Women's rights general conversations - Thread 4

[Kucinghitam]

Continuation of Thread 3.

There is so much excellent information and so many active discussions on FWR that I wondered if it would be useful to have a thread to sort of "cross-fertilise" between them - airing little thoughts or vignettes that wouldn't themselves merit their own thread, to highlight other posts/threads of particular interest or to point to notable developments on fast-moving threads so that casual observers know where to look.

(For example, "the X thread has meandered onto a fascinating discussion of Y" or "Poster P's amazing analysis on thread Z might have relevance to the scenario in thread W" or "Has anybody noticed this recurring theme that keeps coming up??" or even "Random bloke asked me to smile while I was choosing onions, grr"- that sort of thing).

[SinnerBoy]

CrossPurposes · Today 12:56

Man, this person is making it hard for me to enjoy The Great Pottery Throwdown

He's not very bright, is he? He doesn't even know the difference between populace and populous, the thicko.

[Winterborne74]

No idea what you did. Isn’t twitter a bit random sometimes? The tweet is just posting her Council election result. Nowhere near winning, but the highest polling independent candidate and not that far behind Labour and the Greens (neither of whom did well).

[Winterborne74]

doesn't even know the difference between populace and populous, the thicko.

Dutch apparently, so minor errors of English are forgivable I think. And as someone who makes frequent homophone errors myself I’m not going to point the finger especially as Mumsnet’s lack of an edit button means I can’t return to hide the evidence.

[MavisMcMinty]

They sound very similar when I say them anyway.

[Boiledbeetle]

@Winterborne74

doesn't even know the difference between populace and populous, the thicko.

Dutch apparently, so minor errors of English are forgivable I think. And as someone who makes frequent homophone errors myself I’m not going to point the finger especially as Mumsnet’s lack of an edit button means I can’t return to hide the evidence.

Goes off to Google both.....

Populace: the people living in a particular country or area

Populous: having a large population; densely populated

Huh! Can see me getting them completely arse about tit😳

[SinnerBoy]

Winterborne74 · Today 14:02

Dutch apparently, so minor errors of English are forgivable I think.

I'm not in a forgiving mood about some git calling me a Nazi.

[nepeta]

This is one of those trans activists who identifies as a woman but never, never, never with women.

[Winterborne74]

@SinnerBoy

Winterborne74 · Today 14:02

Dutch apparently, so minor errors of English are forgivable I think.

I'm not in a forgiving mood about some git calling me a Nazi.

Fair dos!

[beastlyslumber]

@Boiledbeetle

Thank you ladies. I promise to do nothing at all for at least 24 48 hours.

Fixed that for you.

💐🍫 🍷(last one ...later much later)

What would really aid my recovery is if you sent me all the Tunnocks caramels.

[GhostOrchid]

Is it me, or is Rose virtually edited out of Throwdown these days? I seem to remember when Rich was kiln monkey he would do occasional little explanations to camera but you never hear from Rose and barely see them. I wonder if being a strident TRA is causing a few issues for the production team. I can’t see Rose making the journey from kiln monkey to judge that Rich did.

[Boiledbeetle]

@beastlyslumber

What would really aid my recovery is if you sent me all the Tunnocks caramels.

Welll...as you're unwell, and the photographic evidence did show I'd eaten my own bodyweight in them, fine, You can have the three out of date ones someone sent me.

[CryptoFascistMadameCholet]

Anyone else had a suspicious link via pm?

I did not click it and the username has no post history.

[MavisMcMinty]

Although I’ve recorded all of Pottery Throwdown I’ve only watched the first episode so far - who’s supposed to be the TRA, Rose or Rich?

[Boiledbeetle]

@CryptoFascistMadameCholet

Anyone else had a suspicious link via pm?

I did not click it and the username has no post history.

Not inn mine. Aren't you the lucky one!!!!! Who have you annoyed today?

[GhostOrchid]

@MavisMcMinty

Although I’ve recorded all of Pottery Throwdown I’ve only watched the first episode so far - who’s supposed to be the TRA, Rose or Rich?

Rose! Rose is a v vocal and quite aggressive TRA on Twitter. It’s obviously never mentioned on the programme itself.

[MavisMcMinty]

Ah, thanks @GhostOrchid .

[Britinme]

Brilliant Germaine Greer interview quoted on Twitter:

twitter.com/agingwhitegay/status/1634464766096965634?s=61&t=65x5z6UgOhX0PNOnBNWL7w

[beastlyslumber]

That interview clip is so brilliant!

[Tricyrtis2022]

This is interesting, a North Korean defector's take on wokeness in the US: nypost.com/2023/02/11/north-korea-defector-yeonmi-park-slams-woke-us-ideology/

“They were in Manhattan, living in the freest country you can imagine, and they’re saying they’re oppressed? It doesn’t even compute,” Yeonmi Park told The Post of students at her alma mater, Columbia University. “I was sold for $200 as a sex slave in the 21st century under the same sky. And they say they’re oppressed because people can’t follow their pronouns they invent every day?”

[Winterborne74]

I feel a bit conflicted about that article. Yes, a sense of perspective is important and the point about the identification of specific groups as an oppressor class who can be demonised and intimidated is interesting. Also the social conditioning and ostracism of those who transgress. BUT…it’s also a conservative critique. Many things are worse elsewhere for most people. Doesn’t mean that people can’t wish for something better. I hate my job, even though I know it’s not the Siberian salt mines. So for me it’s probably better to focus on whether the non-use of preferred pronouns is harmful or not, rather than if it’s as great a harm as sex trafficking in North Korea, because very few harms meet that test, and even very few people for whom pronouns are important would make that claim.

[Tricyrtis2022]

Seeing a culture unsubjectively when one is immersed in that system is nigh on impossible, so I found it interesting to see the take from someone who came from a very different culture. The fact that she can draw clear parallels between the the culture of the US and NK should interest all of us.

[beastlyslumber]

I love Yeonmi Park. Her story is incredible.

And I agree with her. Getting upset about pronouns is utterly ridiculous. Comparing it to being sold into sex slavery is obviously from Yeonmi Park's context. But you could easily compare it to something from your own experience and it is equally ridiculous. Because it just is ridiculous. Pretty much everything in the world is worse than someone using the wrong pronouns.

[IcakethereforeIam]

I'm pretty certain there were people whose major take from the Isla Bryson debacle was horror that he was misgendered. However, I'm going to hesitate to label them tras because it's getting so difficult to tell them from parody accounts.

[Winterborne74]

I’m sure you’re right about some, but there’s still a lot of people who consider deliberate misgendering an attack on someone’s dignity, but who don’t consider it as bad as war, famine, pestilence and plague, or indeed rape. It’s easy to point to ridiculous, perspective-free people on both sides to mischaracterise the argument. Making remarks about people’s personal appearance isn’t as bad as those things either, but there is still a common cultural understanding that it isn’t a nice thing to do. So I think Park’s critique will play well to those who already agree with her, but may not be persuasive to those who just want to (as they see it) treat everyone with respect.

[BinturongsSmellOfPopcorn]

I think the important point of her article wasn't the relative badness of what is being done in the 2 countries, which is obviously not comparable, but that the same tools are being used - and the same attitudes leveraged - to do it.