Page 9 | They’re not Terfs they are ‘Terds’ Senator Nick McKim announces in Tasmanian Parliament

Xoxoxoxoxoxox · 2023-03-22T09:01:53+00:00

I can’t believe the misogyny and hostility towards women. https://twitter.com/strangerous10/status/1638373051061633025?s=46&t=KoykWa-IFitZMrteWP2pKA

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:03

Jujuj · 22/03/2023 11:59

I know why they were there, was just trying to help you join the dots.

You might not like it but the views and rhetoric of KJK are appealing to neo nazis, and you can’t seem to see a problem with that.

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Exactly this

Jujuj · 22/03/2023 12:05

Hepwo · 22/03/2023 12:02

You are worried that we don't have a problem with being anti peado?

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Oh please, what they wrote on the signs is irrelevant. Anti peado is something most people are.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 22/03/2023 12:05

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:03

Exactly this

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Mmm

because some men like a fight women should be prevented from publicly stating their opinions

👍👍👍

seems legit

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:05

NotBadConsidering · 22/03/2023 12:02

That trans people/activists are “pedos” is a very high profile and common smear tactic used by some GC people online

I have never seen it as a smear tactic. The only time I’ve seen trans people/activists referred to as paedophiles is when they are actual paedophiles. Like Karen White, Katy Dolatowski etc. And the only time I’ve seen it brought up in discussion is to ask TRAs if we are meant to accept these males as women, how we are meant to tell these people from the nice people, and how we are meant to keep women and children safe from such predators if self ID exists.

Seriously?
You've never seen " OK groomer" thrown about as an insult /smear towards gay people and trans people?!
Its rampant.

suggestionsplease1 · 22/03/2023 12:06

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:03

Exactly this

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Absolutely.

This is clear as day to most people, just not on FWR it appears.

NotBadConsidering · 22/03/2023 12:06

Jujuj · 22/03/2023 11:59

I know why they were there, was just trying to help you join the dots.

You might not like it but the views and rhetoric of KJK are appealing to neo nazis, and you can’t seem to see a problem with that.

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Which specific views and which specific rhetoric of KJK are appealing to neo Nazis?

Hepwo · 22/03/2023 12:07

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CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:07

NotBadConsidering · 22/03/2023 12:06

Which specific views and which specific rhetoric of KJK are appealing to neo Nazis?

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Seriously?!
Try reading the thread.

HipTightOnions · 22/03/2023 12:07

Which specific views and which specific rhetoric of KJK are appealing to neo Nazis?

We've been asking this for a while now. Any chance of an answer? It would really help the discussion.

StandUpAgainstIt · 22/03/2023 12:08

"*What do women have to do to be able to meet and speak in public?

What views is it acceptable for women to hold?

What views do women have to publically denounce?

What happens when they HAVE denounced them and they still get accused of holding the same views as the people they've denounced?"*

Apologies @ArabellaScott it won't let me quote for some reason! I'm not sure if this was partly in response to my post hoping that women denounce Nazis - I am hoping that a visible condemnation and clear separation at the time would also help Jewish women feel safer and more able to attend.

I know full well even if women publicly denounce it would be edited out of clips, ignored in following social media debates etc etc, but the whole point of GC meetings is to give women a platform to speak publicly, and confronting anti semitism should be done publicly as well as privately, and we shouldnt be silenced. IYSWIM. Sorry I'm probably explaining myself very badly, but as a Jewish woman (albeit not practising but lost my family in the Holocaust) I feel very strongly that anti semitism should be denounced whenever and wherever it is displayed, not just for the obvious reasons that it's fucking abhorrent, but for the safety of Jews. It's so important.

Helleofabore · 22/03/2023 12:08

StandUpAgainstIt · 22/03/2023 11:43

I am as GC as they come but do actually take issue with this @Helleofabore

"What do you think the women should have done? Made comments over the PA that would inflame the Neo-nazis? Was there even any police line in front of the women, I didn't see it. So should the women turn on the nazis and denounce them with the police lines being elsewhere already struggling to cope with the glass being thrown at the nazis and the protestors rushing the police line to get to the nazis?"

