Let Women SPeak - Australia & NZ tour

[ZombieMumEB]

I am so excited that this is coming to Australia - I will hopefully be attending.

Anyone else?

First, it's denounce, then because she's already done that it's now denounce in writing.
What next do you think? Interpretive dance? Semaphore?

Your hyperbole is not needed and it strikes me as facetious too.

A written statement - a good old-fashioned media statement - would have been enough.

no problem 🙂

I’m trying to understand the antisemitism I increasingly see and I would hate to fail to take it seriously

but I’m a pedant and Nazi has a very specific meaning. The clothes someone wears or the stupid hand gestures they make don’t make them Nazis. People can be insensitive dick heads. It’s allowed

I’m also pretty ornery and if I feel that someone is trying to make me denounce people (you didn’t do this), I need more than ‘everyone knows’, or ‘really I shouldn’t have to tell you’

for the avoidance of doubt, I find the actions and views of these men repellent

“Further footage showing Senator Thorpe rushing towards @ theposieparker.”

https://mobile.twitter.com/StandingforXX/status/1638739955529785347

but I’m a pedant and Nazi has a very specific meaning. The clothes someone wears or the stupid hand gestures they make don’t make them Nazis. People can be insensitive dick heads. It’s allowed

As I said earlier, when this happened I did some googling and there is quite a bit out there about the rise of nn in Australia, New Zealand (demonstrated in the Christchurch shooting) and in Europe generally - especially in the previous Eastern Bloc nations. It's real, serious and nothing to joke about.

Can I just ask, for all those that think KJK is courting the far-right/Nazis...
What do you think her endgame is here?

Do you even understand words?

AlisonDonut · Today 10:18

I have no idea what the difference between a real nazi and lads playing dress up is. That's one for you to go in to nazi forums and query.

One thing I do know about real nazis is...they do not turn up at women's rights events to support women. As if. Catch yourself on.

She did an interview. Which you have stated is not enough in your opinion. and another poster has discredited the presenter. I am sure you understand the issue here. She has focused on a quick interview with someone because the free to air TV channels have portrayed her as 'anti-trans' and I doubt, knowing them, they would give her air time.

So, if she is to do a written, it needs to be done right. There is no one to do it for her and she is flying between states, and I can assure you her timetable is hectic with those flights having done it last year it can take you hours to get your flight with cancellations, it might have improved, but friends have told me it is still dire. Then she has had issues with her entrance into NZ. I understand she had security pull out of Hobart because of that Melbourne event (I don't know the details or if this is true)

You are usually a very fair person, so I know that you will wait.

But I also point out where would she find time to do it, get it checked by as many feminists as she can, and then post it at this time. And then deal with the inevitable resulting queries, abuse, and misinterpretations.

Ok.

I suggest you read nilsmouse posts together.

Is she downplaying this event?

Or is she answering a bad faith question in general?

landOFconfusion · Yesterday

I would have thought that any sane person wanting to distance themself from neo-nazis would take care to avoid using symbols adopted by neo-nazis.

I would have thought that any sane person would avoid piling lie upon lie upon lie, with a larding of dissimulation, sprinkled with the Hundreds and Thousands of Untruth, if they wanted to be taken seriously.

How many times?

She's denounced them on numerous occasions, why do you pretend otherwise, when people post links with quotes of her actual words?

But I also point out where would she find time to do it, get it checked by as many feminists as she can, and then post it at this time. And then deal with the inevitable resulting queries, abuse, and misinterpretations.

In her shoes, I'd be so mortified that I've had prioritised making a short and simple statement (maybe that AI bot that's so popular could have helped)... But seriously, a simple "The men dressed in black who gave the Nazi salute at my rally on <date> in Melbourne, Australia were not there on my invitation and I personally unequivocally denounce neo nazism and everything it stands for" would be a great start.

Understood and noted. I was trying to go back to find and read those links, so it’s helpful to know you posted them, thanks

I'm personally quite convinced there are some very bad people around including people who are attracted to the ideals espoused by the historical Nazi party (racial purity, nationalism, women doing kuche kirche kinder etc etc). These people definitely hate women who don't do what they're told by men and are very much not interested in Letting Women Speak.

