way that reparations can ever do enough but, hopefully, by focusing on the now and the damage that the then did to the lives of those who live now by giving them the sort of leg up that the likes of, I don't know, Eton fucking wankers, get as their birth right, there's a chance of ever so slightly evening the balance. I mean, the balance won't be evened but there will be some good to come from it.

Of course that means the CoE needs to get its finger out sooner rather than later and to continue the process for decades and decades. They're currently still not quite at the getting started stage because they're wankers.

I think you're right in principle, and that acknowledgement is the most important thing to me. I'm not going into the whole question of how and who because it's technically a derail of the thread.

I fear part of me finds this quite amusing - the impact of the law of unintended consequences:

reduxx.info/spain-concerns-about-trans-fraud-emerge-after-dozens-of-male-civil-servants-in-one-small-community-change-their-legal-gender-but-maintain-male-names/

But I'm not one of their female colleagues who's had to put up with all sorts of sh*t. I also suspect that rather than doing away with self-ID, Spain will do away with special treatment for women.

The paragraphs at the end, the links still work

As previously reported by Reduxx, a man in Catalonia who physically abused his partner was able to avoid charges of gender-based violence after changing his legal documents. After police learned he was a legal “woman,” they were unable to charge him with the sex-specific crime or institute special protections for his female partner.

A similar case occurred in Ceuta, where a police officer changed his legal gender to avoid similar charges after beating his wife — but the man was sentenced to prison before his plan could come to fruition.

There have also been a number of incidents involving male inmates declaring transgender identities to either be moved into women’s prisons or seek reductions in their sentences following heinous crimes.

Jesus!

'The latest data has resulted in some trans activists expressing concerns about “trans fraud,” despite these same concerns being dismissed when expressed by women’s rights advocates before the law was passed.'

Well who could possibly have forseen that?

Sadly, only stupid women with stupid lady voices that nobody could take seriously.

Too high pitched, that's the problem. Like bats. You're aware of a faint squeaking noise, but who knows what it could possibly mean?

Exactly. It's just irritating.

Gonners · Yesterday 18:36

Indeed! According to the Mormons' brilliant genealogy website, I am an extremely distant cousin of both QE2 and Dead Lady Di, one on my father's side and the other on my mother's. I forget which way round it was. No, obviously I didn't trace that myself - the Mormons have it automated.

Well, that's interesting. How does it work? My Gran's original birth certificate was destroyed in Belgium, during the war. She must have had a copy, as she had passports, but none of us actually know where in Ireland she was born.

I saw this in the Mail and thought that I'd link it here. Obviously, we all know them and their travails, but it's positive that their stories are collated and brought to a wider audience.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-13165611/rosie-duffield-refuse-silenced-women-uniting-campaigners.html

I don't know if they "do" Ireland. I've just looked up a school friend from Northern Ireland and neither her birth nor her marriage records are visible. On the other hand, Seamus Heaney is there. Maybe there's some privacy rule until you're dead? If you want to have a poke around, the site is called familysearch - dot - org (I'm not giving them a link!)

Thanks!

My ability to search MN, never very good, has totally gone down the toilet. I wanted to post this on the Elite Sports People Speaking Out thread but I can't find it

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/shabnim-ismail-bowls-fastest-recorded-delivery-in-womens-cricket-hltvzw0vv

First off, wow! Secondly, has a mention of male equivalent although, understandably, that's not the focus of the article.

Re the family search, do you have to sign up for lots of information and if so, which I've started doing because I do think I've had to but chemo brain can't remember what I read five minutes ago, how do you get a church record number. Sorry to derail, I'll say no more about it after this. Except thank you for any help!

I heard about that bowl on the World Service and yes, wow! Thanks for the link, it's nice to put an image to the achievement.

Family Search is quite good as a repository of records, but you can't rely on their trees. The latter are compiled by anyone who fancies it, and like all family history sites most people are less than rigorous in their fact checking. If a name looks roughly right they'll bung it in.