National Autistic Society - yikes

[NotPurpleAnymore]

There's a lot of discussion about autistic people saying they identify as trans.

Here is an article currently being promoted on Twitter by the NAS twitter.com/Autism/status/1588508665308667905?t=RsbiDJqsNfDKGq9u0fCwig&s=19

To my mind, it seems to be celebrating top surgery and conflating this woman's late autism diagnosis with her decision that she is non binary.

Lots of talk about 'being seen'.

Does this make anyone else feel very uncomfortable? I think the unquestioning nature of the article makes it irresponsible.

I don't understand why, in an autism assessment, they wanted them to play with toys like tractors and look at magazines about fishing? The implication is that they were wanting them to play with 'boy' things? Why would that be? And then they mentioned being perceived as a girl all their life?

They had top surgery. I'm guessing again that most females who identify as non binary remove their breasts because they don't believe they should have them as they are 'signifiers' of being a woman and they refuse to believe that they are a woman. Is it about being less 'female-percieved' or being more 'male-percieved'. I don't understand how autism factors in to their non-binary identity.

I always thought that identifying as non-binary was a more 'rational' response to having gender dysphoria or incongruence. You don't feel 'right' but you accept that you can't 'be' another sex so you accept this middle ground that wants people to never refer to your sex at all and for you to never think in those terms either. It is such a big ask of society.

I wonder if many female-born, non-binary people take testosterone or have phallopasty. Or male-born non-binaries take oestrogen and nullify or have vaginoplasties? The body-modification aspects confuse me.

As for feeling uncomfortable about the NAS campaign? I guess they are saying that autistic people come in all shapes and sizes. It doesn't seem to be making any comment on how gender dysphoria and autism interact or impact each other - it just seems to want to celebrate it. I can't articulate whether that's a good or bad thing.

The National Autistic Society makes me feel uncomfortable full stop. They are more interested in self preservation than protecting autistic people. They had a funding campaign that exploited autistic people's vulnerabilities. I posted about it on MN, under another user name, as their response to my complaint was appauling. They then thought is was appropriate to join up and post on my thread, revealing the content of emails I had sent them. Thankfully Mumsnetters stepped up and handed them their arses on a plate.

I don't understand why, in an autism assessment, they wanted them to play with toys like tractors and look at magazines about fishing?

i don’t recognise this as part of the two assessments I was present for, for family. It sounds like a lie.

The NAS is next to useless. I reached out a few times and they offer sweet f a to ND people wanting direct support or assistance. I got sent a flyer thing. I would never give them money or time. It’s a shame they’ve taken this approach here. It reduces their credibility further.

I gave up on the Scottish version due to the woke identity crap that they are peddling not just the gender bollocks (which they are actively promoting) but self identifying as autistic and how empowering it is to have Asd. When I pointed out that very few people who are autistic find it anything other than difficult at best and at worst we'll I needn't go further. I was told my negativity was what was holding both my ds and I back not the ASD (from some twat who self id as autistic and doesn't need a diagnosis because he knows himself better than the professionals) this person is due to start working with the national autism society (oh he also claims that you can trans the asd away). I'm not going to name this person (don't want to be deleted) but if you dig a bit I'm sure that you can find him.
Basically expect lots more of this bs as he believes that autism should be included under the lgbtq++++++ baner too

Basically expect lots more of this bs as he believes that autism should be included under the lgbtq++++++ baner too

what in the world? And also about the self id 🙀
if you are well functioning enough to self id you do not Get to take support away from those who are not!

but how, HOW? Can autism ever be thought of as being an lgbt-alphabetsoup-andpluses ?

Identity politics has a lot of garbled gibberish to answer for. Mostly it is just silly. But this here and twaw is actively harmful to people.

it worries me because ent autistic son is ent through a phase at 4 of saying he wanted to be a girl with lots of tears etc. I know realise this was just part of his PDA profile. Has he been around “woke “ teachers or wherever I would worry this would have been encouraged. He now never ever mentions it.

Sorry he went through a phase

The online autism community is a totally toxic and to be avoided. It is dictatorial, polices language ferociously, bullying and steeped in identity politics. Autism is an identity. The loud voices are all adult diagnosed, if they have been diagnosed at all. Diagnosis is not necessary, you can simply identify as autistic. The vitriol aimed at autistic/people with autism who disagree with them is shocking. Parents are the lowest of the low. The modus operandi is also very similar to TRAs to the extent that I suspect they are many of the same people. People with profound autism are the equivalent of detransitioners - to be dissociated from.

Basically expect lots more of this bs as he believes that autism should be included under the lgbtq++++++ baner too

Forced teaming again.

