Re: Starmer

[EpicChaos]

I hope that starmer, having possibly wetted his finger and stuck it in the air to see which way the wind is blowing,following Sturgeons resignation, doesn't think, that if he starts to be a bit GC, that women will be keen to vote for him!
The man has already planted his flag and just like Sturgeon, he chose to plant it on the north face of the Eiger. More fool him! imo.

I've already seen the colours that he wears and they aren't green, purple and white!
Women don't owe him a damned thing!

That's not a question of Corbyn expelling them, it's a question of the party bureaucracy apply the disciplinary process properly (for once!) Probably the only clear, specific thing in the Labour party rulebook is that you cannot be a member of the party and support a candidate from an opposing party against it. It's automatic expulsion, no questions asked. That's why Alastair Campbell was out so quickly and decisively when he advocated voting lib dem.

Corbyn did indeed seek to build upon the party's tradition as a broad church, along with strengthening the democratic acountability of its rules and processes to allow all voices a fair say. Starmer on the other hand has stuck his middle finger up to rule and process and just autocratically booted out much of the membership for no reason other than that they disagree with him. Anyone who thinks that's the kind of prime minister we need when the Tories have already brought our sick and beaten democracy to the very edge of fascism, might want to think again.

Starmer will be too afraid to stand against them whatever he personally believes

This is not a man ready to run the country.
Even bigger things than this will happen when running a country (this is huge to me but I realise not everyone thinks the same) will he be too afraid when these things happen? Will he be able to control his party? I have doubts.

Not outright, but those who had to install panic alarms and have bodyguards for protection couldn't really safely stay. That's a form of expulsion - 'constructive dismissal' perhaps.

Oh FFS what an offensive load of made up propaganda twaddle.

Did you know that Boris Johnson personally ate my kitten?

Still some Corbynites around then. Amazing! 😂

Mmm! So he hasn’t actually made a public announcement promoting self id.

I think the Conservative plan to use gender politics as an election time bomb will blow up in their faces.

Empowermenomore · Yesterday 00:59
well, nothing about standing up to Rosie Duffield bullying, nothing about the Cass report, no sign of meeting WPUK or any such women group, but already making his bed with Stonewall Chairman who is switching parties to get closer to steering the Labour Party to his fire...

not voting until ‘safe spaces’ are defined as single sex spaces according to biological sex not gender or grc

Given what you say here is so true, and with no end in sight, please would anyone who has not done so already look at the petitions board to sign and share the Sex -Matters petition about updating the Equality Act to make clear the characteristic ‘ sex ‘ is biological, and can’t be trumped by a GRC?

Please ignore claims made in the Government’s response so far that the wording around same sex spaces is fine as it is. It is not, because of complications arising from GRCs which could lead to discrimination litigation, especially since Lady Haldane’s ruling which has not been appealed.

This petition needs more signatures if it is to reach 100,000 in time for the cut-off and prompt a Parliamentary debate.

Then there are those of us who have just had enough of being blackmailed by the purveyors of a corrupt and unrepresentative electoral system to vote for a party we think are shit just because they say "but we're not as shit as them >>>".

If someone wants to institute PR and give me a real, meaningful choice I'll glady use it. Keir Starmer is of course in the perfect position to do exactly that, as he's likely to win the next election no matter what he does, but will likely need the support of smaller parties to govern. But to do that he'd have to value democracy.

In the meantime, the fact that we live under an effectively dictatorial system where two parties both promote the economic interests of the establishment and ensure there is no mechanism to challenge it is not my fault. I didn't ask for it, or for the absurd charade of First Past The Post voting in single member constituencies that sustains its illusion of democratic validity.

If the Tories win the next election that will be because of the people who voted Tory. Anybody who didn't vote for them has not given their assent to be governed by them, and if they don't vote at all that might just be because they don't give their assent to the whole corrupt system that pretends to seek it. That assent can't be presumed; it's up to people themselves do decide what's a genuine and fair way for them to be governed.

You are quite correct no one has to respond to anyone. Sometimes though when that occurs people might draw the conclusion that the person not responding is doing so because they don't have a coherrent argument to make.

