Worrying Increase in Transphobia

[PorcelinaV]

https://www.thepinknews.com/2023/09/09/transphobia-uk-press-media-negative-coverage/

An increase in transphobic sentiment among the British public has been fuelled by hostile coverage of trans people from the right-wing press, argues data journalist Ell Folan....

Unfortunately, newspapers still have a great deal of influence on the public and political agenda in Britain, and nowhere is this more obvious than in how perceptions of trans rights have changed.

As recently as Feburary 2021, an absolute majority of British voters (51 per cent) agreed with the statement “a transgender woman is a woman”, including 6 in 10 women. Just 34 per cent disagreed. But after years of negative coverage from the press, those numbers have changed.

In April this year, only 33 per cent of voters agreed that trans women are women, with 47 per cent disagreeing....

It is clear that the media plays an important role in shaping public perceptions, and unless their negative coverage is corrected and refuted, public opinion will continue to worsen.

Yes. It was very interesting reading. And downplayed when it came out.

But trans women are not women, they are trans women, not the same. Plastic surgery and hormones doesn't change your chromosomes.

I back peoples rights to dress as they feel comfortable, wear make up, adopt the opposite sex's style of hair and if they do desire have surgery but i will still defend the right for biological women to be protected as a characteristic in sports, safe spaces and things such as medical procedures. You can't be made a woman, you can only be born one with XX chromosomes.

I know transgender people, have one in the family yet i still don't agree that they can ever change sex only gender which isn't the same

what do we do with the women who can no longer use the women's space if either of these male people insist on being in there in pursuit of their own agenda and happiness?

I‘ve never seen a response to this question - on this thread or anywhere else.

Not only that but it positions women, the actual cunty type, as having "privilege" over men who demand that we call them women and are therefore their "oppressor" in the CSJ/genderism hierarchy - so for e.g Malala Yousafzai has "cis privilege" over Caitlyn Jenner.

"Cis" is bs genderist arsewash of the most ridiculous kind.

Indeed. And inevitably -

'The SPS said it has no plans to make use of the research.'

www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/scottish-news/anger-trans-inmates-revert-males-25840252

"Cis" is bs genderist arsewash of the most ridiculous kind.

And as we all know, the genderist arsewash is a packed and closely fought category. The herds of rape victims in Brighton handbagging innocent TW if they're permitted in Quaker buildings I hear is a contender for third place.

Fwiw, it's not even about predators for me.

I don't want to undress around dicks whether they are male dicks or lady dicks. They are still dicks. I find it uncomfortable and it affects my dignity. I feel really self conscious enough around women. It makes me avoidant of that situation. I would self exclude. I find it unpleasant and yes, intimidating. Even if someone is a gentle soul.

Its even worse if it's some one I might know.

My friends son has declared themselves a woman in recent weeks. I've known him since he was nine. Would I like to find myself next to him in the shower at the swimming pool? Or the next hospital bed? Or in the shared changing room at the shopping centre? Hell no. He's a really nice guy. But no he's still a bloke and I actually find it offensive and deeming that he thinks he should share facilities with any women because he is like me. He's just not. And the fact he doesn't see that boundary and doesn't get why that might upset me or other women says a lot about his character that I wasn't aware of. He thinks his feelings are more important than mine. It makes me feel totally deemed and that he sees women as lesser and not worthy of their own boundaries.

Ditto my brother. Who I also don't think would attack anyone. But I do think it's an act of passive aggressive display to lay claim to and use the womens facilities.

This to me IS a deliberate act of intimidation. It is asking for my silence in the name of 'being kind'.

But is it kind to me or other women to put them in this position where they feel that uncomfortable they might self exclude? No it's not. And the truth is these men KNOW it's likely to upset - and do it regardless. The sheer arrogance of that is astonishing.

Women are supposed to capitulate the whims and wants of males ahead of their own at so many junctions in life. And are made to feel guilty or shamed or worse for objecting to it.

If they want to dress or act in a certain way, I have to deal with it as that's their choice. The problem comes when it's imposed without consent on others.

And that's what is happening. There isn't a respect for the autonomy and dignity of women's bodies. In any other situation we'd be up in arms about it. But call it trans and women are villified for saying they find it triggering or they have not consented to being seen naked by a male. That's really not ok.

No one wants to erase the existence of anyone but the fundamental lack of understanding this in these terms is appalling.