It was not my intention to minimise the danger posed by violent criminals organising under some kind of nazi nostalgia. These guys can get in the jail where they belong, and that's up to the police and CPS to deal with. So I'm sorry if my posts were upsetting to read. Please accept my apology.

The police were entirely too relaxed about that - they stood around with their thumbs in their stab vests doing nothing while these young men (potentially violent criminals known to the police, I don't know) wandered around looking menacing with facial coverings.

I still love this

Australian politics is a bit different to ours in some ways isn’t it?

@beastlyslumber

Can't you read? Have you got some kind of mental block (brainwashing?) that stops you being able to understand simple words?

None of the above, the Zealots don't care about truth, they believe that any lie is justified, in order to further their aims.

Understood and noted. I was trying to go back to find and read those links, so it’s helpful to know you posted them, thanks

Thank you. I think I only posted one link. To be honest, I find the whole issue of the rise of nn in Europe and its diaspora very, very convoluted and confusing. I'm not sure that posting links would help but I do know that it is real.

I'll wait for it. But if it was me I'd have made it a priority - even a "Those men were not here on my invitation and I personally unequivocally denounce neo nazism and everything it stands for" would have been a start.

Of course if it was you or I, the entire event and campaign wouldn't have happened, because we're not remotely capable of doing what she does.

If I were you, I'd have a little more humility. But I guess saying you'll "wait for it" is a start.

Anyway, there was this in the NZ Herald, but maybe it didn't have enough of the magic words?

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/immigration-new-zealand-reviews-entry-for-uk-anti-trans-activist-kellie-jay-keen-minshull/FQNQMWZQ7NFKVMWIJ4RUUELZJ4/

But when pressed on the presence of people at her events giving Nazi salutes, Keen-Minshall said: “They’re absolutely not associated with me whatsoever.“ I absolutely abhor anything to do with Nazis. It’s preposterous they even exist in 2023.”

I'm aware that they have some ideosynchratic ways to play field sports using the round and egg-shaped balls. I'm unfamiliar with the particular code that Senator Thorpe was playing on this occasion. I think she would have done better wearing cleats though, if she was really aiming to win.

If I were you, I'd have a little more humility.

Yes, men often tell me this.

It's been apparent to me for about 10 years and seems to be a reaction to a much more authoritarian brand of left wing politics.

I think there will always be a small number of people with abhorrent ideas but if you disenfranchise people with genuine concerns about certain issues by branding them as bigoted and evil then they will gravitate towards people who don't make those judgements about them. Lots of people say things I find offensive and would rather not hear but I know it is counterproductive to silence them.

Until we return to a situation where difficult conversations can be had in a respectful way then I fear it will get far worse. I'm only surprised that things are developing in that direction as slowly as they are. If our politicians do not step up and stop being cowards we will reach a tipping point from which we will not return without significant disruption and harm.

But when pressed on the presence of people at her events giving Nazi salutes, Keen-Minshall said: “They’re absolutely not associated with me whatsoever.“I absolutely abhor anything to do with Nazis. It’s preposterous they even exist in 2023.”

Perfect! Unfortunately, I don't read the NZ Herald so it escaped me. I'll pop over and have a look at her Twitter but a nice, clear, pinned tweet stating this would be very helpful.

Come on.

You wanted to hear a clear statement for her - you got it.

You wanted to see it in writing - you got it.

Now you want a pinned tweet.....

Never enough.

It's been apparent to me for about 10 years and seems to be a reaction to a much more authoritarian brand of left wing politics.

Yes, I've been aware of it since I stumbled across a rally in Frankfurt over a decade ago (very hastily cleaned up by the local police) ... in Europe I think that the causes are much deeper and more entrenched in history.

It was me finding some humour in it YetAnotherSpartacus and I'm sorry if I upset you. Not at all my intention.

It's because bad faith actors have relentlessly found spurious connections to KJK in order to denigrate her. It's quite true that there's often a fag paper between TRA tactics and the politically pure (for want of a better phrase).

My questions are: is there really a connection between those neo nazis and someone high up on the police? why did they police usher them through? And how did they get there without a permit?

This neo nazism is, apparently, completely home grown. And well known. And yet their media seems to be leveraging it to blame a visiting women's group, and the politicians are going along with it!

Nor expecting you to answer yet, just general musing.