Yes, I do think women should have publicly condemned and certainly distanced themselves actually, for at least two reasons. Firstly, the obvious reason that (as demonstrated on this thread) some some people actually do need this spelling out at the time, as they don't have the intelligence/common sense to realise proximity doesn't necessitate alignment so it's necessary from a "PR" point of view.

But secondly, IMO nazism should always always be called out. Of course I realise there is a risk involved in doing so, but we are literally already standing up to show our support for women which involves a risk, and Jewish women need even more support to join this and not stay away.

From a personal POV, my initial reaction was to have second thoughts about attending theAHF screening this Saturday. As a Jew, I personally, and obviously, would feel extremely at risk in the presence of Neo Nazis and I would like to think women attending would "have my back" and speak out and show their support.

Yes of course, it should be the police having our backs/protecting us, but as a women (and after my previous response from them about safeguarding women) I know not to expect this. I was having second thoughts as I sure as shit don't want to be in the presence of a group of Nazis, but I'm also not sure I would feel comfortable in a group of women who don't speak up to condemn them.

I realise however I would be a massive hypocrite to type that and then not actually attend myself as I'm scared plus I don't want to give in to the obvious tactic of scaring women away so we don't speak up. I also want to keep my eyes on the prize (so to speak) and not let this issue become a massive distraction.

Again, perhaps hypocritical to engage with it, after saying that, but I feel the voice of Jewish women should be heard on this matter. I will myself condemn and distance myself publicly and would like to think that the more women that could commit to this, the better it will be for Jewish women who might otherwise not attend, or would like support when attending.

Anyway, probably not very articulate as I'm tired (and extremely pissed off at the whole situation tbh) but these are just my thoughts FWIW. (Hopefully I absolutely understand why women don't want to take the personal risk of denouncing Nazism but would like to encourage and explain my POV as someone with female and Jewish skin in the game)

I hear you. But do you also know that Kellie Jay and the women have released statements denouncing them.

And can I ask then that you think that as soon as the women realised who those men were, that they should have denounced their presence? While not knowing whether there were others from the National Socialist Network, also known as the Neo-nazis and having seen that the police allowed them to be in the general area with them?

The police where fully focused on keeping back protestors who were rushing at the police line to attempt to break it. And if you listen to the video footage, they were also dealing with glass being thrown across the police line as well.

So, if I was a steward at that event, I would not support any one inflaming a group that was walking around without being solidly corralled by police.

"But secondly, IMO nazism should always always be called out. Of course I realise there is a risk involved in doing so, but we are literally already standing up to show our support for women which involves a risk, and Jewish women need even more support to join this and not stay away."

Or was denouncing them afterward, as they did, ok?

I have been standing hand in hand with women protecting other women speaking. I can tell you that I would never support someone calling out a group who have a violent history and tendency at the time when police attention is elsewhere.

I agree that public condemnation should be done. I am appalled and horrified by these men's presence and what they stand for. I am also horrified that someone in the police would have identified these men, they have a presence and one of the men is a policeman's son, and let them though into the general area.

Something failed here. They should never have been allowed to be anywhere near feminists, socialists or trans people. And yet, they were. Why?

HipTightOnions · 22/03/2023 12:09

Seriously?!
Try reading the thread.

I have, honest. No one has explained what views KJK and the nazis are supposed to share.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 22/03/2023 12:09

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:07

Seriously?!
Try reading the thread.

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I have read the thread and it’s not at all clear to me

a few bullet points backed up with (unedited) video links would be great

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:09

People are just taking the piss now, got to be - there can't be this much wilful blindness- it's like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand or something 😂

Helleofabore · 22/03/2023 12:10

StandUpAgainstIt · 22/03/2023 12:08

"*What do women have to do to be able to meet and speak in public?

What views is it acceptable for women to hold?

What views do women have to publically denounce?

What happens when they HAVE denounced them and they still get accused of holding the same views as the people they've denounced?"*

Apologies @ArabellaScott it won't let me quote for some reason! I'm not sure if this was partly in response to my post hoping that women denounce Nazis - I am hoping that a visible condemnation and clear separation at the time would also help Jewish women feel safer and more able to attend.

