virgin active changing room policy

[roarrfeckingroar]

Does anyone know Virgin Active's policy for changing rooms? There was a "woman" displaying male genitals while changing in the women's this morning. Women's, not family. I'll be honest, I didn't feel comfortable getting undressed. Before I'm accused of staring, it was hard to miss as the person was right where you come out of the showers.

VA aren't going to care are they?

A man who has had his penis removed is as much of a male as one who hasn't. And women and girls have a right to be in a changing room without the presence of a male. Penis attached or not.

I would've walked straight out to reception and loudly stated that their was a man exposing his penis in the women's changing room. Because that is what was happening.

Then watch as they imploded trying to claim that he was somehow a woman.

Their changing rooms should either be mixed sex or single sex, but they should not use 'women's' to describe a room that is actually mixed sex just so some men can get validation of their 'gender' feelings.

Men who deliberately expose themselves to women and children ARE sexual predators. Their 'gender identity' is irrelevant.

I've looked all through Virgin Active's website for the Rules/Terms & Conditions etc and I can find nothing that clarifies their changing room policy in this respect.

They do have a Complaints Policy, so I would complain via that medium.

It’s the equivalent of me changing sitting naked on the bench with my legs out wide at shoulder height facing the room. He could have turned around to change if he genuinely identified as a a woman AND there were no cubicles. He didn’t, because he isn’t. Tell that to management.

(& yes obviously male people shouldn’t use women’s changing rooms but management are more likely to understand the other angle, whcih is what’s going on here anyway - that he doesn’t really identify as a woman but what fun to be able to go into the women’s change rooms and flash your penis around)

I'd be interested in what would happen OP if you went to the front desk and said you were excluded from mixed sex changing rooms - obviously you were not going to disclose deeply personal and sensitive data on why - and where the inclusive provision for your changing was sited?

Hello I am currently going after David Lloyd Leisure for secretly allowing men into my and my daughters female single sex changing room (on account of following UK Active Trans guidance, written with Stonewall). I am sorry you have had to experience this situation. I would love to talk to you and perhaps offer some advice? My story is on Twitter @EmmaHardy196290

https://democracythree.org/help-emma-sue-david-lloyd

I think the onus is on the other party to prove they did not mean to alarm or distress.

Thank you for doing this. We all have to force these companies to be clear - from DL, Marks & Spencer, Virgin and the rest. If by women's changing rooms / showers they mean men as well then they must label facilities as mixed sex. That way women can take their business to Ballantyne gyms & all the other businesses that recognise that women & girls are entitled to privacy & safety from men who don't recognise boundaries.

There's a massive change afoot at the moment as the fall out from all this is increasingly evident. The sheer volume of sex offenders claiming to be women, rape & sexual assault in women's prisons, hospital wards & toilets. The populations are now aware and are furious.

I thought the acronyms, all the acronyms, were okay as long as no-one was targeted? Or is it broad generalisations that aren't permitted? So, is the answer be broad, but not too broad?

Women and girls clearly don’t want to see a naked penis in the changing room

are there cubicles that you can change in or is it all just one big open room?

This, the filthy perverted bastard.

I'd get this all over Twitter OP let's see them publicly try and defend it.

I use David Lloyd @HardyEM and I'm keeping a close eye on the situation.

I lived out in the Middle East for a few years for work, and the only thing I miss is the female only spas. They were amazing.

Indeed. I was just wondering how the gym would identify "genuine" TW. On what basis they'd challenge or exclude a man from using the female changing rooms if that's his stated preference.

In practice (and by definition) there's no filter. Women and girls are placed at the mercy of all men.

Unacceptable. Complain. If not satisfied leave. Make as many people aware as possuble- not just women

It's curious how for David Lloyd on the one hand biological sex isn't obvious, but on the other hand "gendered appearance" is so obvious as to require no explanation or exemplification.

Where does the gendering of appearance begin and end? Clothing? Most women have jeans and t-shirts in their wardrobe. And many don't wear makeup. Where's the male-female distinction?

At what point did they decide that changing rooms should be segregated on the basis of gendered appearance rather than biological sex? And what is it about "gendered appearance" that requires segregation? Is there a risk from seeing makeup and clothing?

It's a criminal offence with the presumption of innocence. It's up to the prosecution to prove intent beyond reasonable doubt.

Does it pass the reasonableness test in terms of whether it caused distress.

The OP states:
Before I'm accused of staring, it was hard to miss as the person was right where you come out of the showers.

Is it reasonable to see a dick in the female changing?
No.

Is it reasonable to expect at least discretion from those who use the facilities?
Yes

Is this flashing then?
Hard to argue it's not deliberate. The etiquette for women tends to be to stay as covered as possible as a rule even amongst females.

Report.

I left VA in 2020 after 14 years of membership. I asked if a male could identify as a woman and get their penis out in front of my daughters, head office confirmed they could. 4 memberships cancelled that day and I refused to pay any cancellation fees:

I think that was me. I’ve just responded on this thread too.

Whaaaat?

I don't believe I am reading this 😮

Whatever happened to 'womens' safe spaces ???

Yes, it was. I hope you don't mind me quoting you, but it was a very important post and I wasn't sure whether you were still on MN or whether you would see this thread.

I don’t mind at all, the more that know the better.

I was absolutely gutted. I had an amazing membership price which never increased. The safety of women and children was far more important to me though,

Learnt something new there today @Clymene - thanks!

You need to complain. The more people that complain rather than silently putting up with it the more likely we can effect change.