I don't agree with the ad-hominem comments on Sam Smith, India Willoughby et al.

[TERFCat]

Basically as the title says.

I think gender ideology can be robustly criticized without the need for comments on any individual's appearance or dress sense.

If you go to Twitter, a lot of the GC accounts I follow are currently laughing at Sam Smith for his latest magazine cover. I don't like SS, but I do think that they is free to dress how they want. SS shouldn't be body shamed either as they has a perfectly normal body.

Same goes for India. Don't like them, but I don't think their clothes etc should be mocked.

D) feel rather embarrassed for them that once again they have been sneaking a peak through my Windows and copied my outfit! Again!

You might have to meet them outside the pub as they probably wouldn't fit through the door 😂

I rather like men with a little extra chub. I don't think he's objectively unattractive.

Sam Smith gets the piss taken about his clothing because of the way he goes on about his clothes making him a woman, and about his weight because of the way he talks about his fat making him a woman.

If someone was trying to make half these arguments to me face to face, I'd have to have a photo of Sam Smith in that ridiculous inflatable suit and hold it up every time they tried to argue about me saying he's dressed like a twat. I'd just slowly bring it out of my pocket and hold it in front of their face every time they started talking about it being unkind to Sam.

There was something else recently, another awards ceremony, where some other tube was wearing an outfit covered in ridiculous spikes. He also looked like a total twat.

Sure. But if it's just the clothes, why primarily on the s&g board? Because of SS's gender identity, whatever you think of it.

It's not just SS though. I've seen loads of people say "i wear trousers and my clothes don't mean I'm a man" but also things like "how can this TW say they're a woman when they wear masculine clothes/ their face isn't very feminine".

I can't think of many other celebs who get their appearance dissected on S&G so it's disingenuous to say it's all about the outfits.

There are now shit loads of trans celebs so if Sam Smith is the only one who gets they’s ‘appearance dissected’ surely it’s far more likely to be a response to Sam Smith’s idiosyncratic fashion sense than it is Sam Smith’s body (which isn’t exactly an usual shape for a post-lockdown male from the British Isles?)

The thing that FWR most often focus on re: Sam Smith is Sam Smith’s ongoing torture of the English language (‘Fisherthem’) and that Sam Smith’s pouting about the Brit Awards categories likely cost Florence and the Machine a Best Female trophy.

So have you said anything at all on your Twitter account? Or you just came to tell us people on Twitter are being mean?

I mean not sure we can do anything about the cesspit that is Twitter, I dont even have an account.

Completely agree. It's just so forced and fake. Look at Sam's face in the black blow up outfit. Looks so uncomfortable. No joy, or any emotion in the eyes.
It's just another mask to hide behind.

Whist I think Harry Styles' dress sense is also part of his 'act' rather than his natural sense of style, he is clearly very comfortable in his own skin, and has always had a don't give a shit what people think attitude.

To be Gender Critical is to be critical of gender - gender being sex stereotypes such as ‘girls wear dresses’.

And TW aren’t women because they aren’t adult human females, not because of what they wear or how ‘feminine’ their faces are or are not.

Seems like either you or the comments you’ve read have gotten hold of the wrong end of the stick?

Not that I ever comment on Smith, on social media or on here, as I also never comment on any other individual's appearance. Nonetheless, there's a line for me and certain people cross it and in my view, kink-related displays belong in the bedroom or very specialist magazines not in mainstream ones. I resent being made to take part in his fetish and I avoid anything to do with him now (used to be a fan a long time ago). I can't listen to his music anymore without remembering these displays and it puts me off his songs completely.

Also, I do not expect opponents of self-id policies and laws to behave any differently when it comes to proponents of self-id - if you're the type to enjoy ridiculing people's wardrobe choices, by all means enjoy ridiculing his. If you don't, then don't. I don't believe we have to be better than them, to go high when they go low etc. I just don't think that gets us anywhere.

And if a person is as desperate for attention as Smith is, then any comment is better than none. As far as such people are concerned, as long as there's a whole thread on his sartorial choices and people's reaction to them, it's mission accomplished.

Which is why I prefer to ignore Smith completely and as for Willoughby, I pay zero attention, none of the insults hurled or attacks register with me at all, because I think that's a very unwell individual who probably needs friends or family to step in to help. ASAP.

Bah! Typo. Obvs that should’ve read:

’which isn’t exactly an unusual shape for a post-lockdown male from the British Isles’

Yep. It’s here because of non-binary. Apparently that makes it ok to mock size, build and celebrity publicity projects. Hopefully we’ll see all the vitriol for the other weird fashion/style/bodies that don’t dare to believe something different. If we all believed everything we had been told there would still be a lot of people living in fear, hiding and denial. Can you hear yourselves?

Is this a drive by tone policing in progress? 😂

The pesky hobitses.

Well thats hardly fair

the OP started the thread to complain about people taking the mick, its not like it was started by anyone actually taking the mick

And primarily to complain about people taking the mick on twitter!

Can we hear ourselves? Yeah.

Why is it here? God knows

But as it is anyone who wears👇deserves the piss being taken out of them.

If we all believed everything we had been told there would still be a lot of people living in fear, hiding and denial. Can you hear yourselves?

What are you wittering on about? Everyone on earth is "non binary" because binary is for numbers and computers, not people.

No I'll continue to take the piss, thanks.

We don't have to be deferential to men being ridiculous.

What Tinsel said. Some of these people could do with being laughed at more, not less.

I don't think I was very clear, sorry, but you're essentially arguing what I was arguing.

I have indeed seen people on here reference someone's appearance when trying to argue that they are not a man or not a woman. Usually to do with whether they "pass".
Personally I don't think passing or otherwise changes whether someone is male or female but it's often dragged in - it's a derail.

. Someone should tell Sam Smith.

Yup; women are being mean! (to men)
Oh the humanity! Make it stop!

My dear fellow women, take it from a middle-aged mean Lesbian;
it's fcking liberating & fun to
be as nasty, witty & btchy as you like!