Starmer Radio 5 "A woman is an Adult female"

[fromorbit]

Starmer says "a woman is an adult female, let's clear that one up."

Here the words of reality - 1.27:40 Radio 5
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001p101

Not so difficult was it now was it. So where is apology to Rosie, Tonia and everyone in Labour Women's Declaration?

Let them attend conference.

Also lets hear what Scottish and Welsh Labour think. Explain if they differ and why.

I don't believe for one minute that Labour won't revert to full TWAW if they win the election.

He was told to ‘take the public with him’ and has admitted that’s his approach

It’s all part of that

More fool anyone who buys what he’s saying to do that

Starmer says "a woman is an adult female, let's clear that one up."

Please tell me he added the word human to that, otherwise it comes across as very dismissive. Of course I could just be getting oversensitive about the word woman but geeze, at least pretend to show some effort.

I agree about the pathetic hiding behind the word safe instead of biological sex. This man is not to be trusted and I can't see myself voting for Labour until Starmer is gone.

Absolutely key - as the gender debate seems to have changed the meaning of many words - "a woman is an adult female, let's clear that one up." - woman and female definitely need some clarification - who knows how he is using them.

To be honest, I would doubt his definition of 'up'.

He has already lied this morning about the Farrage thing. "Asked about the issue of “de-banking”, the Labour leader told the BBC... said he was “surprised to hear these stories of banks taking into account political views, if indeed they are”." That was this morning! when he knows damn fine the facts are no longer under dispute.

As others have said, if they lie about knowing about who a woman is then how can you trust them on anything. He was either lying then or now.

It’s a start but he and Labour have got a long way to go. This is far too weaselling still.

I’m all for people back-pedalling and many will as they realise they have been manipulated and exploited by the trans ideology and their enablers (let’s face it the pervasive nature of pathological relationship dynamics and misogyny predispose many of us to being sucked into this in some role or other), or as they realise their apathy or self-centredness has real consequences, but for votes he needs to show that he has found some integrity…. no more equivocation and appeasement. Discuss this boldly and at length and like a rational, psychologically aware adult please Starmer.

I don't object to back pedalling or changing your mind. I imagine most of us have done that - it's how we win.
But I do expect clarity. If this really is a change of direction then he needs to explain what's changed, and stop pretending this is what they've said all along. And I suggest he drop me the patronising 'let's clear this up' tone, which really does not encourage my trust,

He's a self-serving weasel, saying what he thinks will win him the election, nothing more, nothing less. He has absolutely no chance of rolling back the damage he's done by allowing this nonsense to take root in his party and things will still be worse for women than they already are (somehow!) under a Labour government. So no Kier, not remotely convinced, and even if he had done a complete u-turn (he hasn't) it's too deeply embedded in Labour now to fix in 18 months so they still won't be getting my vote.

never forget this was their position 5 minutes ago.

The issues are privacy, dignity and safety. Right now, Labour is trying to tell us they understand the concerns around safety. But unless they credibly show they have any sense of how deeply humiliating it has been to be told by Labour politicians that women’s dignity and privacy are unimportant, it’s a no from me. The idea that I am a women because of a ‘feminine gender identity’ is insulting. I’m not voting for a party that disrespects me. If Labour want my vote, they’d have to move away from a core belief of the TQ movement, the belief in a universal and innate gender identity. Not at all sure they’re there yet.

So did Rishi Sunak flounder at this simple definition. Do you disbelieve him now he's changed his mind?

Did he? I'm not denying it - I just don't remember. Have you got a link?

As for whether I disbelieve him, I tend to think that politicians are largely motivated by the desire to win votes rather than principle. So I think that as long as Sunak thinks that a pro-woman stance will win him votes, he'll stick to it.

I also think that both Sunak and Starmer know perfectly well what a woman is, even when they're stumbling over or evading the question.

Thanks a million to David from Enniskillen who rang in to say that gender recognition is not an important issue and only affects a small number of people. 🤬 It affects the entire female population, David, so thanks for letting us know that you don’t consider women’s rights and safety a priority.

It's just a change of tactic isn't it?

It's like they've realised that bludgeoning their way past women's boundaries with baseball bats isn't such a good look, so they've decided to deploy someone personable to engage us in earnest conversation at the front door while the looters break in through the back.

Yeah, I thought Grauniad sounded unlikely!

If the two biggest mainstream parties are beginning to fight over our votes then that is excellent, bring it on. But no way am I promising Labour my vote this easily. There could still be 18 months to go and all sides could still do a lot better.

Yep well put

"Safe spaces" annoy me so much. Piss off with that and call them single sex spaces. However, it seems to me that he's still going to let GRC men in, even if he eventually gets round to saying single sex spaces. We see you, Starmer.

'And I suggest he drop me the patronising 'let's clear this up' tone, which really does not encourage my trust'

Absolutely. And this is the man who was complaining 18 months ago that it was 'wrong' to say that only women can have a cervix 😡

Same as his pious nonsense about wanting to 'take the heat out of the debate' 🙄 well sorry Keir, but its slightly important stuff so forgive us for getting somewhat het up, but it's still not feminists who are threatening women with rape and having their careers trashed.

This is what happens when people piss around with the meanings of words. Discourse loses clarity and the pissers-about are trusted by no one. Serves them bloody right.

Politics is so tiresome these days.

The fact we know he has always known what a woman was, but chose to change that definition to 'win votes' and appear cool makes it even worse that he has now changed his definition as if nothing happened. He has essentially bullshitted twice.

He is a cowardly flake.

How can it be so hard as a politician to say what you actually believe, not what you think people want to hear. Integrity is basically all we ask for.

........but.....there are some women who aren't. 😆

He's such a revolutionary.

Yes they are gearing up and counting down to election time. I'm sure Labour, Stonewall and the other lobby organisations will come across as oh-so-utterly-reasonable from now on.

It isn't!

Not if by saying " the tide is turning" you mean a fundamental re-assessemnt and realisation of the inherent conflicts at the heart of the issue.

What is happening is an attempt at sleight of hand; re-arranging the same old cutlery just to look more pleasing.

It is going to take a couple of decades to truly turn the tide on this madness. It is too embedded to change over-night. and it is embedded in the Labour party too. Totally.

Meanwhile we need to keep pushing the window of consciousness and not letting up. Don't be fooled and don't be tricked into giving your consent to these weasle words.

It is a confidence trick.

He is a cowardly flake.

Yep

This. He's a fucking weasel. They should be ashamed of how women in the Labour Party have been treated.