Transcript for Neil Mitchell 3AW interview with John Pesutto: - 20th March 2023:
www.3aw.com.au/liberals-move-to-expel-controversial-mp-over-neo-nazi-rally-links/
John Pesutto: states at 0.38 and it goes from there.
‘she has had associations, Neil, with organisations, er, organisers of Saturday’s protest who have known links with nazis, nazi sympathisers, far right extremists, white supremacists. And can I just make a couple of things…’
Neil Mitchell: ‘Just before you do, just before you do.., who are you referring to there?’
Pesutto:: ‘Kellie Jay Keen’.
Mitchell: ‘And she has had associations with, she has got associations with Nazis? Who?”
Pesutto:: Well, ok, so, um, John Francois Gariepy. She has done videos+ with Richard Spencer, Mark Collick, Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke. There is a long ….’
Mitchell: “Were they videos or interviews?”
Pesutto:: ‘Videos, interviews. She shared platforms with this person … can I offer you a different perspective of this person Neil. This person is not someone who comes to this with a clean skin. She has known associations with, uh, I really just want to be able to set a few things straight Neil.
Mitchell: She does say she will be interviewed, she is willing to be interviewed by anybody.
PESUTTO:: Ah… no…. that that that is not right. Ah.
Mitchell: Ok.
PESUTTO:: Her history of activism actually has taken her into league with people with views that I cannot accept as consistent with Victorian values. Can I just say a couple of things at the top Neil.
MITCHELL: yep
PESUTTO:: First of all, this is not about free speech. I am perfectly comfortable with people debating issues they feel passionately about. Even Moira. Absolutely, people can have that. I have always said debate must be reasonable, respectful, inclusive. You can do that even in a robust setting. The problem here is that Moira just didn’t turn up to this rally. She had helped organise and promote it with people who have known associations. It is not about free speech. It is about people whose values are not consistent with mine. Not consistent with the Liberal Party or Victoria’s values.
MITCHELL: Well, did you tell Moira not to go?
PESUTTO:: Ah. No! But I don’t expect any member of the liberal team to be associating with people who have long rap sheets.
MITCHELL: But why didn’t you tell her not to go. Why didn’t you say, this is wrong, don’t do it.
Pesutto: Well Neil, I don’t have a problem with people airing their views. And the neo nazis who turned up to the rally made it clear that they were there to support this as we later found out.* And we later found out that one of the organisers, Angie Jones, who did a video with Moira and two other people, including Kellie Jay Keen later on, on Saturday actually posted this Neil. And I quote the tweet: ‘Nazi and women want to get rid of paedo filfth. Why don’t you?’
MITCHELL: Oh that is garbage, that is garbage.
PESUTTO:: Is that acceptable in 2023?
MITCHELL: No, of course not.
PESUTTO:: Is that acceptable.
Mitchell: Of course not.
Pesutto: And that is what it is about.
Mitchell: But I get back to the point. Why didn’t you avoid all this and just tell her not to be part of it?
Pesutto: Well Neil, I have that expectation of all members, but
Mitchell: Did you know she was promoting, she even raised it in parliament last week?
Pesutto: I, yeah. I am aware of these values that she’s had. And then I said..
Mitchell: Yeah, but were you aware that she was promoting this rally in the parliament and on twitter, and intending to go? Were you aware of it.
Pesutto:. I was aware that she was active in this space.
Mitchell: Were you aware that she was going to this rally and promoting this rally.
Pesutto: Well, I wasn’t aware that she was going to go to a rally that nazi activists would turn up at which
Mitchell: But that is not her fault.
Pesutto: Well, well she is associated with … and as you say, when the neo-nazis turned up, did she leave?
Mitchell: Well actually you could ask Matthew (guy??) the same thing about the dinners he has been to. But it is a fair point. She should have left. Did she?
PESUTTO:: I just want to emphasis that .. sorry, I don’t understand her to have left.
Mitchell : She didn’t. OK Ok. I won’t leave this point about … she five or six days ago was telling the world that she was going, she was promoting the rally, why didn’t you sit her down and say ‘this is wrong. Don’t do it or else?’ Did you know? Did you know she was promoting it and raised it in parliament.
PESUTTO:: Neil, I know she is passionate about this..
MITCHELL: no. But did you know she raised it in parliament?
PESUTTO:: I didn’t know she had raised the rally in parliament. No.
MITCHELL: Were you aware that she was tweeting, urging people to go?
PESUTTO:: No. I didn’t see her tweets.
MITCHELL: Well, you could have avoided it all if you knew that.
