Prof Jo Phoenix vs The OU - Employment Tribunal Thread 2

[ickky]

Abbreviations

JP - Jo Phoenix, Claimant (C)
OU - The Open University, Respondent (R)
J - Regional Employment Judge Young
P - Panel or panel member
BC - Ben Cooper KC, Counsel for C
JM - Jane Mulcahy KC, Counsel for R

OU Departments & Networks:

HWSRA - Health & Wellbeing Strategic Research Area
FASS - Faculty of Arts and Social Sciences
SPC - Dept of Social Policy & Criminology
KMi - Knowledge Media Institute
GCRN - Gender Critical Research Network

OU witnesses

CW - Chris Williams, Senior Lecturer History
CT - Catherine Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SE - Sarah Earle, Prof of Medical Sociology, Director HWSRA 2016-22
DD - Dr Deborah Drake, Senior Lecturer Criminology, Head of SPC 2018-21
LW - Louise Westmarland, Prof of Criminology, Co-Deputy Head SPC, 2018-21, Current Head SPC
LD - Dr Leigh Downes, Senior Lecturer in Criminology (in SPC), Academic Lead for EDI FASS 2019-21
PB - Dr Paraskevi Boukli, Former Senior Lecturer Criminology, Deputy Head SPC 2021-22
MW - Prof Marcia Wilson, Dean EDI, 2020-23
CM - Caragh Molloy, Group People Director 2019-23
JD - John Domingue, Prof of Computing Science, Director KMi, 2015-22
PK - Peter Keogh, Professor Health & Society, Member RSSH
CW - Dr Christopher Williams, Senior Lecturer History
SD - Shaun Daley, Head OU’s Resourcing Hub. Head Strategic Resources, Co-Chair OU’s LGBT+ Staff Network
HBC - Helen Bowes-Catton, Lecturer Social Research Methods
NS - Nicola Snarey, Assoc Lecturer Eng Language
NatS - Natalie Starkey, Outreach & Public Engagement Officer Sch Physical Sciences, 2019-22
CT - Cath Tomlinson, Senior Student Advisor
SJ - Samantha Jacobson, Employee Relations Case Manager
RH - Richard Holliman, Prof Engaged Research, Head School Environment, Earth & Ecosystem Sciences, 2019-22. Member of Investigation Panel investigating the C’s grievance

Witness for JP:

SE - Sarah Earle, Professor Modern History Uni of Oxford, Founding member GCRN

Tribunal Tweets - https://twitter.com/tribunaltweets

TT coverage so far https://tribunaltweets.substack.com/p/professor-jo-phoenix-v-the-open-university

Thread 1
https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4905118-jo-phoenix-vs-the-ou-employment-tribunal-2nd-october-whispers-ben-cooper?page=1

What a disappointment all these VIPs are turning out to be.

Now I have to pick up children, although thinking about it I am doing a VERY IMPORTANT JOB here of listening to open justice and a court case I've contributed to with critical ramifications for women's rights. Maybe I should just not pick up the kids, which is difficult and at least one of them will have a whine about something because they always do, and I'll have to actually parent. Why can't I just only do the interesting bits? (Obviously am not going to shirk my responsibilities because I am not IF..... will be popping onto this thread to keep up.... )

Yes it is consistent with his earlier evidence that it’s only a few people on either fringe of the debate, everyone in the middle doesn’t really care. So he has a few noisy people to deal with and takes the path that he thinks will make it all quieten down as soon as possible. To quote BC from an earlier case, how did that work out for you IF?

I keep hoping that in one of these court cases, these organisations will actually be able to come up with a good justifiable reason why they behaved like they did but all it seems to come down to everytime is that the TRA side were shouty & threatened us with all sorts so we sided with them for a quiet life and hoped it would go away

Did it not occur to IF that Essex cancelling one of his professors meant that it was a bit of a big deal and not a few noisy people/localised staff spat? I thought BC had confirmed that cancellation was a big deal, what with academic freedom and all.

TT commentary

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1711725031556878602.html

I attended in person this morning, it was very intense and was hard to hear judge and sometimes witness at times.

There is a large TV screen at right angle to judge/panel and legal reps. Couldn't see any video feed all seemed to be off but some names visible (one looked like Emma).

I don't think that lots of there OU witnesses were present to watch today, seemed to be several people who then sat in claimant waiting room.

BC - re your toned down email
Prof - that is your words
BC - no it is yours
Prof - no it isn't
BC - yes it is - see here
Prof - oh yes

😂

juice and biccies have not worked

Ooh.
'Toned down '
IF- Not my words
BC- yes they are.
IF- no they're not
BC- yes they are. (Quotes from IF's email.)
IF- (grudgingly) ok

This is an absolute masterclass in barristering. BC has manoeuvered IF into saying - with honesty - what a big, important person IF was, and what a big important job he had, and that he chose not to do it.

gosh that was an almighty sigh

Another massive sigh from IF

This has started off on a bit of a combative note. Some yes it is no it isn’t back and forth until BC points to another piece of evidence and IF reluctantly concedes that BC is right.

Did it not occur to IF that Essex cancelling one of his professors meant that it was a bit of a big deal

Yes I would have thought an inter-university matter would need more careful handling?

IF nearly dead now, resignedly saying yes, yep, yep to BC's questions.

BC: You gave your rewritten draft for the newsletter to the EDI Dean and the LGBT chairs for comments. This is unusual, this level of referral.

IF: Yes. Expending this amount of energy on a topic is totally out of line with any others.

No they haven't, I think a shot of adrenaline would be more appropriate now.

Got it in one!

I think Ben's about to put him out of his misery

It’s sounds like any effort at all is outside of the norm for IF.

Watching BC is like watching a concert pianist or a conductor at the height of his powers. It's glorious, and beautiful to watch.

We really are at the panto 👍

It really is, I would hate to be his partner having a row, you would never win.