17yr old DD thinks she is trans - challenging behaviour

[strugglingteenmum]

DD announced she was bi-sexual approx end of 2022, so around 15 yrs old. Went to her end of GCSE prom in a tuxedo. Great. Looked fab.

Started college, dyes hair pink. All good.

Cuts hair really short , still all good.

Now she's about to finish college.

Announced about 6 months ago that her pronouns were now they / them. If we get it wrong then v v upset. It's a struggle to get it right, but we try.

They don't bring up the subject much but JKR is the devils own and any discussion on trans rights / women's rights on the radio for example is met with awful anger.

Out of the blue 2 weeks ago, casually mentioned she might use her life's savings when it becomes hers to access at 18 for 'top surgery'. That scares the living s**t out of me. I've held it together and I gently spoke to her at the time to say that I don't agree with cutting off healthy parts of the body and I don't believe you can change sex. Happy for anyone to present / dress how they want etc but we have sexed bodies. Not discussed it since.

She bought a book and left it in my room on Sunday 'The Transgender Teen'. I sent her a text to say thank you; I'll read it and I know you're struggling and I love you .....

Fine. I'm treading on eggshells around her but benefit of the doubt for being a moody stroppy teenager as her final exams are v soon.

Now last night, totally out of character she has taken a library book out of the middle of a stack of books in my bedroom, 'Irreversible damage' and put it in the kitchen bin.

She's left the house already and I might not see them tonight as I'm out. Do I text and say 'why?' Or 'WTF - disposing of books instead of reading alternative opinions is not a good look'?

WWYD?

how not to take the bait fed to us by teens spoiling for a fight 😬

I agree. I’ve said from the start do nothing, she’s looking to instigate a row by pushing OP’s buttons. The advice to essentially educate or punish her DD is well meaning but with a rebellious teen it is only going to cause a row and push them further apart.

Her DD isn’t going to listen to any lecture on anything. I feel like some posters do not even have difficult teenagers and don’t realise any nudge or sharing of knowledge/wisdom to get them to go down one path is often met with instant rejection and a higher chance of them doing the opposite of what you think is best just to spite you and show they make their own decisions.

I feel that as parents we have to be our authentic selves. This doesn't mean being angry or authoritarian. Listening helps. As does asking questions. But we can express disagreement and/or bafflement. I think that we need to be honest and say where our own boundaries lie.

So accept being bullied by your almost adult daughter so as to avoid any conflict or possible fight with her? Sometimes I think it’s appropriate for someone to hear that their behaviour is unacceptable. I’d rather let her have her fight and keep my boundaries. At 17 she should have a better grasp on the world than to think she can take people’s belongings and bin them to bully them.

I just don't think you can cop out of being a parent. Yes, choose your battles carefully. And it maybe that initially that one's words and actions do not have any positive effect. But I think we owe it to our children to be honest and to show integrity, rather than lying and being cowardly.

I think there’s nothing you can do about this as anything you try to do will make her feel oppressed by you and further her resolve.
I would focus on aiming for autism assessment and possible diagnosis. If she is autistic, this will explain why she feels different to other people.

Not at all.

Parent the behaviour whilst ignoring the genderwoo as much as possible.

The post I was replying too, that I quoted, literally suggested ‘doing nothing’ toward educating or punishing the DD. I think people are acting like this is an 11 year old being a bit cheeky - it’s a young woman bullying other women in the home blatantly and obviously.

And the post your post was replying to was quoting MY post, a post that included a book suggestion re: parenting difficult teenagers.

No one is suggesting doing nothing at all, simply pointing out that strategies that work for younger children do not work on those that can just up and move out of the family home.

@Kanaloa where does the bullying come in?

Not sure I'd equate teenage strops and drama with bullying.

Stealing reading materials you disagree with and binning them while buying materials you do agree with. That’s trying to bully people.

And that is not normal ‘teenage strops’ from a 17 year old. She’ll presumably be off to uni very soon, she should be able to behave in a socially acceptable manner rather than thinking she can steal and bin other people’s reading material if they don’t align with her very specific world view.

@NicCageisnotNickCave

Okay, you think nobody is saying ‘do nothing.’ I think this poster, who I was replying to, has in fact said ‘I’ve said from the start to do nothing.’ I understood this sentence to mean that this poster was suggesting to do nothing.