It doesn't have to involve a criminal act or a perv.

It simply is a fundamental removal of women's agency and control over their body and who has access to it - even if that is 'merely visually'. It absolutely matters to so many women.

It will lead to self exclusion in sporting facilities and healthcare settings particularly. That has major ramifications.

I should add I'm currently trying to get into a certain sport. I am already well out of my comfort zone with it. Me and my friend went for the first time last night. We've been on a one off woman's only course last year - without that I wouldn't be even trying to access the sport. The session last night was just older gentlemen (and they are gentlemen). But the way they have been socialised is difficult to deal with and if that had been my first session I wouldn't return. They were nice enough but it's intimidating all the same. They don't get issues with confidence and much smaller physicality. And when they do recognise it, it can be patronising. The women's only session was completely different because there was that understanding.

And this is what TRAs are seeking to destroy in the name of inclusivity.

It's really important to expand understanding of why women don't access sport. And instead there's this massive push in exactly the opposite direction.

Women who agree twaw must believe in gender as a soul different from sex. I cannot accept this as it is so offensively sexist, like the term cis
Exactly like calling an atheist an infidel, to be cis you need to believe gender is innate not a social construct based on how to oppress women because of their reproductive ability.

No one is born 'in the middle'. No human has ever been born who wasn't either male or female. A very very small number of humans have been born with DSDs, but every one is either of the sex class which produces large gametes, or the sex class which produces small gametes, even if that individual can't produce either. It's offensive towards people with DSDs to suggest that they are not male or female, that they are some kind of in-between or other.

Sorry if I'm being a bit blunt, I hate how TRAs have co-opted 'intersex' as an identity, I'm sure you didn't mean to do that.

No, the Scottish Government during the GRR consultation was specifically asked this question in light of all the women who were at risk of self excluding - specifically rape survivors, dv survivors, some religious women, older women, etc.

They ignored it.

Well what do you call it when they have sex change surgery?

Exactly @RedToothBrush . The very fact that tw with penises think it is ok for them to use our spaces shows why they should not. It shows that they are not vulnerable and not a woman and have male socialisation patterns.

But they don't change sex do they. It is plastic surgery to facsimile the other sex. Tw will never give birth, tm will never ejaculate. Calling it sex change surgery is wrong really. Inverting a penis or using intestine to make a neovagina is an interesting turn of capitalism,individualism and science but it still can't make someone change sex.

Humans are a dimorphic species and no human can or has ever changed sex. What is referred to as 'sex change surgery' is extreme cosmetic surgery in order to imitate the secondary sexual characteristics of the opposite sex.

Aye, well we all know that rape victims tend to be bigoted and exclusionary and in need of re-education. There's always the risk they'll weaponise their trauma, the horrible oppressors, or exercise their cis privilege.

And those poor marginalised, vulnerable males who just want the company of women around them while they use the toilet or get changed just can't catch a break.

I sometimes find myself reflecting that, if I were developing, programming and training a chatbot app, I might regard a very active chat forum with 8 million members as the perfect training ground.

How could having surgery change your sex?

Well, if it is a male person, I call it a male person who has had extreme body modification surgery. Still a male person though.

If it is a female person, I call it a female person who has had brutal body modification surgery. Still a female person though.

If you have a penis created, would you still call that person a woman? Or would you at least describe them as a transman? A lot of discussions on here talk about the dangers of having a penis, so surely you wouldn’t still call this person a woman?

I’m quite surprised considering all the talk of not wanting a penis in a woman’s bathroom, but fair enough.

Is the way round doing that (ie avoiding @), to quote the post instead?

That’s mainly what I’ve been doing but with no clue as to whether that breaches etiquette.

@Helleofabore I also personally find it a bit offensive. You know full well that people who believe they are in the wrong bodies are suicidal. At least explain them as trans people, not as those who have basically destroyed their bodies. Very different to discussing certain rights and privileges.

I sometimes find myself reflecting that, if I were developing, programming and training a chatbot app, I might regard a very active chat forum with 8 million members as the perfect training ground.

meh. I am not unadjacent to that kind of work, and ours would most definitely give an answer to a question - it may be gobbledegook but it would actually try.

It 8s not a penis. You have to pump it up to use it. That's like saying are you still a women with a hysterectomy or with a hernia or 6th finger. Ridiculous argument and I don't think you can believe this tbh.