The vitriol aimed at autistic/people with autism who disagree with them is shocking. Parents are the lowest of the low. The modus operandi is also very similar to TRAs to the extent that I suspect they are many of the same people.

Yes this is true. It’s bizarre. Many are self diagnosed. My DD & DH are autistic and have got zero time for any of this crap or the ‘autistic community’ which is full of NT’s actually.

@Happywhenitrains7 yes my DD who has Asperger’s ( or whatever the new word is now! ) is very gender non conforming and I am so thankful she isn’t growing up in these times, she’s a young adult now

This isn't just "nonbinary" NAS are promoting double mastectomy. Christ on a bike.

I'm OK with people chuntering on about nonbinary if it makes them happy, and I would have liked to know more about the psychological assessment and the apparent sexism in it.... but I draw the line at telling everyone how much you're looking forward to cutting your tits off. NAS shouldn't be promoting that.

I’ve noticed more and more that autism is pushed as an identity. I have 3 teens diagnosed when they were children. The oldest is at uni and absolutely hates any kind of identity politics. He said that the university autistic society were promoting their own ‘flag’ and were encouraging people to wear badges on ‘autism pride’ day. He said it felt very similar to LGBT+++ pride in the way it was being promoted. He doesn’t want people to know he is on the spectrum (although some have guessed) and hates having attention drawn to autism in this way as if it is somehow fashionable.

What worries me about the NAS is that by celebrating being ‘non-binary’ and linking it positively with an ASD diagnosis, then it kind of affirms the huge rise in autistic female teens who believe they are transgender and almost discourages any type of challenge to this ideology. As a female who received a late autism diagnosis myself, I am extremely concerned about the rhetoric spun by the NAS.

They're just horrific.

The connection is very concerning. How do NAS explain the high rate of autistic teenagers being seen at the Tavistock for gender dysphoria? Do they not see the causality?

They do, but it is spun as a positive thing that autistic trans people can be themselves, that being autistic means you are more likely to be trans.

"Meet Lex. You can watch their story on our website to hear about the importance of non-binary autistic representation, their journey to late diagnosis, and their love of nature"

Clearly Lex loves some bits of nature more than others. Poor Lex. Kind of classic really - all the reasons you'd expect someone with autism to be uncomfortable with their gender identity and choose a maximally damaging solution.

NAS really do need a policy of not promoting self harm. Even renamed "non-binary autistic representation".

There's nothing I can say about this that won't get me banned and/or called ableist. I'm not btw but this is two areas converging that have similar ways of dealing with dissenting voices (the No Debate path, not the violent threats one).

I'd be surprised if this thread remains up for long. Without a shadow of a doubt MNHQ will be getting contacted about it. More than once...

I got the impression that Lex has a formal ASC diagnosis, not just self diagnosed.

Az Hakeem has some interesting (and to me plausible) things to say about the connection between autism and transition. He reckons those autistic people with very poor "theory of mind" and a very stereotyped version of gender do best after transition, because they really believe they have changed all the important things and they also believe other people think they have changed so long as other people use the right pronouns and the right surface behaviour. It doesn't occur to them that people think something different underneath. But an autistic person with better theory of mind is fucked because they will realise that most people don't really think they're the other sex. And then autistic rage. Aspects of autism would account for the need to control how people around them think, the uncompromising need to be affirmed as their chosen sex. That control thing and trying to make everyone believe exactly what you believe is very familiar to me.

What a bloody mess.

Have you a link to this thread ,that’s shocking ,

I’m confused
I thought everyone was aware of the possibility of autistic folks confusing their autism for trans issues ,the feeling of not fitting in and feeling like being an alien in their body ,and putting that feeling mistakenly down to trans when it was down to autism .
i thought that was generally accepted now ,and doctors working with trans folk were on the look out for this

The autism online community can be terrifying, as a pp said there is a total hatred for parents .The gender identity issue worries me , as I have a daughter with autism, she loves comfy clothes and gaming , she is also really struggling with puberty , I’m sure if someone told her she could become a boy , she would be delighted! I also feel the NAS completely ignore women and girls with autism and learning difficulties.

I thought everyone was aware of the possibility of autistic folks confusing their autism for trans issues ,the feeling of not fitting in and feeling like being an alien in their body ,and putting that feeling mistakenly down to trans when it was down to autism .

Some people think it's the other way round

What ,crazy talk

What ,crazy talk

You'd think, eh? But it's a published academic paper. The authors raise it based on one case. They don't claim it applies to everyone with ASC and gender dysphoria (be thankful for small mercies) But they are sure about that case.