Labour ‘must fix its trans stance to win the next election’ - party needs to clarify its policies to be closer to the public’s views on the debate

[IwantToRetire]

Labour is trying to position itself as the party of the centre-ground of British politics. It has identified middle-aged, suburban women as a target demographic to win over ahead of the general election.

Labour strategists have studied polling that shows how a gender gap in voting has emerged since 2010, whereby women are on average more likely to vote Labour.

But the polling notes that Labour’s advantage is “specifically among women under 50”, while the Tories lead in women over 50.

It comes as a network of Labour activists and staffers prepares to relaunch itself next month as a think tank that will produce monthly reports on how the party can appeal to its target voters.

The organisation, called Labour Together, aims to come up with a raft of policy recommendations that reposition the party as “socially to the Right and economically to the Left”.

www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2023/03/18/labour-must-fix-trans-stance-win-next-election/

It will be interesting to see if that happens. It would certainly make sense, which is probably why I'm doubtful that Labour will actually do it...

Oops, meant to add an archived copy: archive.ph/QNKdt

Starmer: “Gender recognition will not be one of the priorities of the incoming government.” www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4765149-starmer-gender-recognition-will-not-be-one-of-the-priorities-of-the-incoming-government

The article is already being discussed on the thread above.

Too late!
The party needs a root and branch change and that includes the leader!

BreadInCaptivity Its a different article. Making a different point.

I pulled out the bits I thought most interesting.

You could read the article and see if there are points you find interesting.

For instance:

I find it sad that Labour not only thinks, but claims to have surveys, that say it is only older women who care about women's sex based rights, and that age group of women are less likely to vote for them.

From that they have concluded they can still be politically "left" (ha ha) but need to be socially conservative ie they think and believe they have evidence that only older women who are socially conservative care about women's sex based rights.

It will take Starmer taking out full page ads in every national newspaper saying "Only women have a cervix and I'm sorry I ever said anything other than that which was clearly patent fucking batshit mental nonsense" before I even begin to believe him. however, having said the previous batshit mental nonsense, how can I take this fucking clown seriously ever again?

It's a different article to the thread title yes, but this article has been posted on there and has been discussed.

The organisation, called Labour Together, aims to come up with a raft of policy recommendations that reposition the party as “socially to the Right and economically to the Left”.

That is interesting. I think it shows how society has evolved over the last thirty years or more because I have always thought of myself as very liberal on social issues whilst fiscally conservative. In fact, I think that, historically, that is how the UK has traditionally been.

Hmmm. Food for thought.

I still consider myself socially liberal in that I don’t think we should legislate with regards to people’s private lives.

For me, the ‘Trans Issue’ is more about safeguarding. And safeguarding is essentially crime prevention. That said, safeguarding in sports (outside of the locker room) is probably more of a social issue.

Starmer, Sunick and the bloody other party leaders could walk about with t-shirts with "Only females have vagz" and "Lesbians don't have wullies" and I still wouldn't believe they mean it. Shower o' sh*tes the lot of them. We need something new. A proper democratic centre left party that centres women and girls and the poor/disadvantaged. Middle aged , middle class men with dresses are not generally vulnerable.

Well Labour are in in Wales and we have Eluned Morgan who thinks trans women are women as the head of Health and Education. Worryingly for women in Wales.

A labour policy, written down, means nothing. I’d want to hear all the main labour players - including Dodds, Nandy etc - say it out loud and clear that there’s a clash between womens rights and trans demands, that only women have a cervix, that no biological male should be in any sport or prison or changing room or rape crisis centre for women or in a single sex hospital ward. And then explain to journalists why they have changed their mind.
At that point I’ll start to believe they mean it. Until then, in the word of Ned Stark, “words are wind”😀

DifficultBloodyWoman For me, the ‘Trans Issue’ is more about safeguarding. And safeguarding is essentially crime prevention. That said, safeguarding in sports (outside of the locker room) is probably more of a social issue.

No it's still a safeguarding issue when you're faced with a competitor x times your size in contact sports.

I’m glad they have at least realised it’s going to be significant in the election. Always disappointed when anyone thinks trans demands is a socially left wing issue. I can’t think of any other rights area which is so focussed on individuals, or so dismissive of genuine community values (eg safeguarding for children and other vulnerable members of our society). #nodebate is hardly the hallmark of great socialist or liberal politics.

I’m also surprised that they think this is only an issue for middle-aged women. They need to have a closer look at the Scottish response to the GRR.
The only thing that keeps the trans movement going is that people are unwilling to voice their actual opinions because they want to be kind, so they prefer not to think about it until the consequences are staring them in the face (in a pair of fetching pink leggings!)

Yes, definitely a safety issue in contact sports such as rugby, but rightly or wrongly that doesn’t make it a crime.

DifficultBloodyWoman that depends upon the intent of the action.

I actually don't this this is what the majority are voting on right now so they don't need to make a change to win - so they won't

Maurice Glasman at the helm would be interesting. Nobody talks about Blue Labour

www.theguardian.com/books/2022/sep/25/maurice-glasman-blue-labour-book-interview

The problem, for Labour, is that they've burnt their bridges. That great meme, with all the batshit things Labour politicians have said on the subject, is freely available. And can't be rowed back from.

As JK Rowling says in the Witch Trials podcast, the trans movement isn't left wing, it's authoritarian. I cannot and will not vote for a party that supports it. Just like momentum, the Labour Party needs to have a root and branch overhaul before they're credible in my eyes again.

If they don't actually believe that women are rights hogging dinosaurs and that there is actually a conflict between the demands of TRAs and women, then they've been lying for political expediency. Which still makes them impossible to vote for.

Agree. The best they can hope for is people forget.

Hence the it’s not a priority waffle

They’re idiots on this. They’d have to clear out too many MPs anyway

This made me laugh like a drain!

Josh Simons said: that unlike during the Jeremy Corbyn era, Labour is no longer seen as a “patronising bunch of liberal Londoners who know nothing about people's lives”.

I don't understand the obsession with Labour having to get this right in order to win an election, when it's the past 13 years under tories that have got us where we are now.

And I don't support Labour as it currently stands under Starmer.

I agree that presenting this issue as left vs right is unhelpful, for reasons articulated by pp above. I also think that it’s deliberate on both sides.

This position is basically blue labour and labour red have been castigating them for years!
I also agree being unable to say someone’s sex affects many aspects of society not just changing rooms. It’s the one thing we can instantly tell about a stranger and then we risk assess from there. I’m on a tube carriage right now and I know the sex of every one on it. It’s 75% male. Now that doesn’t matter right now but in another situation it might and I would walk away.

So some SPAD has gone:

Ok guys. To win an election our survey says we have to pretend to be interested in x.

Yes, we know nothing about x, and we don't even agree with it, but this is where we fake it. Marketing. It's all about marketing.

And then once we're in power, we then do what we want cos they can't do anything for 5 years and manifestos aren't binding or anything like that.

What about representing the electorate and our voters?

Don't be silly, it's about doing to them what we know is good for them, not about democracy or anything.