I know full well even if women publicly denounce it would be edited out of clips, ignored in following social media debates etc etc, but the whole point of GC meetings is to give women a platform to speak publicly, and confronting anti semitism should be done publicly as well as privately, and we shouldnt be silenced. IYSWIM. Sorry I'm probably explaining myself very badly, but as a Jewish woman (albeit not practising but lost my family in the Holocaust) I feel very strongly that anti semitism should be denounced whenever and wherever it is displayed, not just for the obvious reasons that it's fucking abhorrent, but for the safety of Jews. It's so important.

And it must be so very hard to have seen this happen.

Allthegoodnamesarechosen · 22/03/2023 12:10

Better than being an idiot.

Helleofabore · 22/03/2023 12:10

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:09

People are just taking the piss now, got to be - there can't be this much wilful blindness- it's like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand or something 😂

This is another tactic, projection.

suggestionsplease1 · 22/03/2023 12:10

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If there was a rally about lesbians, some people pro lesbian rights, some people anti lesbian rights, and some neo Nazis turned up with a sign saying 'DESTROY PEADO FREAKS' - would you consider this a problem or not?

HipTightOnions · 22/03/2023 12:11

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:09

People are just taking the piss now, got to be - there can't be this much wilful blindness- it's like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand or something 😂

No, this is just not true. You have just talked about "views" but have refused to say what you mean.

Taswegian · 22/03/2023 12:11

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:09

People are just taking the piss now, got to be - there can't be this much wilful blindness- it's like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand or something 😂

Are you the ostrich?

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:12

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 22/03/2023 12:09

I have read the thread and it’s not at all clear to me

a few bullet points backed up with (unedited) video links would be great

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Few bullet points, unedited video links - it's a forum, not a bloody school lesson with homework 😁
What's that saying people like using?
No do it yourself I'm not your support human 😁
Cos you know if I did all that, you'd be back with yeah but no but lol

PSNonsense · 22/03/2023 12:13

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:09

People are just taking the piss now, got to be - there can't be this much wilful blindness- it's like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand or something 😂

Oh the irony.

Helleofabore · 22/03/2023 12:14

Jujuj · 22/03/2023 11:59

I know why they were there, was just trying to help you join the dots.

You might not like it but the views and rhetoric of KJK are appealing to neo nazis, and you can’t seem to see a problem with that.

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I denounce the actions and have not connection with the National Socialist Network!

Please explain in detail what views and rhetoric of KJK are appealing to Neo nazis?

And please stop deflecting. If you cannot be specific, why should anyone believe your blanket statements?

NotBadConsidering · 22/03/2023 12:14

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:05

Seriously?
You've never seen " OK groomer" thrown about as an insult /smear towards gay people and trans people?!
Its rampant.

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I have seen “ok groomer” as a response to people who perpetuate the idea to young people and children that it’s possible to change sex, to people who tell them the world is trying to commit trans genocide, or people who think drag is appropriate for children, or people who want to teach the falsehoods of gender identity to young children in schools, or people who tell girls a mastectomy will improve their mental health, or people who publish standards of care containing a chapter on Eunuch identity written in collaboration with child sex abuse fetishists, or people who tell children to run away from their parents, or people who ask children to DM them on social media, or people who want to perform naked in front of children on stage and erode boundaries, or people who claim “love has no age” or people who defend workers for children’s charities who film themselves masturbating at work, and so on.

BernardBlacksMolluscs · 22/03/2023 12:14

CremeEggQueen · 22/03/2023 12:09

People are just taking the piss now, got to be - there can't be this much wilful blindness- it's like an ostrich sticking its head in the sand or something 😂

Maybe I’m a bit slow or distracted by the thought of crème eggs, but I think recent posts show I’m not alone in not understanding what you think KJK has done to encourage nazis to attend her events

it would be great if you could explain how you’ve reached this conclusion

you’re very sure you’re right, so I presume you’ve fully thought this through and examined the evidence?