I wonder what Starmer will do about the tweet linked to in this pist here on the FWR board.

"An Equalities Officer for the Labour party has posted a tweet based on PP style slogans. But it says:

gender critical
adult human murderers

See twitter.com/JournalistJill/status/1626541064919064576

Sometimes….

sometimes it might be because a poster has wound the shit out of someone on previous threads even though they had coherent arguments which were roundly ignored by the poster doing the winding up

sometimes that happens as well

Current polling gives Labour a 250 seat majority at the next election, I doubt smaller parties like the Tories (who some analysts suggest will not be the Official opposition) will get much of a look in.

who some analysts suggest will not be the Official opposition

that would certainly raise a smile….or a snigger

Tories got nearly 33k in 2019, labour got just under 9k

really can’t see hat turning round where i live

I doubt smaller parties like the Tories (who some analysts suggest will not be the Official opposition)

I just can't imagine that. A substantial minority of the country would vote Tory no matter who the candidate was.

Boris Johnson won an election as Prime Minister; Boris Johnson!

It has well within the margin of error in the polling for some time, but there are a significant number of don't know voters out there, and how you deal with that in the analysis makes a difference.

Still would be fun, to have the SNP as the offical opposition and given I keep hearing on there boards how awful Sturgeon was, I assume thier fortunes are about to soar.

Have a look at the predictor at
www.electoralcalculus.co.uk/prediction_main.html

It may surprise you. The Tory MP in the consituency I live secured over 50% of the votes last time. There is an 84% chance of a Labour MP next time. A Labour MP in a deeply conservative rural shire constituency...

I live in a Kind Yuppie area :-)

Actually I do live in a key seat.

It is one that Labour need to win. Win the seat, win the election basically.

Kind Yuppie and Strong Right here, apparently going to vote Labour.

I think this may be why there is so much anti-Starmer rhetoric.

I'm confused. That poll predicts 450 Labour seats and 112 Tory ones in a 650 seat parliament.

That is of course staggering, but how does it equate to a majority of 250? It's a majority of 125 above the 50% level required to govern alone, or a majority of 338 above the next largest party. I can't get 250 from anywhere.

Someone who understands these things please explain...

Number of Labour seats -(sum of the seat of all the other parties) = majority.

I might actually prefer a comfortable Labour majority to an inconclusive result. It would certainly boost his position within the party and who knows, might even give him the confidence to relocate his backbone.

If they ended up with no overall majority, or even just a small one, he'd have to run around scrabbling together deals with some absolute loons, and he'd be badly wounded with the vultures gathering. Lord knows, I ran out of patience with Starmer some time ago but some of his senior colleagues scare me even more.

Whether that will l influence my vote I haven't yet decided.

Deals with absolute loons like Jacob Rees- Mogg and Michael Fabricant?

Number of Labour seats -(sum of the seat of all the other parties) = majority.

Makes sense, thanks! Momentary maths blockage duly unblocked.

Just noticed your posts Rufus - thank you

Must admit, for all I hate Starmer the idea of the Tories being destroyed that comprehensively is very beguiling, and could in theory usher in a much needed level of change in how people think about politics. Problem is they'd be destroyed by someone who equally represents all the same establishment interests as they do, who would only have achieved such an electoral consensus and would only be allowed to govern by not challenging those interests. Starmer has already signalled lack of appetite for reform of anything that really matters (neoliberalism; protest and civil liberties; the electoral system). So we'd end up in basically the same situation, just with leaders that aren't called The Conservative Party.

But really I think this is getting a bit far fetched. Yes, Labour will almost certainly be the largest party. Beyond that? Who knows. 15 months is a REALLY long time in politics. People say stuff to polling agencies, particularly mid-term when a goverment is unpopular, that doesn't translate into action. And I think people are underestimating the 30-40% of the electorate who WILL. NEVER. VOTE. ANYTHING. BUT. CONSERVATIVE. - who have never and will never think politically about anything, but just stick their X in the box like automatons.