Complications from trans surgery!

[Ihatedonuts]

I know it's a daily mail article but I can't help thinking. We only ever hear positive stories but the figures tell us this. I really hope the men and woman are getting the support they need from these complications. 🥺

Half of trans surgery patients suffer pain, sexual issues years later mol.im/a/11629421 via dailym.ai/android

They’re not conforming to the stereotypes associated with their sex though. Like many girls have done for years - short hair, jeans, t shirts, boots or trainers. Only now there’s more pressure on children to conform, and if they don’t there’s pressure on them to be trans.
They’re adhering to opposite sex stereotypes because for some reason, right now, these stereotypes and the identities and constant stream of genders and labels are more important, like most teenage phases, but this time adults are indulging them and agreeing that they’re right - who does that to a teen? Roll your eyes, let them get on with it and it’ll pass.

Is there one story out there of a transitioning child that doesn’t rely on gender stereotypes? I’ve yet to see one.

No shit

Mermaids, who actively trans gay, autistic and non conforming kids?

Who advocate for sterilising these kids and taking them out of the gene pool?

There's a word for that if I remember correctly.

Which is commendable.

But how will informed consent be possible if part of the information, say the risks and deleterious effects of "gender affirming" medication and surgery, is not given, because of the threat of professional repercussions and legal sanctions to the practitioner under Conversion Therapy legislation?

Are you willing to campaign to ensure that this will not happen before the legislation is passed? (In which case, you should really start now, because there isn't much time). And what will you do if it is passed without any safeguards of the sort?

Indeed. The weird thing is that trans people rely on a distinction in order to define 'trans' but then treat the two as interchangeable when it suits them.

In general people assume the word 'female' also means 'feminine', (and male, masculine). If we could make more effort to separate the two concepts, that might be a start.

I remember reading many years ago that F2M surgery can shorten your life by 10 years. I don't know if that is still the case, but it struck me then that people who go through with surgery must really believe they need it, to accept such a risk.

I'm not saying every single person who thinks they are trans is right and should be encouraged to have surgery, but I do think there are a few people who will never be comfortable in their own skin unless they have it, and as long as they are adults and have not been pushed into the decision in any way, I say live and let live. Let's face it, neither a post-op F2M nor a post-op M2F is as much of a threat to women as some people who claim to be pre-op M2F might occasionally be. I know an older post-op transwoman who is just getting on with her life, not hurting anybody, and doing a lot of good work for the local community (not specifically to do with trans issues). If a mutual friend hadn't told me, I would never have even realised she was trans. She doesn't deserve to be sneered at.

If I knew of someone who had been through the surgery, believing it was going to be the answer to a lifetime of unhappiness, and then suffered awful complications, I think I would have nothing but sympathy for them.

I remember reading many years ago that F2M surgery can shorten your life by 10 years. I don't know if that is still the case, but it struck me then that people who go through with surgery must really believe they need it, to accept such a risk

I think the overall health consequences are worse than that but I think a big issue here is that when they are taking these decisions, a lot of people are in serious emotional distress. That is not a good state of mind to be making informed decisions on life changing surgery.

More and more detransitioners are reporting that they felt pushed into surgery or that they were so set on surgery being the answer to their distress that they would do anything but then they find that it was not the answer and that their distress is still there or worse.

The other aspect to bear in mind is that many people deciding to have surgery have their moods and decision making altered by cross sex hormones. Taking oestrogen in males and testosterone in females can have specific mood enhancing effects on the brain which entrenches the idea that they are doing the right thing and definitely’ trans.

Equally, it can also have a depressive effect which, once on the path of medication, surgery seems like the only solution left.

We need far more research on outcomes - current research is showing that medical transition does not improve the mental health outcomes for many patients and some countries are stoping treatment in children and young people.

I remember reading many years ago that F2M surgery can shorten your life by 10 years. I don't know if that is still the case, but it struck me then that people who go through with surgery must really believe they need it, to accept such a risk

I'm not convinced that all surgical patients are aware of this. Still less am I convinced that all applicants are fully able to comprehend what that means in terms of quality of life before death.

There are a surprising amount of people who think that if "x shortens your lifespan by ten years", that means you will still enjoy a good standard of health for the same number of years as someone who does not do/use x. They think it means they will simply drop dead at age 79 instead of 89, and avoid needing to live in a care home. They don't realise that the issues that lead to you dying ten years younger also mean needing help with personal care 10 years younger too.

Ten years might be optimistic, too. Back in 2013, a 44 year old in Belgium was approved for assisted death because of complications from a phalloplasty (procedure to create an artificial penis). The patient had had the procedure only a year before. That's far more than ten years of lifespan lost.

Huffington Post

Yes, I do put my money where my mouth is as it were. My understanding, as things stand, is that it will not outlaw providing the risks of both medication and surgery.

What are YOU doing outside of posting on an internet forum.

These are the words of Scott Newgent, a female transitioner who also had a phalloplasty.

