Trans and losing my mind...

[bluepetergeneration]

Posting here in good faith. And I'll leave that at that.

I'm a TS. I was born male. I don't normally post on mumsnet but I started using it as I have a 1 year old DD. I won't tell my whole life story, that would be self indulgent, so I'll just say what I came here to say.

I'm sick to death of my community. I'm sick of the misogyny. I'm under no illusion that I'm a woman or ever will be. I transitioned when I was very young so I pass, but I still now only use female bathrooms when there's no other option (such as a disabled bathroom- I would feel unsafe in the mens). What I have is a disorder- it was crippling- and now I live my life so that I can actually enjoy it and not feel 'wrong'.

The idea of self-ID sickens me, and I'm tired of having to have the same conversations over and over again with other trans people who accuse me of being some kind of self hating transsexual just because I care about the safety of women. I also care about the safety of my kid. Partly because I'm worried she'll be in danger because I'm trans, and also because I don't want her to get caught up in all these weird messages that being trans isn't a disorder around dysphoria (which it is).

I guess I'm posting this to say that in this fight, trans people with genuine dysphoria who aren't delusional will be standing right beside you.

Also a plea to not paint all of us with the same brush. You can fight for the rights of trans people (like me, I should be able to present female and not get attacked, and when I was in my late teens and still looked a bit male I did get attacked) and also be gender critical

The old me would have been scared, asking you what words you would find acceptable, what tone would be ok. I’d have stopped posting in fear.

The new me says bollocks to that. I will say what I want, when I want and in whatever tone I want. No one ripped into the OP. That’s your way of shutting women down. We are allowed to point out to males that their behaviour is misogynistic and we don’t need to mind our tone whilst doing so.

ah... I don't think 'vile' was directed at me. Quite a few other things other than the 'odd' and language issue that I haven't bothered with, but not vile.

That's how I've honestly experienced today. I am fucking raw!

Maybe that needs to be known. Maybe it needs to be considered. Maybe it's an issue. This is a feminist thread.

Yay! Fearless little chicken!

The thing is, there are certain situations where I will police my own tone. But this situation is not one of them. It's a pointless waste of time.

It will be, and is, exploited every single time.

Is anybody going to acknowledge the effect on trans widows of being told to appease men like our abusers or am I talking to myself?

Hello, gender-critical people, I'm back again, I just have one question

What do you think the penalty should be for trans woman who enters a female-only space if a full ban was brought into effect

Um @scratchedbymycat im glad you agree emotional manipulation is bullshit. Please can you stop doing it now..

Vile was to me.

Although the most insulting part was that being accused of "casually" posting, when I had carefully rephrased and retyped, trying to communicate how I felt. What a waste of time for posts that don't get read.

Hello misogynistic person. If they refused to leave, then escorted out and barred from the premises.

I doubt it. No-one wants to acknowledge your existence tbh, do they?

Tinsel I absolutely acknowledge the affect on trans widows of people allowing males into female spaces.

Your point about if your ex found a niche on this board before you, it would exclude you is absolutely on point.

I read your posts. I understood the effort it took to write them.

Crikey!

I totally acknowledge this @TinselAngel . It’s part of the emotional manipulation. It’s horrendous and in my view just as bad as other types of verbal abuse. I notice all these posters saying “be kind” and “compromise” never seem to realise the effect this will have on others, who have been told this to their utter detriment 💐.

Gawd, I don't suppose you get voted in as a representative of the community very much, do you?

Why would they need any kind of penalty? If the rule is you don't violate women's boundaries, then don't do it.

Your point about if your ex found a niche on this board before you, it would exclude you is absolutely on point.

This.

I was appreciating a moment of respite from the tension Cat.

I'm following with interest to see if the 'storming' might settle back into some 'norming' (group dynamic thing)

(Whilst also working out my own interpretation of what's being discussed here)

So that I don't keep myself too outside of this I'll give my thoughts:

Outside of all the 'tone'/personal stuff (which I'll definitely be staying out of!), I too, as a personality trait (mediator type), tend towards wanting to solve issues by persuasion/empathy and moving people towards understanding (your impulse with the OP)- so I very much relate to where you are coming from on this.
I do think that with some, even most people, in some situations, this is the ideal approach.

In recent years though, I've also come to recognise more and more, that with some people this just isn't achievable, and in those cases, I need to just put in boundaries. (So here, I relate to other posters)

I still don't always know which applies when. And as I said before, I really have experienced 'mind-tennis' about this in this thread- because it's actually playing out my own inner conflicts on this.
So, that's a big part of why I'm following so intently.

Regards the conflict between posters (which maybe for me, gets in the way of exploring this- although is possibly necessary to as some of my biggest intimate arguments have taught me):

I remember an earlier heated thread about immigration/male violence where I similarly witnessed long time posters who were 'close' (in FWR terms) at loggerheads and thrashing things out. It also got very personal, and tense.

Then there was this beautiful moment of humour (a silly typo or something) that just broke the tension and brought things back to constructive discussion with understanding. It was that moment, in that thread that I actually fell in love with Mumsnet FWR.

Maybe I'm just playing out a childhood family reconciliation fantasy though!

Sorry that was meant to quote @scratchedbymycat recent ref to me

Are you saying that unless there is a penalty, that male people will not respect the needs of the female people who use those spaces?

Is that what you mean to say?

Or is this some kind of 'gotcha' that you didn't think through?

Is self respect and respect of others missing from a group of people that they will not find a solution that doesn't harm women? Because, I think we have seen male people who DO respect those spaces and they do it without fearing a 'penalty'.

So, should we or shouldn't we take your post to mean that some male people will simply never respect female people's needs? Because that needs then to be shouted to everyone.

As a general lurker, I'm just delurking to say that I see and acknowledge your position @TinselAngel You have no responsibility whatsoever to be conciliatory or modulate your tone towards men like those who have abused you and women like you.

What I am saying, and I must not be being clear, is that trans widows have experienced in their own homes, exactly the behaviour that the plopping transexuals show on here. We give you the benefit of our experience and explain how these coercive techniques are now being practiced on the wider public by the TRAs, and of the futility of attempting to compromise, but we are ignored and told we're too hardline and need to be nicer to the TRAs and to compromise!

It's not sympathy we need, it's an appreciation of our wisdom and experience.

@Bathhy
I'd suggest a fine for the owner of the premises.

But regarding the behaviour of males in general, basically what @Datunsaid - observe the social contract and stay out of your own accord.

I have learned a lot about coercive techniques from reading your posts Tinsel. There is always something valuable to take out of them.

Tinsel I always find your postal insightful and thought provoking.

Postal? Posts.