I'm not sure that's true, her behaviour seems entirely consistent with the current accepted behaviour of most of the higher education sector when it comes to persecuting those who don't agree with you on trans issues.

@strugglingteenmum

I've created a thread signposting to a resource you may find helpful.

PITT: Parents with Inconvenient Truths about Trans www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4804899-pitt-parents-with-inconvenient-truths-about-trans

I don't think bullying means what it used to mean @Kanaloa .

It's a clumsy teenager way of communicating and yes we'd all like to hope our teens will "behave in a socially acceptable manner" but many are in distress, dealing with neurodiversity and identity issues.

I for one am glad I'm not having to deal with the world right now as a teenage girl. I guess it's about priorities but stressing about naughty behaviour rather then trying to keep a connection when they are struggling doesn't make sense to me.

As I mentioned upthread my kid is now doing much better. She's delaying medical treatment because she doesn't want to do it without our support/agreement. We worked bloody hard to maintain that relationship through some very challenging times and I'm so glad we did.

I’m another recommending NOT responding to provocation. Well I would be very firm about any actual violence or whatever. But the library book - I’d either ignore or just say

‘Look I’m not your enemy, I love you, I think you are wonderful, I know you are becoming your own person with your own decisions. That doesn’t change that I love you. I’m always, always going to be there for you, always. Let’s just not fall out or get too distant - please? I might be worried and have another perspective - but that’s kind of my job as a mum, to think longer term. But that isn’t the main point. The main thing is that I think you are fantastic and I’m really proud of X, Y. Fancy a pizza?’

OP - so sorry you and the other parents who have posted on the thread are going through this. To be honest, for me, the Non Binary thing is one that actually highlights the differences between the sexes rather than negates them. It always appears to be the majority of females who are destroying their bodies, with the historical guff it’s always the females who were NB’s and never the males and in sporting events like the intro of NB divisions in marathons, it’s always the females who lose out.

She’ll fit right in!

I could have written your post except my DD (DS as he now refers to himself) is now 18 and is very, very angry with me. Frequently calls me a TERF and sends me shite trans propaganda about how much happier he would be in the "right" body. Not a single mention of this until he was 16 and in the middle of lockdown, spending all his time on the fucking Internet.

2 weeks ago we had a neurological developmental assessment and he has been diagnosed ASC. The psychologist who I had the assessment with on my own agreed with me that there is a worrying trend in ASC girls identifying as trans men.

Please PM me if you would like. It is genuinely like a cult that DS has joined.

you could point her to this website positivelylesbian.org which shows how good it is to be a lesbian, rather than 'bisexual' or 'trans' . The positivelylesbian team is also in contact with a network of lesbian therapists, who can reassure girls and young women about their lesbian identity

Most of her information will be coming from the internet and I suspect the family wifi. Keep it the same but maybe look to see how you can put some restrictions on what she can access. There really should be a

Yes I know she can probably try and get access elsewhere but at least it is not so available. https://www.internetmatters.org/advice/14plus/ might help. I would perhaps look under the radicalisation section - it would be the same techniques and mindsets used.

She is almost an adult. If she doesn’t know that it’s unacceptable to ‘communicate’ by stealing and attempting to destroy/throw away other people’s belongings then that is extremely concerning. It is not just ‘clumsy communication.’

Just because someone is a teenager does not give them the right to ride roughshod over everyone else.

And I honestly think it’s creating a total monster to go crawling to a young adult who bins your belongings and say ‘oh please let’s not fall out, you’re so fantastic, shall we have pizza?’ It is not going to damage this young woman to hear ‘do not touch my things again, I don’t throw away your stuff so do not do it to me. I’m doing you a favour in telling you this because at uni/in the real world you could get into serious trouble for stealing.’

Some good advice on here

@Kanaloa of course you can tell them it's wrong I'm not saying respond by crawling to them FFS I just don't agree it's bullying.

I am in exactly same boat. Funny how all our stories are so similar. It is indeed like a cult. Are we allowed to say that now on MN?

I’m so sorry for everyone going through this. I have found support from Bayswater group very helpful.