During my own transition, I had seven surgeries. I also had a massive pulmonary embolism, a helicopter life-flight ride, an emergency ambulance ride, a stress-induced heart attack, sepsis, a 17-month recurring infection due to using the wrong skin during a (failed) phalloplasty, 16 rounds of antibiotics, three weeks of daily IV antibiotics, the loss of all my hair, (only partially successful) arm reconstructive surgery, permanent lung and heart damage, a cut bladder, insomnia-induced hallucinations—oh and frequent loss of consciousness due to pain from the hair on the inside of my urethra. All this led to a form of PTSD that made me a prisoner in my apartment for a year. Between me and my insurance company, medical expenses exceeded $900,000.

During these 17 months of agony, I couldn’t get a urologist to help me. They didn’t feel comfortable taking me on as a patient—since the phalloplasty, like much of the transition process, is experimental. “Could you go back to the original surgeon?” they suggested.

Quillette

If you can't access Quillette, try archive.is/JfWVF

Emailing and writing to MPs, signing petitions, contributing to relevant crowdfunders, as it happens.

The words "my understanding" and "as things stand" don't exactly suggest any cast-iron guarantee.

I remember reading many years ago that F2M surgery can shorten your life by 10 years. I don't know if that is still the case, but it struck me then that people who go through with surgery must really believe they need it, to accept such a risk.

I can well believe that - considering that actual male men, whose bodies and hormones etc. are naturally supposed to be there - still die quite a few years younger than women on average. How much more of an impact on lifespan will those male hormones have on somebody who was never meant to have them in the first place?

This study is sad reading, but very pertinent.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3043071/

'Persons with transsexualism, after sex reassignment, have considerably higher risks for mortality, suicidal behaviour, and psychiatric morbidity than the general population. Our findings suggest that sex reassignment, although alleviating gender dysphoria, may not suffice as treatment for transsexualism, and should inspire improved psychiatric and somatic care after sex reassignment for this patient group.'

We need to stop thinking about male and female hormones - women have testosterone, too. It's the levels that are dangerous.

True. I found it very odd that the sporting bodies set a testosterone limit for male born trans people participating in women’s sport that is still several times higher then the normal level for women at 5 nmols/l

If a woman had that level of testosterone in her blood she is likely to be tested for doping.

Absolutely, same here. They are supposed to warn you of any potential risks but the reality is very different.

@JusteanBiscuits that is great, I think the area of informed consent needs a tonne more research!! A few minutes on that Reddit de trans sub throws up so many like this: www.reddit.com/r/detrans/comments/t267iu/myconsentwasnotinformed/

@AlisonDonut yes it's shocking isn't it. An affirmation-first approach is basically the opposite of what this therapy is supposed to do - an open ended exploration of what and why the person feels the way they do. Affirmation-first predetermines the only acceptable outcome from the start of the process. It's similar to gay conversion "therapy" where the only accepted outcome is the patient desisting from being gay.

Possibly this has been posted already. But, grim.

thepostmillennial.com/canada-opens-its-first-vaginoplasty-post-op-clinic-to-deal-with-high-rate-of-complications

We need to stop thinking about male and female hormones - women have testosterone, too. It's the levels that are dangerous.

Yes, good point; but I've been taking this as a given. Just like men have 'breasts' as well, but completely different from women's (and usually very much smaller).

I used to run phase 3 clinical trials.
Every trial goes through the ethics committee and every protocol includes a copy of the Nuremberg code. The process of informed consent is rigorous and involves a lot of work.
I cannot for the life of me see how any trials of gender reassignment surgery have even got through any correct processes/ethics committees/proceeded to post trial treatments.
I would have thought the process would be as strict in USA as anywhere due to the level of litigation generally.
Surely there will be lots of law suits eventually?

I think they are starting. There is a mass action brewing against the Tavistock as well I think.

I can’t bear to think how awful it is - even if only some of the medically transitioned people come to regret what they’ve done, the impact on their lives will be forever.

I would have thought the process would be as strict in USA as anywhere due to the level of litigation generally.

You'd think right?

I am led to believe that the person who Yeets Teets [takes the breasts off of teenage girls] doesn't have malpractice insurance so if she is sued she will just go bankrupt. I expect her to have put all her money into some offshore account. It's like looking at a cartel operation.

Let's face it, neither a post-op F2M nor a post-op M2F is as much of a threat to women as some people who claim to be pre-op M2F might occasionally be

Sadly not true - males whose penis doesn't work, either from surgery or medication, use objects to sexually assault instead. I'm wracking my brains trying to think of the recentish case where a transwoman attacked the owner of a clothes shop catering to transwomen, I can't find the attackers name. Male bodied people don't lose their greater physical strength when they transition, hence the issues with transwomen in women's sports.

Pre-op (or no-intention-to-have-an-op) males who identify as trans appear to commit sexual offences at six times the rate of non trans identifying males, if current prisons stats are correct. So not really an 'occasional' threat either.