The Stand Comedy Club statement on cancelling Jo Cherry

[WandaWomblesaurus]

twitter.com/StandComedyClub/status/1653017007921545221?s=20

The event was at the Freemasons Hall rather than the York place venue, so the Stand would need to recruit additional staff for that venue anyway as (I don't think) they use it year round.

I'm amazed at how many people are willing to argue cancelling Joanna Cherry's appearance doesn't amount to discrimination when lawyers who specialise in the field have said it does.

That's like the old excuse of 'if you have a black friend you can't be racist.'
It's entirely feasible to be found guilty of discrimination even if you like someone else with that protected characteristic or hosted their show.

Any venue where drink is taken, any pub or club, and any staff who've worked in such have faced rowdy clientele and potential flash points. It's a huge industry, these are not particularly special problems. Dealing with drink and lairy people is pretty run of the mill.

Oh yes, that old chestnut. But do the lesbians that they host have dicks?

Tell me Suggestions, do YOU think lesbians can have dicks?

Do you think that lesbians who think they don't should have the right to speak?

Also The Stand isn't a 'special' venue with specially trained staff ... their protocols are the same as every other comedy venue and every events space. Also, like every venue in Edinburgh, they take on lots of students during the Festival and the Fringe.
When I think of all the creatives who didn't get funding from the Scottish Govt and the Stand got £250k - to then act like two-bit misogynists. I hope this affects their bottom line.

🤷‍♂️ one of their main comperes is lesbian, and I would honestly say that in the region of 30-40%, if not more, of the women performers are lesbian or bisexual - their sexuality is a frequent topic of their jokes. (One of the reasons, as a lesbian, I enjoy going so much!)

Compared to the UK population in general lesbians are vastly over-represented...if anything straight females probably have a case for discrimination 😂. But they let on anyone during the red raw nights, so I don't think that would stand up either 😆.

None of that counts as a defence against discrimination.

Their staff are individually liable for their discrimination against a protected characteristic.
And the manager is liable for upholding their discriminatation.
Muslim staff couldn't refuse to serve Jews
or Bahai's and the management is responsible for telling them ; work or, get fired and get sued.

I'm pretty sure that if someone tried to bring a case that they were not allowed to perform because of their lesbian sexuality, The Stand could provide their extensive history of platforming lesbians and say that was certainly not a relevant factor.

Well in that case it's a good job that gender critical views are a protected belief.

if she hasn't , in fact, been deplatformed for being a lesbian of the type that only does dick, she holds gender critical beliefs which are also protected.

So she's either been deplatformed for BEING a lesbian or having lesbian wrong think.

Both are legally protected.

I mean christ on a bike, imagine being deplatformed for being the wrong kind of lesbian.

Is that what YOU are standing for Suggestions ? Do you think that Joanna Cherry is a bigot?

if she hasn't , in fact, been deplatformed for being a lesbian of the type that only does dick, she holds gender critical beliefs which are also protected.

Time for me to go to bed - I meant the type that doesn't do dick!

I'm so pissed off though at the way that words are meaningless because that's what the men want.

Apologies for incoherent arguments but you get the gist. Women matter, lesbians matter. Not including men in what we do is not a bigoted stance.

And off to bed!

But that doesn't seem to be the case.🤷‍♂️ The venue are saying that logistically they can not ensure adequate safety ...surely they have a duty regarding the safety of staff and customers? Surely the can be sued if they fail in this respect?

And surely their expenditure has to be realistic on this and they can't be expected to bankrupt themselves in an effort to get a show to go ahead.🤷‍♂️

This a venue that relied on goodwill handouts during Covid to stay afloat and to keep its circuit comedians (who generally have insecure incomes that didn't qualify for good government relief) going.

I don't think they have unlimited funds to dedicate to this and to get to the level of security they would want to avoid being sued for failing in that respect.

Well, you know what, on the subject of discrimination, I think I will take the word of the several very qualified and experienced legal bods who have already commented, over the many totally unqualified anonymous commenters.

You will see it your way @ssuggestionsplease1 . Others may have a different view.

Right so you are trying to provide a defence to discrimination by a supplier on the basis of a protected characteristic?

You know, right, that fringe employees during the festival tend to be on temporary contracts and don't tend to be able to control their employers to the extent you seem to think they can? I mean golly if employees had such control why have teacher and nurses held the govt to ransom over wages?

This employer cannot defend on the basis you seem to think it can, even if it could prove that the temporary staff it engages exercise such control.

Lack of defence funds are no defence to discrimination. How strange that you think it is?

Interesting that you have failed to answer whether you think that lesbians who don't do dick are the bigots. I think you do.

https://twitter.com/michaelpforan/status/1653193372268478464

'Nobody is entitled to use of a service or to buy goods whenever they want. But you are entitled not to be unlawfully discriminated against in the provision of goods and services.'

Being racist isn’t a PC

having a belief that human sex can’t be changed is

even if people find that offensive

They are saying “HSE” because they-at the behest of their bigoted staff- discriminated on the grounds of religious belief.

The Venue is fully in the wrong- go woke, go broke. Perhaps the Scottish Government will also pay the legal fees.

One of only 3 venues, out of 203 applications, to be given the full amount of £250,000 in fact.

Is it still run by Salt n Sauce Productions, owned by Tommy Sheppard, SNP MP?

Is their capacity not relevant though?

In other situations under the Equalities Act, for eg reasonable adjustments for disabilities can take into consideration the financial cost of making provision. So a small cafe that makes £5k a year might not be able to reasonably put in a lift for customers with mobility difficulties to access their venue, and that would be a defense for them that the cost was not viable for their operations.

Could The Stand not make a similar case that the cost of ensuring adequate safety is beyond their financial wherewithal, as I really don't think they are running large profits.

suggestionsplease1 · Today 22:17

I'm pretty sure that if someone tried to bring a case that they were not allowed to perform because of their lesbian sexuality, The Stand could provide their extensive history of platforming lesbians and say that was certainly not a relevant factor.

What you mean like Susie McCabe? Pals with the SNP inner circle? The same SNP circle who have bullied and demonised Joanna Cherry for her views at every turn? The same Susie McCabe who appeared on BBC Debate Night attacking gender critical women for their views?
Clearly she's the right kind of lesbian for the Stand and their staff. A tight wee group indeed.
The whole thing stinks and I think you know it!

Well it's not as though there are practical implications such as inadequate physical space for lesbians that don't do dick, is there?

Are you suggesting there is a cost to finding non bigoted staff? How strange?

Could The Stand not make a similar case that the cost of ensuring adequate safety is beyond their financial wherewithal, as I really don't think they are running large profits.

You'd think if they were concerned about financial ruin they'd have taken legal advice before a blatant act of discrimination.

Can you imagine a cafe refusing to serve a muslim saying that their Islamaphobic staff feared their safety so wouldn't let them in then worrying about having the legal fees to defend the impending claim?

In other situations under the Equalities Act, for eg reasonable adjustments for disabilities can take into consideration the financial cost of making provision. So a small cafe that makes £5k a year might not be able to reasonably put in a lift for customers with mobility difficulties to access their venue, and that would be a defense for them that the cost was not viable for their operations.

Reasonable adjustments only apply to disability discrimination claims not to homophobia or claims on the basis of a protected belief. HTH.