PESUTTO:: Well, but never the less Neil, we are left with a situation that we you have a member of the liberal team associating with people with these associations. Know public associations with these, and I just can’t, can’t understand. I am a party, a leader of the party who wants to govern for all Victorians. And the values that I’m espousing, as Liberal leader, are not consistent with those Nazi activists. I know Moira is not a Nazi, but my point is that she is associating with people who are. +++
And that brings them into a place that is unacceptable for me as leader. And I believe unacceptable for the party.
MITCHELL: Well a member of the Greens who is Jewish went ahead and didn’t have any problems.
PESUTTO:: Well that is a matter for them. I think in terms of the overall issues of what nazis mean, and what white supremacism means it is odious. And I am not prepared as leader of the party, to abide by any of it.
MITCHELL: Alright.
PESUTTO:: We want to govern in four years.
Mitchell: So, you are saying Kellie Jay Keen is a sympathiser of Nazis, correct?
PESUTTO:: Yes.
MITCHELL: And others are there as well?
PESUTTO:: Well certainly her, Angie Jones who Moira posted on social media about after the rally on Friday. Posted what I said before, I won’t repeat it. So it is not as if any of this is in doubt. It is on the public record. They are not Moira’s posts, granted. But we have got a Liberal member having done that. And I just don’t think that its acceptable.
MITCHELL: Did, did she object to what you told her?
PESUTTO:: I won’t go into the details of the discussion. You can imagine how someone would react to the news that I’m going to bring this application. But I believe it is the right thing to do, Neil. Right, we have a government in Victoria which is corrupt, incompetent and clearly exhausted. I want to be able to present an alternative. And as alternative Premier I want to make it clear to Victorians that my values, that the values of the party that I lead, are not consistent with Kellie Jay Keen. Never will be. Not consistent with Thomas Sewell or the Nazis who turned up on the steps of Parliament. Never will be. I will fight hate speech like that whereever I see it. And the party wants to govern in 2026 and beyond because our state needs it.
MITCHELL: ok. Did you …
PESUTTO:: This is not going to help us get to that goal.
MITCHELL: Did you, do you accept that the organisers of this rally and Moira Deeming had no idea that the Nazis were turning up?
PESUTTO:: I am not in the position to say that I can accept that. Because I, and the reason I say that is, I am not saying that Moira necessarily knew. Is that these people have known association with Nazi sympathisers and white supremacists, given their history. And Thomas Sewell, posted on social media that they were there to support that rally. So my point is, I am not saying Moira necessarily knew that, but I find it hard to believe that the other organisers didn’t.
MITCHELL: Ok um. It says something about your pre-selection processes, doesn’t it, that Moira Deeming got pre-selection.
PESUTTO:: Look Neil, as talented as I think I am, I cannot change the past. I can only assure all of our listeners of a couple of things. I do support free speech, but I believe this, this position that I am taking is consistent with that.
MITCHELL: OK.
PESUTTO:: I can’t support, and never will, hate speech. As for pre-selection processes, I am committed to making sure the party has better processes in place going forward. But again, free speech is an important part of what the Liberal party advocate. But hate speech is not, and never will be.
MITCHELL: Under your leadership, would you hope to avoid the ah pre-selection of the Moira Deeming?
PESUTTO:: Well again, I just want to indicate people are entitled to have a broad range of views across any political organisation. That is going to happen. I don’t have any objection to that at all. I have an objection, and will act, where anybody’s activities take them to an association with either right wing extremists or left wing extremists. Either way, it is not what Victoria is about and it is not the Victoria I want to lead.
MITCHELL: Do you want to her out of the party?
PESUTTO:: I think it is consistent with the position that I am taking. The party will need to consider what it does if the motion gets up. I expect it will, but the party and the members will need to make a decision about that. And I really need to be careful of the processes, they are for the party to decide. I think they will see, they’ll see obvious conclusions if the motion succeeds.
MITCHELL: When’s the parliamentary party meeting?
PESUTTO:: I have to give a period of notice. I would expect that that will be very early next week.
MITCHELL: It will look a bit silly if you don’t win it, won’t it?
PESUTTO:: Well, I can only do what is right Neil. I think this is the right thing to do.
The interview moves onto nazi salute banning.
Then comes back
MITCHELL: By the way, Angie Jones who we have spoken to, she says that tweet you refer to is taken right out of context and she had a history with the person tweeting it.
PESUTTO:: mmm… do .. Do you buy that?
MITCHELL: I don’t know. I’ll speak to her.
PESUTTO:: Well you know, please do. But it .. I can’t interpret it any other way.
Note that is KJK he is saying has done these videos!
+this is also false
+++ do you see it yet?